GAMMA Clones


(Rek Seven) #1

I would like CCP to add a new clone that allows players to use all the skills they have trained but does not allow any additional training while in Gamma clone state.

Personally i don’t really have many more skills i want to train and i’m not interested in sp farming, so i think there should be a way for me to pay a reduced cost just to use all the skills i have already payed for with my time an money. 250 plex would be reasonable for a gamma clone.

Does anyone else feel the same?


(Black Pedro) #2

Are you that lazy? You need to spend 5 minutes each month to extract your skills from the last month and sell them for essentially the equivalent of PLEX and play for free.

Sure, I guess CCP could sell you access $5 a month so you don’t have to bother with selling your SP. However, they make closer to $15/month with skill extractors so I don’t see them wanting to do so from a financial point of view.


(Do Little) #3

You can sell a months supply of skillpoints (3.8 injectors) to buy orders for 2.8 billion ISK. The extractors will cost 1.4 billion. As Black Pedro mentioned, it takes about 5 minutes to fill the extractors.

While you may not consider this a good use of your time, I believe most players in a situation where their character is fully trained, will prefer to sell the skillpoints for enough to cover 90% of their subscription cost rather than purchase a half price subscription with no training. It’s unlikely CCP can justify the cost of implementing the feature for the handful of players who might use it.


(Cade Windstalker) #4

It’s called sub your account and and train a different character.

CCP has basically no incentive to offer something like this. The demand is low and the price difference compared to the existing offerings is miniscule.

If you’re paying for your account with in-game money you get a better discount than CCP would ever offer by training, extracting the SP, and selling it.


(Daichi Yamato) #5

What’s in it for ccp?


(Sonya Corvinus) #6

If $10/month is too expensive for something that gives you dozens of hours of entertainment, you really shouldn’t be wasting time playing video games.


(yellow parasol) #7

It’s not tenbux per month, it’s 15. You can’t even pay ten bucks a month. There’s an option to pay a yearly subscription at a reduced price, which makes it look like you’re paying ten per month, but it doesn’t cost ten per month, it costs the whole year, upfront. Marketing… :roll_eyes:

Anyways, i fully agree with the rest.


(Sonya Corvinus) #8

It’s $10.95/mo for a year subscription (in the US at least, I don’t know how to check prices for other countries), not $10, so I was wrong about that, but you don’t have to pay $15.

Regardless, if $15/mo is too expensive for a person, stop playing video games and spend that time studying and looking for a better job.


(yellow parasol) #9

i agree on the last part completely. Still, you make the intended mistake (not by you, by marketting) of saying that it’s ten or eleven bucks a month, which isn’t true. it’s the whole sum for a year, upfront. You’re falling for a marketting trick and i suggest thinking about it, so you stop spreading it. :slight_smile:

You don’t ever pay long time contracts monthly, you pay it all upfront. the actual saving of money only happens when the contract is over, or reaches its end and even then there’s a good chance you didn’t actually save anything.

It’s a trick:

  • Lots of people will pay, but eventually stop using a service completely, or use it only irregularly, without getting money back for months skipped. A win for the company.

  • Lots of people spread the trick, as in “it’s less per month if you pay for a year”, which only becomes true at the end of the year, because the person paid the whole sum, upfront, which is a huge expense and not actually cheaper at all. A win for the company, because the tricked make others fall for it.

  • The likelihood of everyone who pays a yearly subscription to use the service every day is close to zero and calculated into the price. As soon as the “days of not using the service” exceed the saving, the company wins yet again.

I’m not trying to attack you. Just trying to make you aware that this “it’s cheaper per month if you commit for a lont-time” is nothing but a fallacy. Marketting. In the vast majority of cases the company wins, else such options wouldn’t even exist.

thank you for your attention.


(Sonya Corvinus) #10

That’s well and good, but my point still stands if you put the price point at $15/month. That’s one hour’s work IRL in most places.


(yellow parasol) #11

That’s absolutely correct and I’ve mentioned my agreement on this.

Sadly these people are a part of CCPs target audience.


(Rek Seven) #12

I get what you are all saying but all comes down to value for money. I do not feel the value is worth the subscription and now that different clones exists, it makes that feeling even stronger.

For me it’s logical to think that considering omega clones allow you to train new skills, fly more ships and use more modules, there should be an option to continue using the ships and modules you have trained for, without the ability to train new skills.

Right now my options are to continue playing for a game that i clearly do not value that much, train skills just so i can extract them and sell them for PLEX which i already said i don’t want to do, ore quit playing.

Personally i think there are people who currently use alpha clones who would switch to using the Gamma clone. In this case the user benefits from having more subscriptions options so can choose their level of value and CCP would get extra income and happier customers.


(Daichi Yamato) #13

On the contrary. People would train up for a ship that can do everything, like a t3, and then stop paying full subscription.

The amount of alpha players wanting to fly omega ships wouldn’t be the as many as those who are already paying for it. Where as the amount of vets that don’t need to train, like you or me, would be quite large.


(yellow parasol) #14

Making this idea payable with plex completely defeats the purpose, as no one will want to pay five bucks when he can reach 250 plex easily. and it is easy.

and please don’t bother with “every plex is paid for with real money”, because that’s irrelevant. two people paying money are better than one person paying money. Two people buying plex with cash are better than one person buying plex with cash. Get rid of the leechers, cater to a more mature aud… (oh, damn, they had that already and changed the game to get rid of them. my bad.)

This idea seemed to be about making CCP more money, not giving people an even easier way to play without spending any. yet, with plex as payment option, this idea achieves nothing, except an increased price of plex and an increased amount of self entitled freeloaders. just looking at the numbers, while ignoring the people behind these numbers, leads to desaster.

in the end CCP makes a buttload of money already thanks to injectors. they need more players playing, sure, but attracting mostly people who only want to consume, as it is noe, ends in a downward spiral with noone left to care.


(Rek Seven) #15

I don’t think your can speak for every player in the game and i don’t think you understand the purpose, so please don’t state your opinion as fact.

So far people seems to be saying players can easily extract and sell the skills they train every month to be able to play for free… But for some reason they seem to have a problem with players paying a reduced subscription, on the understanding that they can’t train more skills. In this situation, my option results in CCP getting more money.

Yes it is easier to get to 250 PLEX and this is an achievable goal which would result in more people doing stuff in space. I can only speak for my self but i assume that there will be a percentage of the player base how feel the same - when plex prices were half what they were now, i was far more active in space. Now it is not feasible for me to earn a plex in the amount of gaming time i have available, so i simply don’t bother trying to PVE.

People may call me lazy or poor but name calling doesn’t solve the issue i think exists.


(yellow parasol) #16

i don’t understand your question.

edit: ah, you’ve editted it.

I am not speaking for every player. it’s stupidly easy to make money in this game and reaching 250 plex in a month is a piece of cake! i don’t need to speak for anybody and this is a fact! sure, there’s people who are below average and might struggle, but why the hell would you want people in the game, who can’t even manage to reach 250 plex, when it’s so easy to do so?

PLUS, there’s tons of people out there spreading the word about how to reach 500 plex in a month, so why would it be hard to reach half of that?!

More players does not automatically equal a better game. it also matters who you attract! it’s like with sex: Don’t do crazies! just because they increase the number of women you’ve slept with, doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to do so! Quality > Quantity!

ps: i’m not aware of calling you any “name”. you mean “insult”, btw, which i didn’t do either. :slight_smile:


(Cade Windstalker) #17

Yup, pretty much.

You seem to be pretty massively under valuing this whole “selling SP” thing, considering you not only would cover the cost of your subscription but make ISK off of the deal.

The problem is, does the number of these people outweigh the amount lost from people who are currently Omega and would swap to paying the lower amount?

Not everyone has alts, but quite a few people do and that number is not insubstantial. If you consider that you can pay for an extra queue on an account for less than a whole new account it would likely be quite worthwhile for many of these players to just keep a few training accounts, pay for more queues on those accounts, and cycle characters out of them when they’re done training for whatever focused skills they want that character to use.

For example basically every Titan and Super Carrier pilot in the game would drop their sub to this level in all likelihood.

[quote=“Rek_Seven, post:15, topic:10267”]In this situation, my option results in CCP getting more money.
[/quote]

It doesn’t, because CCP still gets the full cost of your subscription time when someone buys the PLEX that you then buy with ISK to turn into game time, plus the value of the extractors that you turn into injectors, so on a per-account basis CCP makes more off of you selling your SP than they do out of you just PLEXing normally and at 250 PLEX your proposed sub level is less than 1/3rd of what CCP makes off of you selling SP to play.


(Rek Seven) #18

Yeah after listening to you guys, farming sp and selling it seems like a no brainer.

EVE is currently not worth the £10 subscription fee for me right now so, even though it feels wrong and a roundabout way of doing things, I’ll hop on board the farming train and pile isk up for free!

Thanks o/


(Cade Windstalker) #19

Pro-tip, make sure you’re training at the highest efficiency you can, and check the cost of the 10-pack of Skill Extractors for PLEX vs the market cost. If you’re training at 2700 an hour you should need about 4 per month.


(loon Mabebu) #20

I totally love the idea. My money is tight and i have put over 2 years worth of subs into this game. I had to drop my sub due to finances. trying to haggle with my wife to get 15 bucks a month is not going to happen at all right now. How ever 5$ a month would be possible.

How ever this is what I am seeing and the reason why this would not come into place.
Skill injectors circumnavigate the whole don’t need to train thing. basically speaking you can pay for a reduced account and they buy skill injectors off the system. I personally think that skill extractor/injectors was the worst thing they could have done for this game. That is another story though.

I personally want a state like this. So here is what I would put forward. Yes you could go into the Gamma clone state for 5 bucks a month. How ever there would be some requirements that must be met before you can do so. You must have so many skill points. Lets say 50m seems like a good number. Also you could not use skill injectors or skill extractors. Your skills would literally be locked as they are. You must also play the game for lets say a minimum of 1 year.

Now i have something like 51m skills myself. Yes i could sub and use skill extractors; how ever this is doomed to fail. As more and more people reach that spot plex is just going to keep increasing until you don’t make any money. It almost literally lock new people out of the game to some degree.

So I for one am in for having a reduced sub with the exchange of no skill changes. Now i know a lot of other people are as well. What does this mean for ccp. Well look at it this way. They still get money for people that have been in the game for ever. This also means that the amount of people trying to “plex” goes down that have been in the game a while. Plex drops in price on the market.(before you start saying that is a bad thing keep reading) new free account players or people that want to play the game or can’t afford it can now play the game fully through plex’s. So now you have an opening for people that haven’t been in the game to have more reason to play and enjoy it. More people in the game.

While you saying more isn’t always better; more brings more potentially decent people to eve.

I personal don’t want to plex because i feel like I have to work in the game just to plex. I work in real life why would i want to play a game to work.