Ganking is too easy and there's no real PvP counter. CCP should balance ganking and anti-ganking. Discuss


(Trey-Gowdy) #42

They put themselves at risk but they do stand a chance.

What you’re asking for is for 5-10 ships to “equally” counter 30. Do you not see the irony there?

Beginner’s Math: 10 ≠ 30

(Black Pedro) #43

There are plenty of PvP counters. It is trivial to avoid being ganked in highsec. You know this, as does every other veteran but the most obtuse. The only way you lose a ship is being incredibly unlucky, and completely being inattentive. Ganking a ship profitably, with the exception of excessively laden or blinged-out ships, operating in highsec is borderline impossible if the pilot is paying attention as one might in lowsec. And even most of them can evade any threat before it can land on grid and lock them, and the tanked ones are hilariously unprofitable to shoot and require massive fleets.

Now, you are correct that an “anti-pirate” vigilante can’t shut down all pirates, but I really don’t see why that should be possible. A small anti-pirate squad who has the backing of CONCORD can easily escort a ship guaranteeing its safety to all but an overwhelming (and expensive) fleet. But yes, they can’t be everywhere all the time and defend everyone, but I don’t see how the game would be better if they could do that or camp -10s who can’t give a proper fight into a station.

Personally, I don’t see how you can make the gameplay any richer without giving criminals more freedom like by removing the facpo or something. The NPCs get in the way of any real interaction between players and force the criminals to bring overwhelming force. And that has obvious other downsides, especially when the anti-pirates aren’t around and they usually aren’t. One can imagine other systems for the interdiction of freighters that allow players have a real fight over the freighter, but even then, if players can’t manage to defend themselves with the overwhelming advantage of CONCORD protection, it seems unlikely to me they will manage to show up to a real PvP fight against a prepared criminal gang.

Do you have any ideas?

(Solecist Project) #44

It’s what politicians do. As long as people think they’re being stupid, they can just keep continuing the ■■■■ they do.

(Scipio Artelius) #45

In no other PvP discussion does anyone complain that it’s too difficult for the third-party.

Only in ganking, is it an issue that a third-party has it too tough.

Anti ganking is irrelevant.

What’s relevant is whether the target of a gank has counters that balance the risk against the ganker.

There will never be agreement on that, because we all have our own opinions about where the balance sits, but where it doesn’t sit, is with players that don’t even use the counters already available to them. They are largely the people that end up ganked. They should just stop being scrubs.

(Solecist Project) #46

For the haters it’s balanced when suicide ganking is gone!

edit … need to learn to read.

(Trey-Gowdy) #47

It’s people like this that make the argument null and void. He flew his expensive battleship into a known gank system and just left it there on the gate. I see the gankers as the victims here. How can you dangle FREE candy in front of someone and not expect them to eat it?

(Solecist Project) #48

No one’s a victim. It’s stupid to claim that, no matter the “side” you’re on.

(holdmybeer) #49


So many people nowadays are saying there’s no real counter for ganking , but following the code makes you basicly ungankable. Mining permits cost only 10 million isk per year too!

(Whitehound) #50

Yep, he’s being dishonest in almost every comment I’ve seen him make so far. He doesn’t want to accept the lesson, which ganking provides their victims. It’s as if he didn’t see that it’s just a game, because of all the victims. He then goes on about it, not even realising how little he understands the effort behind ganking, but compares it to simple mechanics, almost as if ganking was easier than running a mission or mining asteroids. And on this level of ignorance does he then try to create a discussion and makes proposals on how to fix it, which makes his comments into a bizarre and weird spectacle.

Yesterday did I eat ice cream and a small bit of cream dripped onto my trousers. I then thought about it, how we come to have ice cream for centuries, and it still keeps doing this. So I wrote a letter to the manufacturer and complained about it and how dumb their product is. They should have fixed ice cream a long time ago. Why haven’t they fixed it yet? Everyone gets how this is a problem and nothing is being done. If they could finally fix this then we had more ice cream eaters and manufacturers could sell more ice cream. Yet am I being ridiculed by other ice cream eaters, some of who suffered the same problem as I did. I am at a loss!

This is roughly how it comes across to me when people want to complain about ganking. I get how something can be seen as a problem, such as dripping ice cream, but it’s also not quite sane.

(Clockwork Robot) #51

Not when they can log out instantly.

(Trey-Gowdy) #52

It’s called sarcasm. Learn to recognize it dweeb.

(Solecist Project) #53

Learn about Poe’s Law, you uneducated peasant, and stop using their rethoric. People don’t put thoughts into most what they read, so expecting that anyone recognises it is foolish.

And we really don’t actually need to have an argument about this.

(Trey-Gowdy) #54

Talk about “uneducated”. Go buy a new dress.

(Solecist Project) #55

… said the peasant. You really want to argue about this? That’d just get the thread locked.

We don’t want this, do we?

(Whitehound) #56

Hah, that’s a trick question!

(Estuary Algaert) #57

@Lucas_Kell You are thinking about this incorrectly. The gank is much like a bullet from a gun already on route to a target, it is a conclusion. Sure, there are ways to disrupt at this point, and yes they are difficult by the very nature of what is occurring, but this is the wrong end of the problem to solve against.

Might as well be exploring pvp counters to “My hull is now at 1% and they are at full shields, how do I win this fight”

(Trey-Gowdy) #58

Calling me a peasant exposes your Achilles’ heel.

(Solecist Project) #59

What does it expose about you, when you call me a dweeb? :slight_smile:

(ISD Dorrim Barstorlode) closed #60

(ISD Dorrim Barstorlode) #61

This topic is currently being discussed over at Ganking, or rather the Right to Gank. Feel free to continue the discussion there. Thank you.