Gatekeeping for new players?

Communications Center General Discussion
1

Hello everyone!
I spent exactly two weeks in this game as a beginner, and I don’t quite understand how to properly build a progression to access different forms of content. I have a paid OMEGA and I spend 50% of the isks I receive to purchase injectors, but access to the new content is still opening too slowly.

At the moment, I’ve pretty well upgraded my exploration skills and successfully earning isk for ships or injectors by hacking chests, BUT, all other content brings significantly less in-game currency, which is why it is simply ineffective, even stupid, to deal with it. And doing exploration every day is a little exhausting.

I’ll give you an example:

  • I have 6 mil SP points atm, mostly in explorations-related skills.
  • Exploration consistently brings 75mil - 100mil isk per hour.
  • All other activities bring three times less isk, because I don’t have enough skills to farm them effectively or i can do only low-end part of it.
    • I need 1-2 MONTHS to upgrade my skills for other new content.

And I’m not taking into account PvP features and the necessary skills for them yet. Yes, I really want to feel the PvP content, mostly, factional warfere, but you also need to put in a lot of experience points in order not to feel completely helpless.

Am I missing some elements of the progression? Or was the game originally intended to take pauses for 1-2 months and pay for a subscription while skills were being upgraded? Or is it that you need to have 2-3 characters and constantly switch between them?

Am I missing out on certain forms of content that can generate a good influx of currency? Say, 50m per hour, and don’t require a large skill set? Cause i really want to switch between 2-3 different farm-methods, to not get burned out.

Again, I ask you to look at all this from the perspective of a BEGINNER, a person who has only recently started playing this game. There is no need to recommend ways to earn money that are associated with luck or great knowledge of the game. I cannot do 90% of the things in this game not because of SP, but because my game knowledge low and it takes time to learn things.

In general, I don’t understand what i am doing wrong. In most other games, you have a clear progression curve that gives you access to more and more content. And I don’t want to put a isk\h at the forefront right now, but almost everything in the game is related to spending currency and you’ll have to farm it anyway. Of course, when choosing between 25m per\h and 100m per\h , I will choose the second one, since it is four times more effective and will allow me to upgrade my skills faster or buy a new ship.

Can someone clarify this for me please? And how with all of that, i can enter PvP-content and dont feel weak and helpless?

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You are not doing anything wrong. Your expectations are not matching what EVE offers.
EVE is a marathon, not a sprint. You are playing for two weeks, thats nothing in this game.

EVE just is completely different than most other games.
You will still be a bloody newbie in 2 years. The key is cooperation with other players and learning from them how things work, step by step. And yes, you can do PvP as a beginner, just train in cheap ships and don’t fall for the trap that you need the best and most expensive stuff. You don’t even need injectors. You need a good group, a good mentor and the will to listen, to learn, to fail, to try again and to be patient.

You can’t get good in EVE in 6 weeks, no matter what kind of hardcore cracknerd you are in other games.

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3

Have you tried not farming?

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And im doing exactly that atm^^ Righ now im in EVE University corporation and i ask a lot of questions from time to time, about different sides of the game. I just dont understand, how to efficiently switch between different types of content and dont feel like i can do MUCH more isk doing something else (exploration in my case).

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5

Stop playing for isk.

Problem solved.

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Day One Genosis Pilot can pvp.

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The grind for ISK will make you quit the game sooner or later. It burns you out. It will make you want a second Omega account soon. And then a third, and a fourth, just to grind more ISK.

Higher income sources open up all by themselves the more you learn and can use in the game. And the better opportunities the group you are in offers of course.

Most public PvP fleets are actually open for Newbros, pick a fast Frigate and lets go, get some kills! Get in contact with good people, see new things…

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What do you mean by that?

This game is all about “Earn Isk → Buy things → Lose Things → Repeat”.

Isk\h is not my main goal at moment, but, let’s say that i need 20 fits for FW, to die a lot and quickly replace lost ship. Each fit is ~5-10 mil (idk real prices but this is just an explample).

So i need 100-200 mill isk to do so.

I tried different game activities to earn isk and have a comparison for you:

  • T0 Exotic Abyss on my Hookbnill ~20-25mil isk\h;
    • I need 5 to 10h or 4 to 8h to farm required isk
  • Exploration on my Heron with T2 Analyzers - 75-100mill isk\h
    • I need 1.3 to 2.66h or 1 to 2h to farm required isk.

Lets say that i play 2h each day. I need almost 5 days to farm required amount doing first method and only one, doing second one. This is a big the difference, even if my math is bad:D

Anyway, the main goal of my post is to gather recommendations from other ppl. I aiming to 50 mill Isk\h with different activities, so i can enjoy this game from different angles and slowly move myself to PvP, not worrying too much about ship losts, cause i can farm isk quickly if needed.

Is this approach is bad?

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If you are interestted in PvP you have basically two choices as a new player.

  1. Join some nulllsec alliance and play ewar ship like Maulus or Griffin - requires minimal amount of skills, is super cheap and usually safe as well as you can apply that ewar from large distance.
  2. Join highsec gankers and do non-consensual PvP. You should max out t2 pulse Coercer at least to start with that.

If neither is of your interest you need to be patient and train up.

To speed up your training.

  • use the account referral link for 1milion free skillpoints
  • make sure to do daily challenges every day and prefferably login every day even if just for quick 3 jumps and 1 minute of mining.
  • complete all of the AIR challenges - this gives you 750k SP (x2 if omega)
  • if you are omega don’t forget to claim 15k SP every week from NES store
  • if you are alpha spend your ISKs for Daily Alpha Injectors (those are super ISK effective)

And mainly. Do not make the typical newbie mistake of skilling into mining because it seems as an efficient way to get ISK since you do that entirely AFK. Do combat missions, start with level 1 and slowly progress to level 3. Use Gnosis for level 3, but your goal for PVE should be Gila, drones and missiles. To do level 4 you need to be omega and you need battleship, they are very hard and slow for new players so stick with level 3. Even level 3 missions will get you solid ISK if you loot them. Salvaging is waste of time though in my opinion, that pays off only in level 4 sites where are battleship (wrecks).

And mainly forget about ISK/hour. You can start thinking about it once you have perfect skills for specific ships, perfect knowledge of what to expect and enough ISK to buy those shiny ships/fits that are required for it.

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10

Thx for you answer.

Im OMEGA-pilot, yes, and i try to spend some of my isk to buy Small Injectors, cause daily is only for Alpha:(

I did all AIR Career things, except for Soldier of Fortune, cause it require a lot of PvP and it’s my main goal atm: to do a lot of PvP and spent less time farming isk for that PvP, that obvious.

So you recommend mission running as side activity?

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Yeah, do FleetOps with Veterans. The’ll carry you, you don’t need to be able to solve the content at all, you just fit into a role in their fleet. And in the end you get paid your share. Which can very well be some hundred Million ISK. The last RattingOps my Alliance did returned like 8 Billion ISK on that evening and even the “Newbro” who just salvaged behind us in a T1 Destroyer got his 300M.

We also run Team-Abyssals, like two Veterans in a max-skilled Assaultfrig + 1 Newbro in a tanked Factionfrig. Also we do Homefronts in small Gangs that are easily accessible for complete Newbros. Then I sometimes offer to grind trough L4s with a max skilled Marauder and a Newbros just fly behind me and takes all the loot/salvage.
We offer Gas-Huffing OPs with Fleetboost, where even a dead cheap Venture makes more thn 50M/hour. Double that if you can bring a Covetor.

Also: Don’t begin PvP solo. Fly in a small fleet, often they offer SRP for Newbies (Ship Replacement), so you don’t need 20 pre-fitted ships, they pay you a new one if you lose yours. And you don’t even lose it everytime, because if your gang wins the fight, you might as well come back unharmed.

The key is COOPERATION. Don’t try to solve the game solo as a new player. That is painful as hell and slows down your progress a lot. Fly with other people.

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It’s not just painful, it’s exhausting. A ton of info every day. Infinite amount of fits and problems to solve, cause my CPU or Power Grid skills is weak for most of the fits i check. That’s why i ask almost everything in corp chat and made this post in first place.

Q1: What am i doing wrong?

A1: I try to approach this game as a solo.

Q2: What to do different?

A2: Find a corp\\Alliance\\Fleet and play in party.

This is the questions\\answers i was looking for. I tried to do such posts recently but i dont know what corporations suit my expectations and what the expect from me. Time to research, i guess.

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Well, EVE Uni should offer some internal fleets on a regular basis. At least back in the days we often saw them in LowSec, completely Yolo in T1 Cruiser Blobs just shredding whatever they could get (or get shredded if they tried to bash a Gang of professionals, but thats also an experience ^^).

Then check this site: https://npsi.rocks/

There are announcements for public fleets, most of them newbie friendly. From Nullsec roams to Wormhole Daytrips, LowSec Gatecamps and whatnot. Find out why a Wolf-Rayet WH is great for grinding ISK with Frigates/Destroyers for example. See how the HS Gates in Ahbazon are farmed and how such gatecamps work, what ships to use and how to use them. Learn how to rob an ESS Bank. Or steal from Skyhooks. And so on… all available with total strangers and if you ask nicely, they will build you a fit that will work for that OP. Maybe not as main damage dealer, but as tackler, remote-supporter, scout or whatnot.

Also, check for PvP corporations in your language. If you speak German for example, I can recommend a few where you can learn the game from scratch.
You can even try out a corp and if you don’t like what they offer, leave for another. It isn’t like you get married. Sometimes you need 4, 5, 7 attempts until you find the right batch.
You can look for corps and/or write your own “looking for corp”-request here at the forums in the recruitment section of your language.

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Hi fellow Eve University corp mate.

2 weeks in the game and still lost, yeah that was me to. Spent my first two weeks just trying to get a handle on how this was all going to work. A year and half later and am still a newish player.

Good news. Once you figure out what you want to do.. Take your time and don’t sweat the small stuff. The game will click for you. Exploration is a good. It promises a lot of excitement as you crack open the can. Sometimes hitting big.. and other times.. Well not so much.

But as pointed out to you. This is a marathon. Not a sprint. After six months to a year from now you might be able to fly a tech 2 ship. Probably not well.. But still getting there. I spent a lot of time before deciding on industry. mission running. I still do that from time to time. It is a great source for making Isk and getting ships and other things as well. Especially when you get the mission done in good time.

It may not seem like much at first. You might have a few million in your wallet, I wouldn’t know and most likely dirt poor. No one on these forums started with a boatload of Isk. You will make Isk as long as you are putting in any effort.

In the discord there is the newbro cafe. I would recommend showing up there. I think it is now Sundays? Eve does have a mentor program as well. You might want to check it out. And sit in on as many classes as you can. The knowledge you gain from there will boost you along a lot faster.

One last word. Expect to lose ships, probably a lot of ships.. It is going to happen. Insure the ships as well as you can so at least you get some Isk back. And Eve Uni does offer ships to Corp members as well. Or message me and I will set you up with a deal that could fit your budget. I do make ventures and a couple of other tech 1 ships. As well as some modules and ammo.

So welcome to the game and hope you stay a while..

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If, like me, you really can’t be bothered grinding away for hours, there is always the option of buying PLEX to convert to ISK. Last time I checked it was around 1.8bn ISK for £10 worth of PLEX.

But don’t waste that on skill injectors, they are a complete waste of ISK. It is better to spend the money on implants that speed up your training. Rather than spend 1bn ISK on an injector that knocks 9 days off training, for 90m ISK or so you can have 4 ‘Standard’ implants that continuously knock 4 or 5 days a month off the training time….the top 4 shown here..

Gloria
Gloria1154×595 121 KB

Gloria is just one of my Omega chars…the others have more SP and ISK. I haven’t had any ‘income’ in EVE, other than a share of loot from stations destroyed, for over a year now since I last bought PLEX. I’m in EVE to PvP and have fun, not to spend hours ‘grinding’.

Essentially I totally agree with the advice from this guy….

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Progression in EVE isn’t a set or linear thing, if you WANT it to be based on income then it can be but that’s a choice you make. EVE is a sandbox, you control your goals, progress and how you measure progress. I know several people who have been playing for 15+ years but choose to ONLY fly frigates and don’t really care about income much, to them it’s not a goal nor a measure of success or fun.

I’m not telling you what to do, but I am suggesting that perhaps you are creating your own hell scape here and you might have a good rethink of what your goals actually are and if having those goals hamper your enjoyment or not.

100m isk/h is a very healthy amount of income and that’s because exploration, of any form, pays really well. If anyone gave you the idea that it isn’t they’re either lying, pretending to be awesome or… “forgetting to mention some details” about what they’re doing. Like only counting the 5 minutes of action it took but forgetting the 50 minutes of preparation and searching, to them claim they made that isk in 5 minutes. Or like a miner going “I make 300 mil/h” but not telling you he’s using 5 omega accounts for it, or some industry person boasting about his profit margins but when you push the subject he, unwillingly, admits that he didn’t count a certain resource he “still had lying around” which (magically) accounts for those “profits”.

In short 100m/h for someone 6 months in is exceptionally good, most people don’t get that. Anything MORE than that is going to require some really sweaty playing and probably requires several fleshed out and min maxed accounts omega accounts used in a very boring but effective manner.

If you’re having fun the you’re playing EVE right, if you’re not having fun or you’re trying to aim for things that result in you not having fun, then you’re playing EVE wrong.

If you consistently can make 100 mil/h with exploration you’re relying on both luck and gained knowledge, in fact you’re doing quite well with that so I don’t see a reason to undersell your accomplishments.

These are not the answers you want to hear, but my suggestion is that you should perhaps realise that they are the answers you need to hear. Play for fun, this is a very long term slow burning game, it’s very easy to get lost in the downward spiral of “progression”. Perhaps you should redefine what progression actually means, because I’d say you’ve done quite well so far.

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A few points worth adding to my post…

  1. If you do buy PLEX, make sure to have the Accountancy skill set to at least level IV beforehand. Then you will pay less Sales Tax

  2. Macgybo’s video was from around 2 years ago, and the PLEX to ISK value was 4 million ISK back then, as he says, but has been around 6 or 7 million ISK in more recent times….so you get even more ISK for your PLEX

  3. It’s worth adding that these PLEX bought are precisely what allows people who ‘PLEX’ their accounts ( i.e pay for their OMEGA by converting ISK to PLEX ) to do so. If nobody was buying PLEX, there’d be no PLEX available for that practice.

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:thinking: You have the same thing in EVE. You have “maxxed” your exploration skills. Great. Go explore and earn money. While you do that, you train something else, like cruisers or battleships for missions or combat exploration or abyssals (:face_vomiting:). And when you have maxxed your skills there, you train for something else.

I do not see why you don’t see a progression.

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Absolutely, do some relicc/data exploration here and there if you like it, but combat missions will teach you most.

Oh and I forgot 1.000.000 SP referral. Added to my original post.

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What you’re missing is that EVE is a marathon, not a sprint.

8 years down the line I’m still unlocking new things and having fun. I didn’t unlock all content in the first months either.

You already unlocked exploration. Good. Now get some basic skills in other activities so you can branch out. You won’t need perfect skills right away to get a feeling for them and something like mining or planetary industry only takes a few days of training to get started or a couple of weeks to get ‘decent’ skills.

Level 5 skills are a nice end-goal, but shouldn’t be your first target. Multiple activities at level 3 is much more fun than one activity with level 5s, and takes a fraction of the training time!

Level 3 is only 3% on the way to level 5.

In other words, you could have 33 skills at level 3 for the SP it takes to have one skill at level 5.

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