Have a question for PVP orthrus Pilot

(Monica Wilhelm) #1

So Im trying to build an Orthrus for low sec solo pvp and I want it to be perfect so Im researching best way to fit it. I noticed that majority of players on killboard fit Ionic field projector and hydraulic bay thrusters. I dont seem to understand the idea behind it since its disruptor does not reach out that far. Wouldnt it be better to fit anti-thermal and another anti-em or like a damage rig, even fuel cache seems better since it would allow t2 missile to go guaranteed 3 seconds instead of the base 2.81. Is it like a specific fit for certain situation that I will not be encountering in my solo roams or am I missing something?

(Quelza) #2

Could you detail your search strategy when looking up zkill Orthrus fits?

I ask because, looking back through 2017/2018 losses, I’ve only seen one of the Top Characters for Solo kills with the Orthrus who have fit a Ionic Field Projector (used in conjunction with scramblers rather than disruptors). And that was just on one of their fits. Primarily I am seeing Polycarbon Engine Housings to capitalize on the Orthrus’ speed. Many of these also have at least one shield rig (of either type you were suggesting).

(Monica Wilhelm) #3

Searched by monthly top losses, regular search orthrus losses, it seems to be a very common fit.

(Quelza) #4

If that’s the case you might be picking up a lot of fleet fits which might be being used as fast kitey tackle ships in small gang roams. In which case getting the most range out of your tackle modules makes sense.

(Monica Wilhelm) #5

Sure, but what does missile speed and targeting range have to do with tackle.

(Quelza) #6

Missile effective distance is affected by both flight time and missile velocity. Increasing missile speed will increase missile range. As a bonus, it will add to the already very fast missile speeds found on Legion ships.

Now the Ionic Field Projector is something of a mystery to me. I suspect it has more to do with fleet mechanics but I can’t say for sure. You’d think they’d want a Particle Dispersion Projector (maybe they got it confused lol).

(Monica Wilhelm) #7

Well yes, I kind of have my speculation leaning towards them using it as a hit and run tactic while keeping distance and yes missile speed is handy but flight time seems a lot more convenient for the fit they are using as it would allow further missile range. So why aim for missile speed if your trying to get the most range and why something so specific is used so commonly. I was wondering if somebody who uses this fit could specify the exact strategy behind it with this ship.

(Quelza) #8

I’ll leave after this because the commentary of people who fly these fits often will obviously be more valuable than my speculation.

Having loaded an Orthrus fit into pyfa, and checking out the ranges when adding either the missile velocity or the flight time rigs (T2), you get the same max missile range when using one or the other rig. Velocity rigs get you the same range and get your missiles to the target faster. Definitely a plus if you’re flying with turret fits that can apply their damage instantly.

(elitatwo) #9

The ionic field projector is for targeting range when you fit heavy missiles. Since you only have so many mid slots, you cannot fit a sensor booster.

The particle dispersion projector increases the range for ecm jammers and only them.

Due to the nature of missiles flying your ship in a certain way increases or decreases your missiles range.

(Quelza) #10

I see, so these are incomplete RLML refits starting from HMs. That clears things up. Thank you very much for the correction.

(elitatwo) #11

I haven’t looked at the keyboard recently but if they use rapid jeebus launchers, the hydraulic bay thrusters increase the range of the missiles, thus the increased targeting range is necessary.

(Monica Wilhelm) #12

They use rapid lights, not heavy. And yes speed increases range but fuel cache rig (flight time) gives more range then the speed one with this ship. But back to the initial question. Why do majority of pilots go for missile speed instead of flight time and and why do they even go for it at all when the slots could be used for more defense, speed or damage. It doesnt seem to make sense if they are trying to catch somebody.

(elitatwo) #13

Imagine you fly an Orthrus and you seem to be running away from a Navy Omen.

The Omen pilot may think that you are too “scared” of lazors but in fact you are in total control of that fight.
Flight time is always pretty irrelevant in such cases because you want to do damage and not watch your missiles fly in the sunlight.
With the increased speed those missiles will reach that unlucky Omen much quicker than they ever would with flight time.

Oh and the increased range IS your defense - a better offense.

(Quelza) #14

How are you calculating this? With the in-game fitting simulation? I’m not getting the same outcome with the PYFA fitting tool. It doesn’t seem like you’d get a larger benefit out of flight time over velocity on a ship with a flight time penalty and a velocity bonus.

(Monica Wilhelm) #15

Yes but that doesnt increase the rate of fire, the dps is still the same, so it would only affect the first volley, after that the missiles would be landing at the same consistency. and if im at 60-70 km away and he feels like loosing he will just warp off. If im fighting navy omen i will just keep range at 40k and keep him pointed. And if i feel like im loosing I will pull out easily as i have all the speed I need for that. So if we are exchanging shots at 40k distance, what I would want is more damage or tank, not range, unless Im missing something.

(elitatwo) #16

And here come missiles speed into play. You do want to do damage right?

At 40km the missiles will only fly for approximately 3 seconds before they impact and every 2-3 seconds after that.
In my Omen example the Omen will be toast before you even lost 40% shield hp.

(Monica Wilhelm) #17

Im fitting it in game, i have all the skills maxed out, and flight time would give guaranteed range aka your missiles will not miss 20% of the time. 15km/s at 4 secs flight time is better than 18km/s at 3.75 secs flight time.

(elitatwo) #18

No its not.

(elitatwo) #19

Something tells me there were cheat stix involved.

(Monica Wilhelm) #20

my light missile launcher has a cycle of 3.73 secs, why would i care about missile speed if the target will get hit every 3.73 secs after the first volley lands.

and yes, 15km/s at 4 secs flight time is better than 18km/s at 3.75 secs flight time. Unless you dont mind missing 25% of the time when you are further than 54km.