Hellmar says we should make retirement money from games


Buy Plex.

It is nice that CCP senior team acknowledge that they have a pretty large irl liability owing to “unfulfilled subscription”. I myself have invested in CCP 50 years of gametime which I funded with in game actions.

Although I enjoy personally providing more to Plex to good than most alliances, I would also be relieved to be able to make some pocket/retirement cash without fear of an over zealous rmt ban.

A focus on bot removal and a free rmt market will be the rebirth of Eve.

Now let the botters Reeeeeee,

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Until his game provides him with the retirement plan he dreams of, I guess.


He must have ridiculousy opulent dreams now that he’s a millionaire.

Hilmar is the problem


Well if CCP wants to experiment with this concept, i volunteer for taking their money for my retirement plan.

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Yeah this would destroy the game as we know it. A game in which you can make RL money is Entropia Online, and it’s a big casino. Everything you do playing the game has a cost, and you won’t get 100% of your investment back just by playing the game, or the company would go bankrupt since people can withdraw funds from their currency.

Picture this: You deposit 100 USD today, what would happen if you could turn that into 150 USD just by killing NPCs in a month and withdraw your money? They would be down 50 USD. Now picture everyone doing this. So the system needs to take money from players and make the ROI less than 100% in most cases.

Of course you can make money trading and offering services to other players and avoid the big roulette mechanics of playing the game, but it also requires quite an initial investment.


Now imagine an Eve that is more than a NPC whack a mole theme park game.

People who are opposed to rmt tend to either be brain dead, pro bot and pve players. Pve in Eve sucks and can be automated completely with a few lines of code . This brain dead N+1 gameplay is wearing thin in 2021.

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Often when we want to look at something ‘new and unproven’ with some degree of success, it’s best to find established real-world models that make this sort of thing work.

Sports teams succeed because while the teams cost huge bucks, millions of fans pay to watch and advertisers to advertise to those fans. So from that you get e-sports, which CCP tried but failed because except to a smallish group of EVE PvP afficionados, EVE PvP is pretty boring really.

Movie stars and bands make big money, because people are willing to pay them to consume the entertainment they provide. So if EVE could provide more entertainment and a spectate-for-pay model, it could work. Except EVE isn’t about short-term entertainment, it’s about the fussy details and long game, mostly. If EVE was like what CCP keeps trying to sell in their video ads, it could work. But CCP can’t provide the lies they’re selling in those videos.

Advertising can pay, so maybe if CCP could turn all those billboards into real ads it could make some money and players could shill for their “ad corp” or something. Anarchy Online tried a bit of ad-revenue back in the day. Didn’t work because the audience was way too small.

So it’s not “out of this world” to bat the notion around, or compare to youtube/follower pay or other things. But I can’t personally see anything in EVE that could be monetized in this fashion.

You have obviously not played Entropia online and seen the huge money-sink grind it is. EVERYTHING costs money, even firing guns (because they have durability).

And forget about gaining skill points by time. You have to play the game in order to trigger the chance to improve your skill related to the activity you are doing by very very little (it’s chance based). All those things cost MONEY to do.
Of course you can deposit and skill points immediately but it also costs quite a lot to get them to an acceptable level.

At this point in EVE Online’s history, it would not work either because many people and groups alread hold endgame content, which is counterproductive to that game model. They would need to reset everything, and everyone would start again with frigates and small T1 guns and start depositing money to buy ammo, repair their guns, ships and ship systems. Once they hit NPCs for long enough, their skill level may rise enough to use small T2 guns, or move onto destroyers, etc.
Btw when bigger and better guns get damaged, it would cost MORE to repair them than smaller guns, so if you want to go big you have to spend big too.

Never knew that Hilmar was Mr. Haney’s cousin:

This kind of talk seems to entirely miss what the point of games is for most of us (with the possible exception of professional sports).

I for myself want to pay for a pastime that is not real, where I can loose as much as I like and while it stings, my effing retirement fund does not depend on it, and where I can win without worrying if I just took dinner off someone’s table.


I am starting to think Hilmar is in early stages of the Presidency campaign.

Play2Earn is like the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I mean it takes only a couple seconds to imagine in what horrible grind fest abomination of games this would end. Naturally Hilmar is a fan.

True gaming died sometime around 2004, when the first-ever “DLC” came out.

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There was already a precious and rare asset class that arose in eve, AT ships.

CCP did not create it. It emerged organically through player activity. But what CCP did do is first try to cash it out (sneakily selling AT ships on the Chinese server cash store), then finally destroy it (announcing they will dump a massive new supply of them on tranquillity as they cannot afford additional dev time to create new spaceships).

They said in their announcement that expanding the AT ship supply would not have much of an effect but it destroyed the AT ship market. They also announced they planned to take measures to preserve the uniqueness of existing AT ships, but there has been no details and the AT market is already dead and buried.

As stewards of unique or rare items in the game market, even one that was handed to them on a plate, we cannot trust them except to cash grab and cash out or cut things off to save on having to pay devs to support them.

I trusted eve to be ‘real’ and invested in limited edition AT ships. Thanks for splatting an Acme pie in my face CCP. I shall not be trusting your blockchain, and only someone that is stupid would.

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Damn these tears are salty since you keep crying over your “precious” AT ships

I wouldn’t mind having some AT ships.

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Probably CCP wouldnt mind even RMT, if all of it would go thru their channels in game and taxed, so some portion would go to CCP. PLEX could be eliminated from a tradable thing in game and everything would be costing cash. No more grinding isk for subs, pay with real money.

Or them paying you in real money for every new guy subscribing.

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“Hellmar” :sweat_smile:

Hahaha cry more, how many other markets have CCP absolutely gutted paticularly ones they promised they never would ie, unique skins like the police skins, ‘‘last chance’’, ‘‘final issue’’, ‘‘limited edition’’?

If you invest in any EVE unique IP like AT ships prepare to lose your investment as CCP simply do not care for their IP. I lost 100’s of billions in ‘‘limited edition’’/ ‘‘rare’’ Eve IP, never again. If you have AT ships & attribute a value to them I suggest selling them quick snap.

About the only EVE IP that CCP has caretakered is their pets T2BPO’s, the one rare that they should have dumped into the ground or removed by RP point refund.

CCP or any CCP developer being involved in NFT, Cyrpto or other digital assets is a joke. Their names are toxic waste in that department anyone with a brain would not let them anywhere near a digital asset.

CCP, stick to making for fun games, you are in no way credible to create Cyrpto, NFT or even an E-sport. Owing to your entrenched behaviour here in Eve.