I wasn’t claiming newbros revitalise markets. I was saying a lot of people have walked away from indy, to keep any segment of the game going you will always need some influx of new people to replace player churn. The markets outside Jita have almost certainly become worse stocked, which decreases footfall, which decreases in turn people wanting to stock them.
Over all the veteran bigblock indy & dominance of Jita as THE marketplace seems to me to have become more entrenched. tbf I don’t really care much anymore. I’m out of indy, I’m just a shopper now, but I do notice changes with how the markets run now at all the places I used to sell. Was just sharing my experiences with wanting to be an indy player for a few years then giving it up.
Amarr to a lesser degree but Dodixie, Rens, Hek, & places in between, they’re just not that well stocked as they used to be, with all sorts of gaps in modules, boosters, implants, rigs even stuff as basic at types of ammo & drones.
It’s not about who succeeds ; but about in what game.
I always see a lot of people selling at a loss, guess they are newbro in indus, so definitely there is a influx of bad(=new) players.
That’s due to an over saturation of production. Established players, playing for YEARS, who still don’t understand their resource streams, production costs and resource values. Some of them do it because they just enjoy the concept of it and don’t really care, many do it do it because “I have this setup with all these accounts&characters so I’ll use them” but an alarming number of them because they can’t do basic maths or logic.
Them being established or not is not the concern.
Their ability to do math is not important.
The thing is, many people sell at loss (comparatively to the cost of selling the raw resources) so newbros can’t make money because if they compete they also will be losing money.
Also it’s not really basic math. When you want to sell on a market you have to make market analyzis and that requires a lot of work. But in the end, you can tell which item statistically are worth engaging in, dependingon a lot of parameters.
The act of building things is easy, but the evaluation of said act is where the difficulty comes. It’s a big misconception that industry requires only basic math.
No one is selling at a loss out of spite so that newbies can’t make money. I mean surely someone will be that weird but most are not. That’s just a dumb take.
Yes, and that requires math and logic. Which is my point.
It DOES require math and logic. The logic to understand that investments of time and resources have value and then the math to figure out your actual production cost by adding up all the variables (and not forgetting/omitting some).
When I was doing indy I had 24 different moderately complicated custom spreadsheets with pivot tables and so on to try & eek out profit not loss & track market opportunities. All the sheets went red basically as the changes kicked in.
I used a lot of dynamic sites & current prices etc as well of course, but both the purchase price & quantity of a particular resource for an individual transaction is by definition static. It’s a static purchase you made. Different transactions vary depending on what deals you can find in what amounts (&where). But when you buy a big chunk of resources the purchase price affects what is profitable to be done with it.
When there a long period where it’s more profitable to sell off the mats than make stuff, that’s not encouraging for indy players.
They raised taxes and fees, so people started trying to avoid the markets. Then they changed the resource distribution to try to force people to use the market. What is the next step? To add more contract fees?
If you don’t have alts in all of them and add products in the market, the people who live there will keep updating their orders constantly and beating you
I sold a lot of gank stuff to Dodixie-Rens-Hek, they eventually sold after a long wait, but if you sell stuff 3x faster at Jita then you make more ISK than selling overpriced stuff at Hek-Rens-Dodixe.
What I say is this:
CCP has to raise the ISK and LP payouts for missions in areas where nobody is running those missions, if missions around Rens pay 100% more then people will have a financial reason to travel from Jita to Rens.
This will create demand there, at least demand for ammo, drones, boosters, probes and MTUs.
The payouts should be dynamic just like ratting is today, that’s why I am saying, so people have better reasons for migrating, because today the payouts are all the same but Jita has the convenience of having all products there.
Please, reply me, do you guys understand my point?
No one will become a whale while running missions anyway.
I can absolutely understand your point and would even support it. Bind LP and Mission Rewards to the DynamicBountyModifier, so systems where lots of NPCs are killed sink down to 50% while systems where there are little to non runners go up even over 100%.