How "Smashes" hits works?

(Iliasaur Azizorra) #1

I have the question about my combat Tormentor vs Rifter. Here is the report.

The Rifter died just 7 minutes later. So, we do know its fitting. I just list the damage modules: 3 x 200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet Phased Plasma S, Gyrostabilizer II, Small Projectile Collision Accelerator I and Small Projectile Ambit Extension I.

We do not know pilot skills. Let’s assume “All 5”. Try it with Pyfa. The Rifter’s volley damage is 390 hp in overheat.

Rifter pilot’s capsule killed 3 hours later. So, we do also know, he had implant with 3% bonus to damage. 402 hp in overheat totally. 335 hp Thermal and 67 Kinetic.

Tormentor’s pilot is me. The armor resistance with my skills, Damage Control II and Adaptive Nano Plating II is 55% Thermal and 48% Kinetic.

So, max Rifter damage per hit is 335 * 0,45 + 67 * 0,52 = 186 hp. My question is about combat log line: “336 from Schalach Drebee - 200mm AutoCannon II - Smashes”. How is 336 hp possible?

As I know, “Smashes” means up to 150% of median damage. Ok, 186 * 1,5 = 279 hp. If the description would be “Wrecks”, that would explain the damage. But, it is “Smashes”.

I am in stuck. It is not defeat hurt. But I cannot PVP if I do not understand, how it works.

(Karl Poljus) #2

Are you sure it was not a hit on shields/structure?

(Iliasaur Azizorra) #3

Yes, I am sure. I record a fights video to analyze my fails. There was half of armor at the shot time.

But, you have gave me idea. Now I see: a little piece of shield was generated just before the hit. 2 or 3 percent, I think. Max 12 hp due to shield size of 402 hp. It is still not enough to 336.

Now the question is: what happens if damage removes shield out and hits armor? Is shield’s resistance still actual or armor resistance acts? If first, then 336 hp is reachable. It means also, that armor resistance is useless. A small piece of armor will be generated every time between two hits.

(Karl Poljus) #4

He might have also used the drug Agency ‘Pyrolancea’ that can increase damage by 3, 5 or 7 percent depending on version. As for second part, i’m almost 100% sure that armor resistance is not ignored.

(Iliasaur Azizorra) #5

Even 7% of drugs bonus does not increase damage to 336.

I have one more guess. Rifter has 3 cannons. The famous article “Turret mechanics” says, that “Even if the guns are grouped on your screen, they are still treated separately”.

What if two of three guns smashes, and third one - wrecks? That will be shown in the log: smahses or wrecks?

(Chainsaw Plankton) #6

I guess it’s possible smashes is 1.8x damage Wouldn’t be too surprised since wrecking is supposedly 2x, this is my 11th year in eve and I have no idea what the actual damage modifiers are for the various hit qualities. Also wouldn’t be too surprised to find out that it was 1 or 2 wrecking shots in with the smashes (1.5+2+2) /3 = 1.83333 which would match up with the reported damage. although heck the eve uni page says its 300% for a wrecking hit, (1.25+1.25+3)/3 =1.83333 too so it also checks out. the exact mechanics on the damage rolls are somewhat unknown. I don’t know that I’ve ever seen conformation on if everything is rolled as one big hit or everything is rolled on it’s own and added up.

imo if you are thinking about each individual hit you are over analyzing things. sure if it did something like 5000 damage it’s obviously wrong and game breaking, but this hit is in the range that has a reasonable chance to happen. Should focus more on what you could have done to either take less damage or do more damage. A rifter will have tracking advantages so you want to try using navy multi for better tracking, or pulling more range which will increase your damage with better tracking and reduce the rifter’s damage due to fall off. And I’m guessing with that plate most frigs you fight will also have a speed advantage, so working on positioning pre-fight, or working to get favorable matchups may be important.

(Iliasaur Azizorra) #7

That’s right. I cannot change Eva’s algorythm, but I can refit a ship. It’s that to be done. Just my curiosity bothers me.

Let’s continue. Chance for perfect hit is just 1%. Chance for two perfect hits per one volley is 0.01%. And so on. Even if one of turrets wrecks, the others smashes, penetrates etc. Therefore, combat log never shows “Wrecks” while weapon is grouped. Very-very rarely, at least.

You can check it easily. Just run Rogue Swarm with grouped turrets. There is a lot of targets here, so you’ll get a good stat. You’ll run one by one Swarms and never get the Wrecks in log.

Now ungroup weapon. You’ll get some “Wrecks” instantly.

That’s the answer on my question. Only one of Rifter’s ammo “Wrecks”. Not enough to affect the log.

(system) #8

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