How to play this game when i cant earn ISK?

Hence me explaining the issue with bringing exploration loot to Jita to that new guy, having him make (un)docking bookmarks while watching his movements on discord, then explaining and practising the warp/AP trick and “making” him use a <2 sec Slasher for his first loot haul instead of the Thrasher. All while explaining WHY.

The thing is that you can bring a horse to water but you can’t make it drink. Some people will just not listen or learn either because they’re stupid, ignorant or just lazy and they will keep repeating the same mistakes over and over while blaming everyone but themselves.

That means there is no point in even spending time&effort on folks who show signs of that mindset and instead use that effort on people who DO show signs of an inquisitive and logical nature.

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We had a new player in my corp a couple of months ago. He said he wanted to be an industrialist. We advised him all we could what skills he needed to train up on, pros/cons of finding the raw materials himself vs buying them, help get him setup on PI so at least he’d have a starting income stream, etc.

Then about 2 weeks later we get a ranting email from him how this game is impossible, how you can’t make any money in the game, and how can it be allowed for someone to just shoot at you if they just want.

We got him a bit calmed down and it turned out he had taken his Tayra some 30+ jumps from hi thru low into null. He said he was going to a station in null to buy something (never said what it was) he thought was very cheap and was planning to bring it back for sale at Jita for a big profit. He got taken out by a camp just two gates from the station. He never told us he was planning to do that, never asked for advise or help. We told him if he had mentioned it we would have strongly advised against it. Or at least been able to arrange an escort or scouts. (I told him I was impressed how lucky he was to have made it as far as he did!)

But he rage quit soon after anyway and that was that. :frowning:

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I’ll never understand how people can’t google a decade + game and figure stuff out.

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Well the best thing that you can do is change your attitude. Eve will not hand you success on a silver platter -you’ll have to earn it. True, this can lead to moments of frustration. However, it will also make your successes that much meaningful and rewarding.

Second, you don’t have to make boatloads of cash in order to have fun or be competitive. Player skill is still the most important factor in determining outcomes, and it costs nothing, nor is there any limit to how fast that you learn. Speaking of which…

There are 3 main ways that you can learn in Eve. Each has their advantages and disadvantages. Mix and match as you desire.

  • The Yeet Method- Learn by doing. The most fun approach, but also the most expensive thanks to Eve’s harsh death mechanic.
  • Community Knowledge- Make use of community knowledge (videos, written guides, formal classes) in order to learn as much as you can before you try doing it yourself. This method allows you to quickly gain knowledge that took other players months and years to acquire. However, many players also find it to be the most boring method.
  • Social Osmosis- Learn by just being around, watching, and listening to more experienced players.

Fourth, players are financially incentivized to keep their mouth shuts about certain things. However, that does not mean that no one is talking, or that you can’t figure things out on your own. In fact, many of the people who aren’t talking had to figure things out on their own themselves. So, you know, you can whine that people are reluctant to teach you how to compete with them, or you can resolve to figure it out yourself. And on a side note, industry and trade aren’t exactly big secrets. They were probably quiet because they didn’t want to write a 22 page guide on it, rather than not wanting to share their secrets. So, start looking for existing videos and guides if you want to know more.

And once again, because it bears repeating, you do not need lots of money to have fun or be competitive. Yes, ships do cost money and all that. But you’d be amazed at how far your isk will take you if you keep things cheap. The problem, however, is that so many players think they need a bunch of money, bling, and/or expensive ships -they don’t. Take me, for example. I can now fly caps on multiple toons, but I’ve never even sat in one and my favorite ship size is the cruiser. In fact, most players seem to prefer cruisers.

Moreover, I keep my fits so cheap that friends have made fun of me for being a cheap bastard. However, I most certainly make up for it with player knowledge, execution, try-hard effort, solid fit designs, and high character skill (to be fair, I have invested a lot of isk into my characters. However, I adamantly assert that character skill points are an advantage, and not a requirement for success).

Finally, I highly recommend on checking this video out. Not only does it contain a lot of useful information, but it might change your perspective on things.

And if you leave, can I have your stuff?

No P2W

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I found your problem right there.

F those guys.

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OK, where to start.

Exploration is obviously the best one to make decent ISK, so skill up for that, as others have said. Learn about what you have to look for and if you can develop your knowledge of how to evade being blown up it will get better and better.

Ratting, it depends what you think is decent ISK. What I do is use two characters belt ratting in destroyers in Stain, you can do this in different NPC space but look for the areas with the most systems and least number of inhabitants. Remember that each NPC BS is about 1m ISK in bounty. It is not as good as ratting in anomalies of course, but it is good steady income with low risk of loss because the ships I use are pretty damn cheap, fast and quick to warp out.

I have two Paladins that I used to use to do level 4’s in hisec but belt ratting in two thrashers in NPC nullsec is so much better and more fun with the odd person giving me the fun of yet another failed hunt on their part.

As for Indy, I used to make Capitals and certain BS’s, but more recent indy changes have screwed that up, I can’t see any reason to do that any more.

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This !

I had been seriously working on this idea , challenges are real but definately doable , i had been trying to develop the structure and Flight Academy was a great source and playgound for me to develop solutions and strategies to tackle issues born out of eve eco systems nature…

Still dream and it is nice to see still there are people out there sharing this idea…

@Blento_0404

Please drop whatever you doing…
Eve in extremely interwined and harsh universe carrying countless beautiess waiting for to be explored in it… it is truly a place where you can write your own destiny, inspiring, and you can get a lot … much more than you are givin… that how i experienced my adventure over a decade…

First thing you need to learn is how to survive ! If you keep only looose you cant build up anything , that include pleasure, knowledge assets alot of things…

Learning from your losses gives you knowledge too hard way… but most of these things can preventable , and learnable before you even experience …you know it is coming,
Thats how i did when train new pilots … first crash course was how to survive ,
Secon thing
Do not focuse on make isk! Start small and try as much as possible different things so you figure out what you enjoy most …
Industry and production not really suitable for new pilots… producing things requires lot of different type of sources to gather …and there are people out there doing this so many years they have “connections” to gather some of things cheaper with direct interactions, For example i nearly never paid for tax… i did bought direct from producers and i added tax amount to their payment… so they did not set things into market and sell it… this is just a very micron small example… but makes difference … think like a real life there are competition out there… people make things cost lower and they sell lower prices than you are producing … how you will going to compete as new player ?

You really want to start from head, there is hard such thing exist in eve …

First try to figure out what you enjoy most … Money , success everything Comes Along ! I promise that …

I havent seen any other game that much close to real life simulation than EvE online therefor they saying mastering economy in eve is quite an equal having masters degree in economics in real life …

Your knowledge and understanding brings the real isk …
Start working towards your mindset, your knowledge and attitude…
Before you close the doors so early …

If you want i can arrange you to meet my brother… he had rage quit 7 years ago … and give it a try again last year… with my pure foce on him because he knew i need help and support…

He find his pleasurepoint in eve … what he love most and enjoy … now even i stop he keeps goin and his richness economical sense beyond my decade earnings … and he made himself omega under a months by using 1 m isk costs ships … was amazing he called them “cerez” like nuts and stuff we snack on it …and he did not accept any support from me … and even helped me in some operations . No need to say …im very proud of him

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I was mildly interested here until you started crapping about “selfish”. I play for me, not for you or anyone else. So cheerio, goodbye, and hit the road…

EVE isn’t as straightforward for most activities as many MMOs are, that’s part of the limited charm that it has.

Any given activity has pros, cons, dangers and rewards, and what you get out of them pretty much directly relates to the time/effort you put into learning to “do it right”. Simply equipping a ship with some random stuff and heading out to try something means you will fail almost every time - although if you’re paying attention you’ll learn something from every failure.

Best to grab one of many guides on ISK making in EVE, or myself I prefer an overview something like Tips: EVE Online ISK per Hour Estimates | Learning to EVE .

Pick an activity that seems interesting and within reach and rewarding enough for you from that list, and then spend a few hours googling/researching how to do it properly.

You will still likely fail for a few tries as you learn things that no guide mentioned, but you can make quite a bit of ISK fairly quickly if you just pick the activities that work for you and learn how to do them.

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Selfish people as definition they think about themselves, They don’t care others , they definately dont sit and write that type of long posts offer help and inspire . Simply they dont even say go fucky yourself ! Most of the time… Because they dont give ■■■■ enough to tell that either…

We learn alot be sharing our experiences, and it brings a lot of dynamics. In some spesific cases group interventions become far more effective than individual meetings.

EvE is very different. There is no formula or one cut suitable to everyone.
i have teach pilots from 0 day to make isk ingame…along with PvP . for example as a test some players as just test it out i teach them market and contracts Give them 1b start up isk and told them they have 3 days to week deepends on their play time double it and sent my isk back … it worked… and All of them again all of them very proud they made it and they sent the isk back and i give it to another player… i used hundreds of billions isk to support new players , develop strategies to become more efficient in shortest possible with limited start up skills …and i never profit over that …my trade example out there i explained… took place to provide hundreds of thousads free fitted ships for new players, produced by new player corporations , i paid, they profit…and i handout ships to new pilots
It was succes… in fact was awsome …

I do see now better why you are struggling .
All i told there was… focus figure out what you enjoy most … 3 weeks -2 month in not enough even you play non stop 7/24 to explore yourself …

Not to push new pilots to one direction was core value of my approach over years … therefor i teach them null mechanics high mechanics , low and wh s and try to create oportunities and content they can experience

My core and the way enjoying this game very focused on nurturing …

You really need to work on your perspective and attitude.
Nobody told you here dont be yourself …
Also try to be more coherent same hour you post this in that thread you are leaving , while you had been telling other thread that you never leave .what. ???

I wonder where did you exactly find the word or idea in my post “selfish “ But i find in your post precisely where it is .

This is ahm… sound to me very selfish … best ship is friendship.and my executioner :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:
Byeee !

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Yes. In Brave Newbies I’ve followed quite a few of the classes some of the more veteran players give when I was new to the game. And I still sometimes follow classes about topics that seem interesting to me and I am bad at (tackle, lol).

Sure it doesn’t show them all there is in the game, but on a specific subject (such as how and what to mine in null, ratting in null, how to fly logi, fleet basics, tackle course) and enough to give newbies a good basis to try out that type of gameplay without overloading them with info.

The Brave Dojo is really helpful for newbies that want to know more about certain subjects. And I’m sure other newbie-friendly alliances also have similar programs to help newbies get into the game.

True, it’s a bit more boring than to just jump in to the action and try it out for yourself, but I find the mix of knowledge + experience to be better than to rely on experience alone as that can quickly get expensive.

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Playing the game with little ISK can be done in two ways:

  1. Find ways to make more ISK
  2. Have fun without much ISK

It’s nice to have a few sources of ISK, but I mostly focus on flying cheap myself.

I sometimes do exploration for ISK, used to have planets for PI (although I need to set that all up again…), and sometimes grab my salvage Imicus to clean a pile of wrecks after a big fight happened. It’s not a lot of ISK, but it’s enough for me…

because I mostly fly cheap ships. It’s rare to see me in something bigger than a frigate, unless (1) I don’t expect to lose the ship any time soon or (2) I fly the ship because my alliance needs me and is willing to pay ISK (ship replacement program) to pay me back most of the cost in case I die.

I don’t make a lot of ISK, but I also don’t spend a lot of ISK. Yet I have a lot of fun!

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It is player driven economy … Some mine, produce, some destroy some does both…

Which part you dont get it and why ?

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  1. Find ways to have fun, get good at it and make isk with it.
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That also works!

I may eventually get into abyssals. They seem fun.

They are. You can run t1s fairly easy in a frig. Makes decent cash.

If you can’t “make” ISK, then steal it.

The game allows it. Just the messenger here.

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Back in my newb days, I ran security missions for agents.

You won’t make endgame isk as a newb.

For newb exploration, I’d recommend wormhole diving from high sec. Dive into a wormhole, hack pirate relic/data sites, and return to high sec to drop off your loots.

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Hello

Please ignore all that I said last night. I was clearly in a state where my mind was messed up by injesting too many opioids. I can’t even find what the hell I was talking about and I make no sense even to myself.

Sorry…I’m really not that big of an asshole…

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Try out Faction Warfare… Go cheap… as you will have some losses until you learn the rules, but all the losses are easily compensated by the loyality points you get and to special faction warfare trading conditions for the loyality points. Furthermore, you will have a lot of interaction with other players, so no boring grinding necessary.

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