Hypernet - scam scheme - be aware!

[Solonius_Rex]

@Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras

So would a char named “cpp” xyz be trying to impersonate ccp? Theres a lot of char starting with cpp

According to Anderson gete-i mean Stefnia freir, yes.

They are gonna get banned.

Any day now…

…Maybe in a couple years.

Or a couple of decades…

[Solonius_Rex]

BTW, just out of curiosity, was your main, Anderson Geten, banned from the forums or something?

[stefnia_Freir]

@Solonius_Rex

Again, merely naming yourself NPC is not agains the TOS.

No, it’s not. I did not say that your name being the one of something else is enough.
Don’t pretend I did.
I was specifically talking in the context of a scam. Don’t make a comparison out of topic, it makes no sense.

EVE Online Naming Policy

  In-game names may not:
 
     Impersonate or parody an NPC type from the EVE game world (i.e. CONCORD or other official NPC corporation or organization members) for the purpose of misleading other players.

for the purpose of misleading other players.

A scam requires misleading, so a scam for which the name impersonates an NPC is a breach of that rule.

Of course you can do RP.
But then don’t try to scam people.

@Solonius_Rex

And if they dont lose it, ever?

That’s something you can’t predict.
You can’t say that something won’t happen. That’s why basing your opinion on something that did not happen is a fallacy.

@Solonius_Rex

The facts prove me right.

You are not talking facts.
Until the GM specifically states that this name and the usage made of it is not against the rules, you are making an argument from ignorance.

My post was about the rules that the OP should bring in his discussion with the GM.
This specific point was not AFAIK brought to the topic in that discussion.

[Solonius_Rex]

@stefnia_Freir

A scam requires misleading, so a scam for which the name impersonates an NPC is a breach of that rule.

It clearly says “From the EVE game world”, giving examples of Concord, or an NPC corporation.

In other words, i cannot pretend to be an NPC from Ishukone Corporation, or Concord.

But for something that does NOT exist in the EVE game world, like a wormhole NPC or a hypernet NPC?

Wormholes exist in EVE. Hypernet exists in EVE. But there are no known NPCs that are specifically affiliated with Wormholes, or hypernets. Calling myself a wormhole NPC and scamming, does not constitute a violating of the EVE online naming policy.

@stefnia_Freir

That’s something you can’t predict.

Neither can you.

Therefore, saying something like “All those characters kept their name until they lost it” is meaningless, because all those characters that kept their name and didnt lose it, exists. Thanks for proving my point.

@stefnia_Freir

Until the GM specifically states that this name and the usage made of it is not against the rules, you are making an argument from ignorance.

His response was from CCP support, i.e. the GMs.

The GM, basically states “We checked the game logs. Looks like you were scammed, it is the responsibility of the player who accepts the contract to check the details. You need to be more careful.”

It wasnt “Looks like their name was in violation of the ToS and naming requirements, we have reversed the contract and have banned/forced him to change his name”.

Which is exactly what they would do if you, for example, was scammed at the Character Bazaar. If you got scammed by sending 10 billion for a character transfer, then the other person says “Nah sorry this was a scam im not sending you any character”, the GMs response would NOT be “Hey, looks like you were scammed. Its your fault.”

This is absolutely a fact, as the OP posted his response from the GM. Therefore, no argument from ignorance.

[Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras]

i swear people try to read between lines that don’t exist.

I had someone before, said i didn’t fully tell the truth of what a GM stated, even a screenshot of the GM’s conversation, didn’t appease the person accusing me of lying about a GM.

I doubt if stefnia even seen a screenshot, or the actual conversation with the GM, they still wouldn’t believe it.

[Blenden]

The Hypernet raffle is not the crititcal point here, the fact that the Seller (@Hypemet Eve Who - Hypemet Itern Clairn) has been setting up a scam scheme (legally under Eve rules) is the topic here.

Watch out for similar (phishing or click bait) attacks.

[Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras]

@Blenden

he Hypernet raffle is not the crititcal point here, the fact that the Seller

so basically this was a PSA, not a OMG why was i scammed by ccp topic? which some people are making it seem.

[Uriel_the_Flame]

The explanation is simple: they know it’s true, and will never admit it, because it is against their narrative.

How do you define ganking, pvp and trolling

Good observation. Though I think it is also a personal thing to them as well on top of what you mention. I think they need self-justification so labeling opposing information as troll creates a false impression of righteousness in their mind and being able to act as if what they say is factual if they simply label facts that contradict them as trolling. A form of self-delusion. In a sense it is a less refined form of doublethink: “the act of simultaneously accepting two mutually contradicto…

[Zaera_Keena]

@stefnia_Freir

And I’ve just explained why this makes no sense when you actually try to think about it.

But you just said that you don’t

@Mr_Epeen

Always demand an escalation.

Well Mr Important, now we know why the GMs are so busy?

[stefnia_Freir]

@Solonius_Rex

Wormholes exist in EVE. Hypernet exists in EVE. But there are no known NPCs that are specifically affiliated with Wormholes, or hypernets. Calling myself a wormhole NPC and scamming, does not constitute a violating of the EVE online naming policy.

The “eve game world” is not limited to the existing corporations.
Hypernet exists in the game world, so if you impersonate an NPC type from hypernet, you impersonate an NPC type from the game world. If it was limited to corporations, it would be explained as such : “NPC type from the game corporations”.

So far, the first part of 2.b forbids impersonating people of CCP etc. without any restriction; the second part forbids impersonating an NPC in the general sense to mislead .

Maybe the GM will consider that only impersonating NPC from existing NPC corporation is an issue.
As it is written now, this limit to existing NPC corporations is not present.

Also the issue is not “AND scamming” but “TO scam”, that’s literally the part I greased out.
If you pretend to be a NPC from the game, in order to scam people, then that’s not allowed.
You can pretend you are an NPC AND scam people, as long as you don’t pretend to be an NPC TO scam people. Don’t try to misrepresent my words or CCP’s.

I know, you will again call that nitpicking, just because you can’t understand precise wording.
One thing is allowed, the other is not, you don’t get the difference but that’s not a reason to insult me.

@Solonius_Rex

Therefore, saying something like “All those characters kept their name until they lost it” is meaningless,

It’s meaningful as it allows me to explain you why your argument is void.
It’s an argument by the absurd.
I did not say that to pretend anything else, again learn to remain in the context.
Your interpretation that “it’s allowed because the name is still present” is absurd. That’s ALL I was saying.

You seem fond of making wild interpretations out of context.
That’s not adult discussion.

[Solonius_Rex]

@stefnia_Freir

The “eve game world” is not limited to the existing corporations.

Where does it say that? Do you have any evidence to back this up?

@stefnia_Freir

As it is written now, this limit to existing NPC corporations is not present.

And yet the examples they give, demonstrate what they are talking about.

@stefnia_Freir

Also the issue is not “AND scamming” but “TO scam”, that’s literally the part I greased out.
If you pretend to be a NPC from the game, in order to scam people, then that’s not allowed.
You can pretend you are an NPC AND scam people, as long as you don’t pretend to be an NPC TO scam people

In other words, I can name myself “Hypernet Item Claim” AND scam people, so long as I dont pretend to be an NPC TO scam people. If I dont say “I am working for CCP, I am an NPC created by CCP, here is the contract”, and my name is merely “hypemet itern clairn” and i send you a contract out of the blue, and scam you, that is not a violation of the EULA.

@stefnia_Freir

I know, you will again call that nitpicking, just because you can’t understand precise wording.

I never called anything you said as nit-picking. Are you talking to the right person?

@stefnia_Freir

One thing is allowed, the other is not, you don’t get the difference but that’s not a reason to insult me.

And, what, you didnt insult me constantly? But I dont bring it up, because i ignore the small quips here and there in order to concentrate on the arguments at hand, and to present actual arguments back. I dont really care if someone says “Are you stupid?” to me as long as they follow it up with an actual argument. I guess i just have a thicker skin than you, and actually care about arguments and evidence.

@stefnia_Freir

Your interpretation that “it’s allowed because the name is still present” is absurd. That’s ALL I was saying.

But it isnt.

A character named “Hypermet Itern Clairn”, sending out a contract for a hypernet item that was just won, in order to scam the opponent, is either agains the EULA/ToS or it isnt.

I hope we can both agree with that.

The scam victim sent out a ticket.

Customer service, i.e. the GMs, can respond in one of two ways.

1. “Yes, this is a violation of the EULA. He chose that name specifically to make people believe it was official. We will be contracting back your item and banning his name”.

2. “You were scammed. Sorry, scams are a part of eve. It is up to the player to confirm that the contract is legitimate and properly written, before they accept”.

Now, does this mean that CCP may not reverse its decision one day and deem it to be a violation of the EULA/ToS? Of course not. They own the company, they can do whatever they want.

BUT.

ALL of the available evidence points to the fact that this isnt a violation of the EULA. No ToS was broken. The GMs say it wasnt.

And UNTIL we have facts to the contrary, we can only go by the evidence.

[stefnia_Freir]

@Solonius_Rex

In other words, I can name myself “Hypernet Item Claim” AND scam people, so long as I dont pretend to be an NPC TO scam people.

Nope. You are not allowed to present yourself as an NPC either.
Which is what you do when you make a contract.
You don’t need to say anything, suffice to present as an NPC TO scam people.

@Solonius_Rex

Customer service, i.e. the GMs, can respond in one of two ways.

1. “Yes, this is a violation of the EULA. He chose that name specifically to make people believe it was official. We will be contracting back your item and banning his name”.
2. “You were scammed. Sorry, scams are a part of eve. It is up to the player to confirm that the contract is legitimate and properly written, before they accept”.

THAT we disagree on.
You don’t know what the ticket was. You can’t assume it was specifically about the naming of the scammer. And you can’t assume the answer was about the naming.

So just because the GM said it was a scam, and scams are allowed, does not talk about the specific topic of the name.

@Solonius_Rex

ALL of the available evidence points to the fact that this isnt a violation of the EULA. No ToS was broken. The GMs say it wasnt.

No, the GM did not say it wasn’t.
He said it was a scam. You are making an argument from ignorance.

If the victim does not bring the name of the scammer in the topic, but only asks “where is my astero”, the GM will not even look at the name of the scammer.
That’s exactly why I brought up this topic.
And I may be wrong ! Maybe the GM will say “This name and its usage are not against the ToS”. But so far, and until he does that, your claim “the GM said it isn’t” is you talking out of your arse. And the fact someone else could have not fallen into it does not change anything to that.

[Solonius_Rex]

@stefnia_Freir

Nope. You are not allowed to present yourself as an NPC either.
Which is what you do when you make a contract.
You don’t need to say anything, suffice to present as an NPC TO scam people.

So any character with the name “NPC” are not allowed to scam?

@stefnia_Freir

You don’t know what the ticket was. You can’t assume it was specifically about the naming of the scammer. And you can’t assume the answer was about the naming.

Actually, they do. Its in the post. The GM specifically says the astero was contrracted to another character, and even posts the specific date and time. Which means they took a look at the specifics of the contract.

But im actually okay with removing that. Again:

A character named “Hypermet Itern Clairn”, sending out a contract for a hypernet item that was just won, in order to scam the opponent, is either agains the EULA/ToS or it isnt.

Do you disagree with this?

@stefnia_Freir

And I may be wrong ! Maybe the GM will say “This name and its usage are not against the ToS”. But so far, and until he does that, your claim “the GM said it isn’t” is you talking out of your arse. And the fact someone else could have not fallen into it does not change anything to that.

So youre saying that there is a possibility that the GM does think this is a violation of the Eula/ToS, and is punishing Hypemet Itern Clairn, but that the GM isnt telling Blenden this, or refuding his item? And is merely stating that scams are legal in eve?

[Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras]

Why dont you report the name then @stefnia_Freir

[Solonius_Rex]

And disprove his own worldview?

[Spring_Sky]

I feel iffy because
Hypnet Itern Clairn

Sounds like an ordinary name.
Is it a little underhanded sure, is it cheeky you bet but let’s be honest how many hours of sleep deprivation you gotta go through to believe this guy is an authority of anything?

If it read Hypernet Item Claim
Yea id at least of my own personal opinion say that might cross a line, it’s not a name or call sign

I agree with Uriel, in a game like eve it’s about choices and decisions. If your not reading the contracts I can promise you an aetron is the least of your problems.

I myself newbro a month and a half into the game have found people thinking I’m an alt of some player named Cat Sky that ran his mouth about the fam and got wrecked so hard some say you can still hear him crying in wow. A quick discord chat fixes this, but still let’s be honest it’s less then flattering being accused of being some guy thats whole claim to fame was self pity and shame so much shame but I’m rambling apologies.

Should I be auto targeted and disbarred from corporations because my superior character name shares the same last name of a failed muppet pilot?

I feel that newbro pilot Hypnet Itern Clairn is an innocent homie, and that he should be allowed to fly free from these hostile accusations. He should file a counter suit for defamation of character as the level of slander against him has reached an egregious level. The damage is done, the people demand justice for Mr Clairn.

If anyone is the victim in this it’s this guy for sure.

CCP you know in your heart what the right thing to do is.

[Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras]

oh, i have no issue with the scammy character in question… stefnia thinks its trying to impersonate ccp when there is no npc character even closely resembling that name, nor were they claiming they were from ccp no doubt…

[Spring_Sky]

Lost track while in agreement with you and Uriel. Apologies, as I was emphasizing your points or at least trying too.

[ISD_Drew]

Removed several off topic posts.

One note on this topic – if you believe someone is behaving in a way that violates the games rules, please report that behavior to the GM team directly. https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us/articles/360011834800-Contacting-Support

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