Presented that way, I can understand. However in your original presentation it seems more like you’re suggesting we all line up to be disembowelled for a quiet life.
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Well, if it works.
Ms. Kim respects people who will back their beliefs with force, Ms. Ember, whether they succeed or not. Just getting disemboweled by itself probably won’t satisfy. Formally making an earnest attempt to kill her seems to work pretty well even if it fails.
I put it out there in the full awareness that a lot of people won’t consider it an option. Ms. Priano considers it archaic, wasteful, etc., but actually I respectfully kind of think that’s pre-capsule thinking. We’re kinda-sorta immortals, and Ms. Kim doesn’t seem to be one to try to change that. She’s satisfied with iterating an opponent, or being iterated. Or even just fighting until one cannot continue.
Really, I think duels (that involve no other living person) are a pretty decent approach to dispute resolution among our kind, maybe especially where the real problem is something like a personality conflict.
Hm. That said, I don’t usually accept duels. I guess I’ll have to think about this a little more.
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I’d prefer a system whereby a person’s intellect and coherence grant them respect, not their willingness to play with knives.
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Well, I like that system, too. Just, there are and always will be people who want me to prove my sincerity by action and not by word. Being as I’m not awful with either words or stabbing people I guess I don’t feel like I should have to pick just one when both are useful in different situations.
There is the issue of getting out of practice if you don’t do a lot of something, though. I’m not all that good as a ship to ship duelist right now. I could change that, but, there’s other stuff I want to do, too, that seems like it might be more important?
I understand there’s a new type of circadian seeker out there, with tackling capability. Drifter stuff’s … a little important. Given the choice…
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Drifter stuff is far more important. I’m going to stick to not valuing the respect of those who wish me to purchase it by force. I’m fairly certain you won’t mind.
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Correct~!
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Oh, Maker!
Thank you, @Mika_Firestorm! I don’t know what to say else.
Please excuse me for everything I told about you and for punching, I am terribly sorry!
If there’s something I can do for you, please don’t hesitate to ask!
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That’s incorrect statement about my person, Ms. Jenneth, and I’ll recommend you to watch your tongue.
Belief is just a belief, and it doesn’t have to be backed by force. And so far I can boldly state, that I haven’t killed (or even assaulted, or challenged) anyone so far only for their belief.
We are fighting the war, and while, for example, some Gallente might claim they fight for beliefs (like democracy, like freedom and similar worhthless crap), we are fighting for people lives, for territory and assets. We protect what we create from those, who want to destroy it or take it from us.
I think, however, I derailed it a bit to different side away from the duels. What do I consider people must back with force, is their aggression. And what people should defend with the force, is their honor. For me, as Caldari, the honor is more valuable than my life, and thus I will fight anyone who will dare to slander me or insult my honor or my uniform I wear.
This has nothing to do with beliefs or opinions or discussions.
When I challenge someone to fight during a discussion, it means they have already broke rules of civil conversation.
Then why don’t you? Serious question, Diana: if you’re insisting upon defending your honor ‘with force’, then you can’t complain about people not coming to you to let you. You need to take the fight to them, or there’s no force, just empty words. So if you’re all about defending your honor with force… why don’t you? Why do you wait for them to come to you?
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I think I’ve answered similar question multiple times already, besides it really wasn’t hard to guess. But fine, I’ll bring explanation for those, who aren’t smart enough to get it themselves.
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Those, who start the insult or slander - it’s them, who start the conflict. I by default look to fight only for my State and this scum is just a distraction for me. If they want to conflict, let them come.
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It is usual that the one, who is being challenged chooses the weapon and one who issues the challenge offers the place.
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I can be quite liberal and might even come to the challenged - but in the most cases I consider it a waste of my precious time, that they should deserve first. I can negotiate the location as well, but if I feel they try to push unfair rules or suggest place that is not acceptable, I am getting adamant about picking only my offers and lose interest in further negotiations, unless a third party would decide to intervene.
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And finally, the point in the duel is in it being a duel - an arranged fight between two people. That means that coming to hunt them down isn’t really it. And if they will refuse the duel, it already defends my honor as is, because it will mean that they lack honor to stand for their words, and if they lack honor, then it’s their words that are empty, and mine are not (considering I did issue the challeng them).
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But you can’t have it both ways. You can’t say ‘I will defend my honor with force’ and then… let them continue to slander you. That’s not defending your honor. That’s bluster and words and no force backing them up.
And please understand that I’m not saying this to make an accusation, Diana. I’m simply telling you something you don’t seem to get: If you don’t take action to ‘defend your honor’ while loudly proclaiming that you will, then the perception that you create is that you’re incapable of doing so, or that your words are empty, and should be ignored.
If you say you will use force, you must use force. Insisting that you’ll use force if someone comes and lets you do it is creates the impression that you can’t defend your own honor without their permission. And nobody’s going to take you seriously under those conditions. They’ll simply continue to insult your honor, knowing that you won’t actually defend it, you’ll just loudly claim to do so, without actually taking the necessary steps to back your words up. And while you might not like that idea, if you look at the way you’re consistently treated and dismissed by the majority of the people you talk to… you’ll see it’s already happening.
I don’t think that’s the impression you want to give people, Diana. I don’t think you want people to think that you really stand for nothing, or that the uniform you wear means nothing when weighed against your own bluster and pride. But it’s the impression you do give other people, of yourself, and of the State Protectorate, every time you demand someone else travel to you so that you can defend your honor.
When your honor is the one that gets offended, you have to be the one to do more than talk. Anything less is empty, and meaningless.
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I AM defending my honor by challenging them. Is it so incredibly hard concept to understand? Probably not, probably it’s just you… as always.
No, see, that’s just it: By challenging them, you change nothing. Your words don’t stop them. Your words don’t demonstrate any actual conviction. Your words are as empty as theirs. And you know that, because you’re seeking to defend your honor with force, not with words.
So unless you take the steps needed to actually use force, rather than just asking them to let you use force (which is what you’re doing when you say you’ll duel if they’ll be so generous as to kindly come to you), you’re not actually defending your honor… you’re talking about defending your honor.
And talk, after all, is cheap.
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Interesting anecdote. Once, some time after Kim’s farcical challenge to me, I offered to scout her into the wormhole system I was in (a Drifter Hive system, at the time), and provide her my exact location and information on what I was flying.
Understandably, she had no interest in going out of her way to revenge herself upon me.
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Counterwise, I change everything.
I do as I say, I am willing to use that force and show that.
If they are honorable and can stand for their words - then we fight.
And if they are just frothing idiots, covering in their hiding holes and go only like “Nah, I won’t fight you. Well, you can come find me and kill me,” why would I waste my time on that scum? They already show they lack honor, and that I have honor to challenge them. They already invalidate their words by their unability to stand for them.
They are nothing and they are no match for me. Why a honorable Caldari Officer should chase dishonorable scum for what they tell if their words were already devalued?
They are the trash, you treat them as a trash and you show everyone they are trash. Nothing more is needed.
If you fail to understand it this time, then I don’t know what to add. Stop writing, maybe, and making yourself a laughing stock in here. Because I DO defend my honor, and I will fight those, whom I challenge, if they have honor to accept the challenge. And I am stating it quite clearly, for even someone like a goon to be able to understand.
Except the evidence says you don’t: Nobody has ever stopped speaking poorly of you because of one of your threatened duels. You claim you’re willing to use force, but you don’t use force unless they let you use force.
So are you doing anything, or are they mocking you by demonstrating that they have the power to decide whether or not you’ll fight? Because you’re giving them that power. And by doing so, you’re showing your own weakness.
‘If they are honorable’… some people might say that sounds like more conditions and excuses to weasel out of fighting.
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Except they don’t have any power, I’ve shown I am willing to fight, and they just crawl under their rock and keep barking. It’s they, who are weak, not me.
And on their dirty words I can simply say that they are liars and they are dishonorable scum. And just my word will be more powerful than them, because I have honor, and they do not. I don’t lie, and they do.
And I don’t even have to pay attention at what they say, since if it will just slightly damage my reputation or reputation of the State, I simply reply that they are dishonorable liars, because THEY gave me that power with their cowardice, and I can call them like that with keeping my honor intact.
They are nothing but worthless barking trash, and everyone shall know this.
When they accept the duel, it can go any way, I can die, or they can die… But the moment they refuse, I already won. If they dare to lift their head, I’ll push them down into dirt.
Now, I don’t know much about honour, but to me it looks like Kim here just wants to fight as many capsuleers as possible and is baiting everyone that cares to listen with outlandish and self-contradictory statements. Such as the one that she doesn’t lie. I seen it!
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Of course they have power. You’re handing it to them. Will you fight them? It’s entirely up to them. You can issue the challenge all you like, but they’re the ones who get to decide. They’re the ones who determine whether or not you have the chance to make good on your claims.
As long as you sit at home, you can’t. You’ve given that power away. By doing nothing but barking, while they laugh at you for not having the courage to come shut them up.
But you won’t. You’ll just bark.
Just as an aside: if you’re saying them refusing to come fight you is cowardice… then you have to hold yourself to the same standard. You not going to fight them is exactly the same thing.
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