Kill Rights could be bounties, CCPLEASE!

This just popped into my head this morning during my morning toilet.

Why? Because currently “bounties” and “kill rights” are a poop mechanic.

However they can easy be fixed by reversing one and renaming it to the other. WTF am I talking about?

Actual bounties.

You see, kill rights make no sense. Why would I pay to kill someone? Usually kill rights are a scam anyway. And, if I have a kill right on someone, why does it need to be “activated”? Why can’t I just shoot them? This “activation” mechanic is cumbersome.

Bounties used to make no sense - just pod yourself with an alt and collect the full amount. Now, bounties are less exploitable, but also nobody cares about them. No one is going to go out of their way to shoot someone cuz they have a bounty, no matter how high. And it’s not like a bounty makes someone a legal target.

BUT, there is a way these two mechanics can be merged together.

Xuixien’s New and Improved Bounty System

Let’s say someone commits a crime against you (suicide gank in hisec, blow up your innocent pod in lowsec, etc). You now get a killright against them - a 15-30 day “limited engagement timer”. You make this killright available to others through the bounty system.

By placing a bounty, you make that killright/engagement timer available to whoever you want. Let’s say for the sake of example, you place a 100 million ISK “bounty” on them. You can set it to public, or private - the new and improved menu option allows you to list multiple pilots or organizations. These pilots/groups can now “accept” the bounty so that they also have a 15-30 day “limited engagement timer” with the pilot in question. And every time they kill that pilot, they get a percentage of the bounty. But an appreciable percentage of the bounty, not some silly nickel and dime formula - maybe something like 75% of the value of the ship and 50% of the value of the fitted modules (some math wizard needs to figure out the percentage for modules cuz it can’t be exploitable and modules have like a 50% chance to drop).

Once the bounty reaches zero, the kill right/bounty thing is resolved and goes away. All “limited engagement timers” resolve and go away.

This would make actual bounty hunting viable for hunters, but would make self-clearing a non-cost-effective endeavor. It would matter not-at-all for people below -5, but, for everyone else, it would create a lot of potential for content and add an interesting and meaningful layer of complex gameplay for the hunted and the hunters.

In summary:

  • A personal kill right opens a one-way limited engagement timer from the victim to the aggressor that lasts for a period of 15-30 days. During this period the victim is free to start an engagement with the aggressor. CONTENT!
  • The victim can also offer a bounty, which allows the recipient of the offer to “accept” the offer. Accepting the offer then opens a one-way (from the recipient to the aggressor) limited engagement timer.
  • The bounty is paid out as a high, but not exploitable, percentage of the ship + modules fitted.
  • Once the bounty reaches zero, the engagement timer for everyone resolves.

CCPLEASE.

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It’s not an overall bad idea. Though, I can’t see why a ganker should be a continued target.

With the current system, once blown up and the kill right have been used, you’d have gotten your revenge. And, the guy also got some from bounties too in the work of your hunt for revenge.

With your system, you’re not only once a target, but a target over and over from one sessions doing. That would do either of the two: kill ganking all together, or have alts blow yourself up over and over again (exploits of the system). Even a minor ISK generation would make that be worth it, rather than having to actively fight off other gankers that have little risks, as CONCORD won’t be an issue for them (from my understanding of your suggestion).

There’s (in my opinion) not enough balance in favour of the ganker, and would (again, in my opinion) simply kill content, rather than creating it. I don’t think you’d be able to create a perfect, or even close it, system for this. It will either be exploited, or be nearly worthless.

So just exploitable like regular bounties. You can’t just say “the payout will be a high but not exploitable percentage”. Just saying something isn’t exploitable doesn’t actually make it so.

I’m sure a smart boy like you could figure out the math.

If you only get 75% of the value it’s not worth blowing yourself up, is it? You don’t make any money. And if you do it to clear the bounty (assuming the bounty is even available to a character you control), that’s a pretty high cost of operation.

Why? Most gankers are already permanently engageable.

I suppose if you’re rich enough to throw the ships away (assuming you control characters on which the bounty is available), you could exploit the system to get rid of the bounty, but it would be costly.

Wow, a Bounty System change suggestion that doesn’t involve Killrights for ISK. Impressive :+1:

The only issue is that CCP stated they wanted players to be able to put bounties on literally anyone. If you could only get bounties on people that committed a criminal act against you, it would go against that. Though, I would say that’s a tiny price for a “fixed” bounty system. If you want to put a price on someone else’s head for crap posting on reddit or the forums, you can still do that.

Sometimes CCP is wrong and makes dumb decisions.

Interesting- under your proposal, would insurance eligibility be effected by it? In other words, if I have a large bounty on me, could I buy max insurance for my ship?

I didn’t finish reading your post yesterday and today when I clicked on iti it jumped to 2nd post so I read the responses and get to this discussion.

In my opinion, what makes killing yourself for bounty profitable is mainly insurance. If we could disable ensurance to be paid when killright was activated, it would allowed to grant higher percentage of ship’s price than we have now and still not make it profitable to exploit. But 75% is probably still too much.

Either way I will add one of my ideas on bounty system improvements - give 75% or more of the worth from kill pods. Implants cannot be insured nor salvaged or looted back so why not? Maybe you can fit it into your idea.

Most is up for argument, but people are not additionally rewarded by killing them. The balance here shouldn’t be for profit, but the content. One side is overly rewarded, while the other is not.

Others have already pointed it out, but insurance will enable a cost-effective way to handle that. And if I were a ganker, I would make a large corporation of bounty huntes, just to get a hold on as many “kill-rights” as possible.
Don’t forget, the majority that is ganked are also solo players that doesn’t interact with the overall game. So you’d simply have to advertise a lot.

Not all gankers are, though.
Gate gankers in Vexors would be severely punished.
A new player trying ganking a pod even more so.

This isn’t reasonable at all.
The punishment is cruel AND unusual.

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I agree that the suggestion as is needs work, however, I can’t help but marvel at all the people who think that this would be too harsh on gankers/pirates.

  1. Ganking/pirating is a choice and it has to have consequences that fit the action. The current mechanic for this is a joke. Assuming the player ganking is a single character in the group and not the entire group, the personal risk is two ships (one to gank one to clear the kill right, if its ever activated) and a criminal timer. Being -10 in highsec is annoying but can be fixed in a few days if necessary.
  2. With alpha clones you can easily have an entire army of gank ready characters to switch into. This not only subverts one of the features of this suggestion (limited time engagement), but also negates the argument that this would kill ganking.
  3. Most new players (not alts) can hardly navigate the menus and UI. The chances that they will find the safety and attempt a gank are very low. A large, one time pop-up would be all the warning a player needs and fits the current system of warning new players about risky actions.

tl/dr: Only casual gankers/pirates will be dissuaded by this which better reflects that ganking/pirating is more of a lifestyle than a Sunday afternoon activity.

Man, I’ve read the exact same meaning with different words dozens of times already
and every single time it’s exposed that the person who posted it
is yet another random ass hater who has no clue what he’s talking about.

Seriously, the exact same ■■■■■■■■. That level of mindshare is just ■■■■■■■ amazing.
Is there a pinwall with posts stuck on it somewhere and you guys just randomly pick one?

You really need to explain how this is actually relevant … because it isn’t. Ganking isn’t a “LifeStyle”. It’s an activity like any other. There is no “LifeStyle”, it’s a game. There also aren’t any “PlayStyles”, they’re called “activities”. “PlayStyles” is made up by the hyper-individualistic narcissists who, weirldy enough, are the same people who cry about ganking the loudest.

Don’t project your inability to seperate reality from fiction onto everyone else.

Just look at your ■■■■■■■■:

It has. You’re ignoring that.

You have no idea of what a gankers risk actually is. You just wrongly equate it with losing his ship, because you don’t know better and you’re definitely not going to try to learn.

It either costs a fortune or it can’t, in no way or form, be fixed in a few days.
You have never done any of this to a reasonable extent,
yet you have the audacity to declare what is doable or reasonable.

No, you can’t. That’s evidenced by the fact that there’s no one doing it and they’d get banned for it anyway. They’d not get to keep their ■■■■ either, because it’d just get confiscated from whoever has it. That’s what CCP does. They don’t let anyone get away with ill gotten gains.

You’re just exactly like the next guy who says the same things,
doesn’t actually understand what he’s talking about,
while trying to hide behind a fake good/reasonable personality.

It’s easy to tell that this really is the case,
because in your perspective it’s personal.

That’s evidenced by your “LifeStyle” statement, which is nonsense.

Dismissed.

2 Likes

Of course you can. I was doing it a lot and would still do that if my sub ended and I didn’t planned on extending it. I have 8 accounts with a gank character on each of them, when alpha I can play one gank alt then when I gank someone I relog to avoid wait the criminal timer or to avoid multiple killrights that are set against me (which is not needed, current killright mechanic is a joke). This is perfectly legit and this is what is OP talking about. Not about multiboxing alpha clones.

Also PlayStyles exists. Not sure what would that be in EVE but for example in LoL you can play same character in same lane and still play it differently - which is your playstyle. I suppose if you want to make an example in EVE it would be the way how you do certain activity, you can mine ore in various ways and it is still one activity whether you do it via jetcannining in Covetor/Hulk or afk mining in Procurer or fleet mining where you talk with other players during that. This is playstyle.

Firstly, thank you for the personal attacks. Second, I understand your issue with the wording I used. If you want to refer to it as an activity and treat it as such you can. However, while the content of the game is fictional the player interactions are very real.

Also I have ganked before on this character and on an alt. I did it as an activity and it is my personal opinion that highsec ganking does not have a sufficient consequence and it should be reevaluated.

As for your other comments on my arguments:

  1. What risks are there other than ships and standing?
  2. The XXX millions of isk to repair standing is not a high number give the number of ways a player can earn multiple billions a day (this does assume a reasonably skilled player, however, basing mechanic decisions on low sp/ unskilled players alone invites exploitation).
  3. As @Vokan_Narkar stated, my comment was not meant to suggest that the alpha clones were active simultaneously. Just that you could avoid the penalties by logging into a different character.
1 Like

Guys,

I think what people are missing is how limited these new bounties would be. Perhaps I misspoke or didn’t explain clearly:

The “kill right” is for the victim - it creates a one way LET to the aggressor for 15-30 days or whatever.

The “bounty” is what the victim makes available to specific other players or organizations. When they accept the bounty, it opens the one way LET.

I understand some of the criticisms and I appreciate them where they’re constructive. Perhaps bounty hunters would have to “buy in” (aka pay off CONCORD) to accept the bounty, like a %age, which they would get back via successfully hunting the target. (Perhaps this could be an ISK sink). I think the cost of buy in should be low enough not to discourage legitimate hunting, but high enough that it would be a meaningful decision.

And yes, I would imagine insurance wouldn’t cover being bounty hunted.

That would be a little tricky too, but doable. Can just see the outcry when they can’t catch their target :laughing:. Could also be a deposit you’d get back in either case. CONCORD would ofc take its handling fees, creating a minor sink, but nothing players would miss out on.

1 Like

Fine. Okay.

Did you finally tell people your ganking char,
or is there still no evidence that you’re not just making it up?

I have no idea why you start talking about other games.

In EVE the weirdos declare everything a playstyle. This guy’s is mission running, that guys is mining. That other guys is gate camping. They think it’s a playstyle as if it was something that defined ones self and that he is stuck with. Carebear “logic”.

1 Like

Send me PM ingame and I will link you my main. BTW if your alts doesn’t have individual suicide ganks on their behalf, you cannot compare to me in slightest. I ve done ten times more ganks in hs than you.

I doubt that … and even if, what’s that supposed to mean?
That you’re better? That’s laughable. :smiley:

Are you playing it easy-mode using scouting alts? :slight_smile:

Solstice Project from April 2012 to December 2013
Solecist Project
Solstice Projekt

:blush:

1 Like