Logi love and love for logi <3


(elitatwo) #1

Why is the scimitar so bad? (Because it’s minmatar…)

Jokes aside, I strongly believe that the scimitar could use a tad more powergrid, like 200mj more. As single or solo-logi that ship is bad, very bad and compared to the Oneiros you should not undock with that.
I don’t want to compare shield and armor fitting requirements but I can fit 4x t2 large remote reps on an Oneiros but when you put 4x t2 large shield x-fers on a scimitar, you want to rip your hair out.


(Cade Windstalker) #2

That’s what PG rigs are for?

If you try to get the same buffer onto it as an Oneiros of course you’re going to have problems. Its primary tank is sig and speed.


(elitatwo) #3

The Oneiros is fine as she is.

I was trying to but a shield booster for miner repairs on the scimitar but it seems it wasn’t designed to do that. Oh well it’s just an minmatar boat.


(Cartheron Crust) #4

Everything doesn’t have to be the equal. -_-

What next? “Why does my 1600plate reduce speed? My armor rep doesn’t. Change it plz.”


(Cade Windstalker) #5

Yup, the Scimitar is pretty fitting limited on the whole but it’s by no means a bad ship.

If you wanted to put a Shield Booster on there you could probably do it, but you wouldn’t get much out of it and you’d need to be running some kind of cap boosted fit probably.


(elitatwo) #6

Thanks, Cade!

After days of trying I did it. I even managed to fit at least the large meta remote shield boosters. And about minmatar being bad, that is just that role playing thing I do on TQ.


(Cade Windstalker) #7

Don’t get me wrong, I’m considering what you’re saying seriously, and it’s definitely true that out of all the Logi hulls the Scimi has the fewest viable fitting choices currently. I’m just not sure how you could really change that without making it pretty stupidly good for a lot of its current applications.


(elitatwo) #8

Ah okay I get that. See that is my pickle here, I have only been able to play with the simulator - which is close to perfect - and flying matar ships for the last few days on SiSi, so I can undock with it.

Unfortunately flying a logi boat is so very unpopular these days, where isboxing character-bot armies are all the rage and some nooblets are holding grudges and need to “really show me how big their sooper doopers are” or something.
I am still struggling to find an application with that boat which can be as realistic as possible. At least some of the killmails I have seen make sense now, there is no other way this could have fit on that boat (when someone shows me a killmail on TQ and it’s a matar boat, I make snarky comments about matar on comms…)

Anyhow I have tried to get maybe 100gj powergrid, nothing more.


(Arrendis) #9

It’s pretty simple, really: Stop trying to fit it like an Oneiros. Just like you don’t fit it with an MWD if you want any staying power at all. For solo work, instead of meta Larges, spend the money for Pith A-type mediums. Functionally the same range as the Large s95, comparable reps, much easier on fitting and capacitor. Yes, it adds 200M to the cost of the ship, but you’re the one flying without a logi buddy.

I know that seems callous and dismissive, but there’s 11 people in your corp, and 102 in your alliance. They shouldn’t leave you with your rear flapping in the breeze like that. Your logi losses have come in gangs that clearly show role specialization. They could’ve found someone for a second Basilisk. Also, never ever fly an AB Basilisk. It’s slightly slower than an armor-tanked titan’s wreck. Especially don’t use one with a gang that’s flying MWD-fitted ships.

For solo work, use the Scimitar and have your gang throw shield bots on you. For MWD work, get someone else to bring a second Basilisk. The Basilisk/Osprey isn’t like the Augoror, where you can down-size and get a full rack of small reppers without cap problems. You don’t have enough low slots to make it work.

Just some advice from a neighbor who does a little logi-ing here and there.


(elitatwo) #10

Figures. Did I mention, I have been able to sit (as in “not flying”), in a minmatar boat for only 8 days and only on SiSi now?
Yeah, that’s right. I am looking and fiddling with them only for a week now, so I will not have figured this out yet. And your scimitar with only 2 medium reps will not be very good. I guess you do know that those A-types do cost 100m each.

But details aside, I guess you are right. When I compared the logi ships from each race I kinda skipped over the scimitar bonuses since I won’t be flying that boat anyways and figured out correctly that I wanted to make the Basilisk work solo.
She does and them easter eggs only need all of their incompetent blobbh muppetts to kill it and only 25 of them, op success.

I was confused that both the Oneiros and the scimitar have that odd remote tracking enhancer bonus, so I assumes they would or could be fit in a similar way.

Question, did you ever have a use case for that remote tracking enhancer bonus?

This is what happened, my alliance mates wanted to me to do things, I told them I wouldn’t but I would be willing to do this totally foreign thing which they didn’t understand, staying on the field, while they wanted me to yolo isk in exploding and liking it.
I will never like exploding, that’s why I came up with this idea of flying logi. I know you want to fly a scimitar for solo work but making the Basilisk do it, is yet another challenge.

My observation about the state of the scimitar would be the only case of looking out for fellow logi pilot who do fly them which doesn’t bring me any benefits.
So this gave me the challenge to fly logi all by myself and doing things all by myself as always. Together we solo :frowning:

Yeay me


(Arrendis) #11

If you’re running a Basilisk solo, without other folks feeding you cap, you’re underperforming. I’m not saying you’re doing it badly, cuz obviously you’re making do with what you’ve got, but trust me, get a cap buddy and you’ll be living in a completely different world.

But no, I’ve never run into a situation where we wanted our Oneiroi or Scimitars running Remote Tracking Computers. It feels like it’s a straight-up ‘we gave the Guardian and Basilisk cap transfers, we have to give these something’ move, and it’s a completely wasted bonus.

As for the ‘logi vs yolo’ thing… Logistics is a force multiplier. Having just one along makes a gang far more capable, just like proper ewar assets or boosts. In large-scale fighting, you’re the most important ship on the field: if there’s enough logi, the enemy can’t kill anything it can’t drop in a single volley. If there isn’t enough logi, your fleet goes home.

There’s a time for diving in and getting blown up in a glorious fireball of destruction, and there’s a time for actually holding the field. Don’t be afraid of dying (I mean, I assume you’re not, or you wouldn’t be out in null), but even the yolo fleets get to take a lot more people down if they’ve got a logi or two.

You’re on the right track, as far as being a useful and thoughtful member of your alliance goes. At least, that’s my take on it. You’re looking at options, trying to figure out how things work, if there’s something you missed, and trying to be better at what is (no matter what the yolos tell you) one of the most critical fleet roles in null, low, high, or j-space. It’s the kind of attitude I really like to see in my logi guys, and it’ll take you pretty far if you want it to. A good logi pilot is an asset to any group.


(elitatwo) #12

Thank you dear!

I have been getting a very similar feedback on the test server, where I try out new fits or make changes to already existing ones. I can tell from experience that 100mn logi may be slow and bulky to fly but the benefit is, you will not get downed by any fighter, or any light missile ball of fire.

And since you looked it up already, I do love my remote armor reps <3.


(Arrendis) #13

Yeah, 100mn logi has a lot of issues: you don’t accelerate well, your turning radius is measured in au, PG becomes an issue… but it has its benefits, too. Definitely something to know how to use (and when to use).


(Frostys Virpio) #14

It is indeed extremely niche but they see use in incursions.


(Arrendis) #15

Eh, there’s better ways to get the tracking in an incursion.


(Frostys Virpio) #16

It was more a point of “what should we use those med slot for” when the fleet was bling enough.


(Arrendis) #17

On a shield logi? Tank. On an Oneiros? Neut protection.


(Frostys Virpio) #18

The mindset was kind of crazy and a bit risky but it worked. More tank was seen as a waste because stuff stayed alive anyway. I know people flew stuff like that and never lost them for example.

[Scimitar, TVP HQ - Scimitar LSE L5]
True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay
True Sansha Capacitor Power Relay
True Sansha Power Diagnostic System
True Sansha Power Diagnostic System

Corelum B-Type 10MN Afterburner
Shadow Serpentis Remote Tracking Computer
Shadow Serpentis Remote Tracking Computer
Shadow Serpentis Remote Tracking Computer
Thukker Large Shield Extender

Large Remote Shield Booster II
Large Remote Shield Booster II
Large Remote Shield Booster II
Large Remote Shield Booster II

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II

I don’t think it’s a good investment but it sure as hell got you a spot faster on a HS HQ fleet than a less crazy fit. Same for stuff like bling shield vindicator getting ahead of other vindi because you provide a second web instead of fitting an extra tank mod in the mids.


(Arrendis) #19

Yeah, and all it takes is a few suicide gankers coming in to get everyone dead.

And jeez, T2 Larges? Medium Pith A-types, your rig slots will thank you :wink:


(Frostys Virpio) #20

The gank don’t seem to happen often. Only time I’ve seen a try, they went for a Vindicator that was overly bling and failed because aggro swapped. I think part of the gank issue is how people want to go for shiny KM so a scimitar is seen as a bad target.

As for T2 large, I really don’t know why they went that route. I was not making those fits and would not of though of it myself to be honest. That was before Logi got their tiericide tho so maybe it was not viable back then? I don’t remember all of that.

But I mean, the point you made still stands, their usage is extremely niche and even still questionable when you push real hard on min/maxing.