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Once. And when you have enough copies you start producing and then keep copying while you produce, continuously feeding more copies into your production. Obviously, you can also just buy more BPOs and with many items, especially cheap things, that’s actually preferable for most people. But for expensive BPOs that’s quite an investment. You’ll have to sell a lot of Tataras to recover the cost for your however many BPOs you have bought.

I need 6 days to copy a Tatara Build set but 10 days to build just the final structure. Copying can easily keep up with your BPO madness.

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And you still produce less than you would have by directly producing it.
Look at the number I gave for the gleam S. You take MORE time to copy 36 runs than to manufacture 36 runs.

If I simulate the 10/20 BPO (no implant, no structure, but max skills) it’s 8D 4H per tatara cycle, and 7D 9H to copy it. I just don’t get how you can have such a difference in times, besides using a 0/0 BPO while we are talking about 10/20 BPOs.

You dont get the difference in numbers because you keep ignoring that a regular (in terms what the majority has to do) BPC can never by like the BPOs in terms of research which is a huge difference in itself.

You also keep ignoring the added costs for anyone either buying the BPCs off the market or inventing which at the minimum requires datacores. To get anywhere near decent values in ME/TE add some dycryptor and you are already financially and time wise at a huge disadvantage. You can easily make more copies of your BPO in the exact same time with a lot more runs on them - guaranteed on top of that and not like a gamble as in invention.

That’s why a first grader gets the numbers that you keep ignoring. Try to open your tunnel view a bit out of what you obviously deem to be your process as it doesnt apply to anyone else not owning a T2 BPO - which is the majority as the T2 BPO lottery was supposed to be a ‘compromise’ back in the days as the invention process wasnt even finished in the game design then.

Your claim is that you can double the production of a T2 BPO by copying it. It’s wrong, you can’t.
your talk about other BPC is unrelated.

Even a first grader would realize what my point is, and stop bringing unrelated data in the topic.

I don’t. It has literally zero effect on the amount of items you can produce, per day, with a T2 BPO.

No, you can’t. That’s just factually false. I already explained before.
It takes more time to create 36 copies of gleam S, than to manufacture 36 runs of gleam S. So in the same time you can make LESS copies of your BPO.

Of course, a T2 rigged sotiyo in NS would multiply the throughout by 2.88 . a bx-804 would be * 1.041 to manufacturing throughput, and a sc-805 would be *1.052 to copying throughput.

It is not - you are just keeping discussing YOUR workflow while all we others stick to the general topic of T2 BPO having advantages which you tried to dismiss by dragging things into a single example of production to deter the actual simple facts.
No one actually cares about if YOU can make 144 or 200 a day of a certain product. But everyone cares about

  1. not being able to make copies of a potentially fully researched blueprint
  2. having to spend a lot more time to even being able to produce a blueprint either by finding it as loot or by inventing them
  3. having no guarantee on even being able to get a single copy out of an invention process which easily leads to spilled time and resources without ANY result

All those facts alone are enough to proof the influence and advantages the T2 BPOs have over the current established game mechanic everyone else has to follow.

No, I am addressing THIS part :

Which is completely BS. It’s just factually wrong, and it participates in the fantasm of T2 BPO that have exagerated impact on the game.

Advantage, sure. Influence, no, I want proof that they actually have an influence on the game. Otherwise it’s just random BS.

There are a lot of T1 BPOs that can be used for more benefit than in that example the gleam S BPO. Therefore we should remove those T1 BPO too ?

Its not a fantasm - those simple facts are actually proof enough for anyone in their right mind.

It might be random BS for you - it is most definitely not for any either starting producer of T2 products or even established producer that follows the actual established game mechanic and not the still in effect ‘exceptional’ relic that is T2 BPOs.

You are welcome to start that discussion too since you seem to be out of arguments for the T2 topic or if they are a major concern for you. T2 BPO are a major concern for many players and this has been fairly addressed by now.

This is just BS. You create LESS items per day when you copy the gleam S, instead of just building it directly, from the BPO.

It’s just BS, because you have nothing to back that claim up.

For you, because you actually have no idea what we are talking about.

that’s literally an argument on the T2 BPO influence on the game.

No. They have no visible effect on the game, and it’s been already proven several times now. You just keep repeating the same BS, but that’s still BS.

You can’t increase your production by copying them. You claiming that is just wrong. You repeat that every time, without ever realizing that what you write is just complete BS.

The only people for whom this is a concern, are the jealous people who believe that everything should be fair in the game and don’t understand that you have much more interesting BP to work with, making the effect of those BPO unnoticeable.

Its not being jealous but the asking for same base line for everyone. Getting finally rid of a relic that was introduced out of a necessity of not having the actual game mechanic in place that everyone else follows by today is just nomal and very valid. And i have been around for that long in EVE to actually understand why it is brought up regularly.
And since you deem them to not having any effect anyways any obstruction of the original suggestion doesnt make any sense at all - so many words then for nothing.

Which won’t happen. Vets always have more things than newbros. It’s not a competitive game, there is no need for “fairness” .

Except, for no reason. Because its effect on the game i not noticeable, and because that would be market intervention from CCP. They are a value, and removing it is thus removing value form the game. People can want them for the sole role of collection.

  • You claimed that you can copy them faster than you can manufacture them.
  • You claim they have a noticeable effect on the game, without being able to prove it.
  • You claim they give an unfair advantage compared to other manufacturing activities, while other activities give much more of an advantage with T1 BPO.

You’ve clearly not been in eve long enough to actually have an idea what you are talking about.

The 6 days copy time is in an Azbel. 5D 22H, to be exact in the Muvolailen - Buildalot 0.1% Tax (House Arryn). 10 days was apparently the time with an ME 0 BPO because the industry window does not keep figures when you switch modes. With ME16, which is your BPO’s value, it is 8D 14H. Still a difference of over 2 days and enough time to keep up with production. You were not talking about 10/20 with your Tatara example.

Copying 50 Apocalypse runs in the same structure takes 5D 7H 30M, while building 50 Apocs takes 5D 16H.
Copying 50 Punisher runs takes 1D 18H 30M, building it there 1D 21H 20M.
Copying 50 Multifrequency S takes 2H 7M, building them 2H 16M.
Copying 50 Gleam S runs takes 1D 10H, building them 1D 9H. You could add time for the Tungsten Carbide and Fullerides reactions, which makes the production time of those crystals take longer than the copy time, but you I won’t be picky. T2 BPO are the exception from the rule. Congratulations.

Well, there is that:

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  1. You cant manufacture BPOs - which is also why i never claimed that - a lie
  2. They have and all proof has been given already. You are just in denial by now
  3. Never used the word ‘unfair’ nor did i compare manufacturing processes amongst each other - another false statement of my words.

I did not give numbers for a tatara BPO.
I did give numbers for a gleam S BPO.

You brought up the tatara BPO for no reason.

Manufacture is the activity that takes a BPO and creates items from them.
So yes you can manufacture them, as much as you can copy them, or research them.

You literally gave ZERO proof on their effective effet on the game, which is what I asked for.

Yet that’s what you claim when you say

And I did not claim you compared the jobs. Go to school, learn to read.

That what ? I still did not give numbers for tatara. I still did give numbers for gleam S only.

Yes, therefore claiming that copying T2 BPOs takes less time than manufacturing them, is wrong, and it was my point.

You simply cant manufacture a BPO - if you are a native speaker i feel sorry for you.

Manufacturing is the process of making a product based of any form of blueprint - not just BPOs.

“manufacture” on a a BP refer to the activity “manufacturing” that is available on that BP, just like “copy” refers to the “copying” activity, and “invent” refers to the “invention” activity.

You are nitpicking. Not like you had anything interesting in the first place.

Also I did not claim you can manufacture “just BPOs”. I was answering to you claiming you can’t manufacture BPO, by telling you what this term refers to.

Once you begin to use full quotes of a given context you will be entitled to be treated the same way.
It’s why i used your full quote which clearly states BPO and not any form of a blueprint - just to avoid your bad habit of trying to change your wording along your argument chain.

I don’t change the wording. When I use the term “manufacture” on a BPO, it’s the short for “install a manufacturing activity based on” this BPO. But you are just too dense to accept that people use convenient terms when it is not ambiguous.

Your rant is just you venting your frustration to realize you were sooo wrong all along. You are nitpicking because you know, that you are actually completely wrong and your claims about the “doubling of production” was just complete BS. It just showed that you actually have no idea what you are talking about, and that this “effect of the T2 BPO on the game” you claim is likely only a phantasm from your jealousy.

So, again : advantage, yes. Unfair, yes. Real effect ? Not proven, so no. Therefore, no need to remove them - unless you PROOOOOOVE that they actually have a noticeable impact on the game.

I wish they’d remove T2 BPOs just so we don’t have to suffer another one of these back and forth threads where people keep rehashing the same exact arguments we’ve seen for the past 12 years as if it’s going to change anything.

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Haters gotta hate. They would always find something to rant about, especially if they know nothing about it.

The less people know about something, the more exaggerated are their rants.