The pilots of cloaky ships that get exploded on gates or due to their own error may want to have a word with you about this “perfect” saftey. Sure, you’re reasonably safe once you get to your destination, but getting there is never a certain thing.
And yet isk printing is still out of control and rorquals are still trashing mineral prices.
Players are afk ratting it’s so safe.
Less safe than before doesn’t mean we’ve solved the ridiculous risk/reward problem that is null. And it doesn’t change the fact that cloaks aren’t changing until local changes first.
The irony.
We’ve explained the options a thousand times.
Leave afk cloaking as it is, or
Change local and cloaking together.
Any other option does not work because it makes null too safe.
Just becuase you don’t like those options doesn’t mean diddly squat. This is less of an argument as much as it is me educating you on the facts of life.
Local is the problem. Afk cloaking is the solution.
So far (for at least a decade) ccp have chosen to keep things as is. There is a rumor that they may consider change with the new observatory array, but it will more than likely involve changing local at the same time.
Whine all you want about unfairness and balance. Fact is, you choose to rat in null. Don’t like it? Get out!
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Thank you! Its always awesome to have intelligent dialog. I see you are weighing both sides of the issue and actually engaging in the topic, much appreciated!
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Great counter point! During cross system transit there are vulnerability points. Even when they get in, Log off and Log in can be considered vulnerabilities. Those too are fair points. However, once logged in and cloaked. Until they actively engage in some kind of activity they are in near perfect safety. The same cannot be said for any ship not cloaked.
This is so true. Being cloaked up is the safest way to be in the game as long as your not in a fleet and some idiot doesn’t warp to you, your safe as being docked up.
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They literally do have an effect on the game or nobody in their right mind would let their ship sit AFK cloaked all day long for ingame reasons. Yes, ingame reasons, because this is not about the guy who left his cloaked ship in space to answer the door bell or for a toilet break, this is about people who leave their ship AFK cloaked literally to have an effect on the game.
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They don’t affect the game. By definition, they are away from their keyboard not doing anything or interacting with anything.
They do affect the people playing the game. Their affect is purely psychological.
AFK cloaking is metagaming. And metagaming isn’t inherently a problem that needs to be “fixed” by default.
They literally don’t, as the part of my post you conveniently didn’t quote makes abundantly clear. If you want to have an actual discussion, be intellectually honest and attack the whole argument instead of only cherry picking the parts you have a low effort response to.
And in case my initial post was too hard for you to comprehend, Bronson above explained it again in a more simple manner.
I updated my previous post to include your entire statement, happy now? Including the entire statement doesn’t change anything about my previous message though.
The thing I responded to is that AFK cloakers literally DO have an effect on the game. Not every ‘effect’ in this game is measured in ISK or cargo items. If your AFK cloaker makes people dock up, that is an effect. If your AFK cloaker can catch people more easily because they assume you’re AFK, that is an effect. If your AFK cloaker can relay intel about a system the moment you come online without letting people in system know you just came online, allowing your corp to dock up right on time because of this intel, that is an effect.
AFK cloakers literally do have an effect on the game, or people wouldn’t let their ships sit online AFK cloaked all day long. If there was no local, AFK cloaking wouldn’t be noticed by people in system. In fact, I don’t think anyone would AFK cloak for ingame reasons again if local were to disappear, precisely because it wouldn’t have an effect on the game.
People AFK cloak because it has an effect on the game.
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So what?
Pixel fear is a personal problem.
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Excellent points! I wonder how many AFK Cloak in WH’s occupied by hostile corps. I am gonna guess very few as it would have greatly diminished effect. In order to get any intel easily they would have spam d-scan and then they are not AFK. Which really points to psyops as purpose and effect. Granted those in local can choose to ignore it. So, I am guessing if local were removed from Null, that would likely remove the majority of cloaky campers as they would have to be active on d-scan to get intel they got passively or AFK.
Not to mention that most w-space dwellers just act as there is someone watching them all the time ,meaning PVP-fits, being in a fleet and comms, etc.
Being a name in local doesn’t affect the game. It affects other players playing the game, but not the game. Those other players are only affected because they choose to be, not because the afk cloaker does anything.
It’s in the name. He’s AFK. He’s literally doing nothing at all.
If that supposed afk cloaker is tackling other players and lighting cynos, then he obviously isn’t afk.
Same as the above. To relay intel, those eyeballs need to be in front of the screen. No player present, no intel. Again, afk cloaker doing jack ■■■■ all because he literally can’t do anything while he isn’t there.
Jackpot, you found the root problem. Zero effort, perfectly flawless intel in the form of local chat. Remove local and afk cloaking goes away. Why? Because afk cloaking is meta-gaming. It’s psychological warfare on the weak and feeble that have no business being anywhere near nullsec. It introduces doubt into their otherwise perfectly reliable intel source and the trash obviously can’t handle doubt and that is literally the only reason this thread even exists.
Repeat it as often as you want, but that still won’t make it true. Reality doesn’t care about your subjective denial.
Call it subjective denial all you want, AFK cloakers have an effect on the game as long as local exists.
So lets remove local and call it a day?
Sure thing.
I finally get the staunch defense of AFK Cloaky. You guys have an awesome deal and you don’t ever want to lose it!
Free, passive intel! You guys have the Gaul to rail on about AFK farmers and how risk free they want life. Meanwhile you sit there minimal risk to self with multiple small widows open across a region getting real time passive intel so you know immediately where to focus your attention across multiple toons. You have an active starmap, zero delay.
Now I really get it and the hypocrisy stinks to hi heaven!
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I am finally on board with this. It really is a solution.
If the renter trash doesn’t want to impose risk through counter drops and the like, how is that the cloakers’ fault?
Non sequitur. Its about who has how much risk. Cloaky’s have far less. They get a huge reward for almost no risk. That’s bull!
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