Well that’s a steaming pile of horse manure, in my experience most are ok with those that want to PvE as long as they accept that they’re PvEing in a hostile environment and plan accordingly; what they don’t like is people who bawl like infants when their PvE gets interrupted.
In point of fact there’s several PvE players in this thread that would disagree with you, myself included.
TL;DR players either understand the nature of the game, or they don’t.
Exactly.
Considering that a great many PvP players also PvE why would we hate PvE. It isn’t the activity it is the attitude. You want to just do “PvE” fine. I really don’t care. But you are in varying degrees my content. And yeah, you can’t stop it. Not entirely. You can try to stop it. You can make it harder for me. That is what it means to be a competitive MMO that is a sandbox.
The game is a competitive game. It is also a sandbox where the rule is do what you want so long as you are willing to accept the consequences. If I want to shoot you in HS illegally, that is allowed. That this can happen means you should behave accordingly.
CCP wants to give Upwell structures some advantages so that there is an incentive to use them over NPC stations. Actually seems reasonable given all the work and effort they put into them. Why waste all those resources on something that will never be used? So structure it so they will be used. And if you really don’t want to use them…then don’t. But it will cost you…like most things in life.
As for standings? They are a sunk costs. Stop worrying about them FFS. The snivelling and whining in this thread is hilarious. I spent hours grinding so I could get JCs. I hate grinding standings. But when they changed the rules so that grinding for JCs would no longer be a thing for new players, I was fine with it and I saw it as a good thing for new players…now they don’t have to do that horrible grind. Because my grinding was a sunk cost. If you don’t know what a sunk cost is, it is a cost that once incurred cannot be recouped. A non-refundable deposit is an example. Since I cannot recoup that “investment” I don’t worry about it. It is sunk. Letting it influence your current decision making is pointless.
I believe in your eagerness to spew bile you missed the point.
You don’t have to make NPC structures better to give value to having good relations with an NPC faction.
It doesn’t have to have anything at all to do with structures. In the past that was one of the minor benefits, but going forward they could do something else.
It’s not asking for a nerf to anything to ask that efforts be rewarded.
Grinding standings may be time consuming, but it isn’t much in the way of effort, or risk, or skill. And once its done it’s done. You don’t have to keep doing it.
That should be remembered. Especially when balancing npc services against player services which have to be constantly maintained.
Okay then, problem solved. Your standings still give you something at an NPC station. So shut up already.
Who cares, they are sunk costs. You chose, all by yourself, to sink that time into gaining those standings. That’s on you. Now, if somebody made you do it–i.e. literally coerced you–you might have a valid point. But nobody did so you don’t.
They were rewarded…plenty. How did you get those standings? By doing missions. Which gave you ISK and LP.
Seriously, stop complaining.
Grinding standings may be time consuming, but it isn’t much in the way of effort, or risk, or skill. And once its done it’s done. You don’t have to keep doing it.
That should be remembered. Especially when balancing npc services against player services which have to be constantly maintained.
Exactly. NPC standings do not require skill, or creativity, or anything else worthy of reward. All you have to do is invest sufficient hours of tedious grinding and you automatically get the reward. So the reward should be minor, as it currently is.
Why would I bother owning a Cit if I could get the exact same thing from an NPC station?
LOL! Stop pretending like the game can only be PVP. You are clearly delusional. Much less is required of EVE players in terms of skill and creativity than in other pvpmmorpgs. 99.9% of you are copying someone else and press F1 when your FC tells you. With silly sentiments like yours floating around, it is no surprise the game is deader than ever.
Then why are you playing?
Shhhh…stop that! Using logic means you hate people.
At least PvP requires someone to have skill and creativity, and everyone involved risks the loss of their ship. If the supposed “just press F1 like you’re told to” fleet succeeds it’s because players who are good at EVE have built something effective. Contrast that with PvE mission farming, where loss is impossible, defeat is impossible, and the only question is how many hours you’re willing to spend pressing F1 until you get a certain level of standings. At no point is skill or creativity or anything else worthy of respect involved. If there’s any risk of failure at all it comes entirely from PvP players deciding to suicide gank your overpriced mission ship.
It was such a blatantly thoughtless question, I had ignored it, but now that Teckos Pech has claimed this is “logic”, I get to laugh in both your faces and ignore you 
It must really suck to be you forum clowns. Thanks for the bumps.
Of course, i’m not asking for anything unreasonable here, merely to replace what was lost. Daichi says this is “snowflake”. It is not. Snowflake is those who cry about “grind” for a 4% refining bonus and act entitled to it, ignoring the fact that others have actually worked for this bonus.
apparently, not the sharpest tool in the shed. 
It is the result of the proposed change is it not?
How is asking for more information a thoughless act?
You are the one acting entitled. You are a snowflake.
It’s not going to happen.
You know, in the time it takes to grind standings up to perfect NPC refine, someone could also take all that reward money and buy a couple refineries of their own. Maybe even share them with other players who have good standing.
I’m sorry…but isn’t that what you are doing though. You did the grind, CCP introduces something that gives a better result and now you are crying about “how that grinding is now useless”.
See…that right there.
This can be shortened too: I want the benefits of a citadel in regards to refining, but without the risk.
And you try to justify it with,
But see, everyone can make the same standings argument. There was a giant threadnaught about how awful it was that standings wouldn’t give the same benefit in an NPC station as was possible in a citadel for trading. The exact same argument you make for mining applies here.
And grinding is largely a sunk cost. You can’t get that time back. So you should not let the “loss” of it affect any of your current or future standings.
And how does one get standings? One runs missions. Running missions gives out ISK, LP and standings. And for those who ground standings they had time to enjoy the benefits those standings convey. Things like the refining bonus, the jump clones, anchoring POS, and even data cores if the corporations you had standings with had R&D agents. And you likely had these benefits for years. And did the refining bonus change? Or are you whining because citadels are better?
LMAO! I actually worked for something that was taken away. That is the opposite of entitlement. Do you forum village idiots even think at all before you post? 
So sorry that it upsets you, but I’ve got every right to complain, and someone like you definitely can’t say whether it will happen or not. You have no basis to your claims and none can take your inane posts seriously. I appreciate the bumps, but haven’t you embarrassed yourself enough?
It wasn’t taken away. You can get more minerals than you did before from stations…
Wait, don’t tell me this whole thread is because you don’t know how refining was rebalanced? Are you for real?
That was what I was thinking.
Max refine at NPC stations was indeed taken away. Don’t tell me that you are so dense that you still don’t understand what this thread is even about?
It is pretty clear that you and Tecknos have your heads completely up your ass, so you might as well stop posting before you make even bigger fools of yourselves.
I do appreciate the bumps, however. 