Do you want Goons owning half the map again? Because this is how you get Goons owning half the map again.
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Well if they manage to gather half of the nullsec population in their ranks, I’m fine with them having half of the map. Compared to the status quo, at least they’ll provide more content and mess the game’s economy less. Since passive moon goo is not a thing anymore, I don’t see any problem whatsoever with them having lots of systems.
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You are the kind of dude who plays for wealth acquisition and who can be proud of how many Keepstars their entity can build. I am the kind of dude who plays Eve for explosions and glorious battle. You derive your sense of self worth from belonging to a video game entity. I derive my sense of self worth from skillfully exploding ships.
We play different Eve’s. But while I do my best to recognize your philosophy (although I think it’s inferior), you are clueless about mine. That makes you trick yourself into thinking you are winning Eve, because for you Eve success is quantified in how many titans and Keepstars you (or your entity) own. The irony is that you never even use them. My bottom line is that I am exploding more Goon ships than Goons explode mine. So for me even I (let alone PL or other such entities who are better at exploding ships) am better than Goons.
So I am not at all surprised you think it’s a “psychological weakness” to seek fights. You are just so brainwashed to see that people just prioritize different things than you in their Eve experience. Sad thing is that makes you a pawn in someone else’s RL income stream. That’s why you got brainwashed by the culture that is so successfully disseminated in your entity in the first place.
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And yet somehow we are better at Internet Spaceship Warfare than you.
Because unlike every other entity in New Eden we have the logistical backbone to go with being a significant power in the game.
Any damage you can possibly do to Goons is a rounding error on a spreadsheet. Have a nice day.
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Imagine a plush savannah in the middle of the rain season. It’s full with grass, so the antelope can overpopulate. Imagine an antelope going to the lion and saying “there is so much of us, you can’t do any significant damage to our herd”. And thinking antelopes are the king of the savannah.
That’s exactly what you’re doing. Not only you, but most Goons who respond to me in forums/reddit are this delusional. Lots of people find it laughable.
So your problem here is that you are trying to play Eve, which in null is a game that mirrors reality to a depressing degree, like a different game. Fanatical dedication to a strategic goal, indifference to losses, and a unified command structure are key components to real world military operations. They also work well in Eve.
Glorious spaceship explosions are fun (actually why I play, I’m an inept solo PvP guy) but they don’t take and hold strategic resources. And you are, at the core, really upset that Goons hold and exploit strategic resources while you don’t. Your way of playing Eve isn’t wrong at all, but neither is it superior. It might even be fair to say that there is an element of skill and effort involved in organizing and motivating thousands of players, just like there is in shooting spaceships.
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There are no “strategic resources” in this game. The best thing Goons do is anomaly running and protecting their anomaly runner capitals. Thats not strategic. Anomalies exist everywhere.
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I probably do more ISK/hr in my activity (1.5b/hr) than %99 of your alliance. I am not upset about your anomaly running. Actually, as a whale hunter, I need people doing anomalies to derive my fun (explosions) from this game.
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I am upset because the hisec level protection your PvE capitals benefit relies on game breaking, unbalanced mechanics. I take a significant risk when I am doing my 1.5b/hr PvE. I occasionally die and become somebody else’s content. Just like how it should be. Your PvE capitals don’t take significant risk, due to mechanics CCP needs to balance. And then this kills content for everyone. Since the initial post onward that was the only thing I was upset. Bringing the ass of your people with delusional ego down to earth is just a side issue. But it always goes that way with goons because the moment I begin talking about game mechanics is the moment you begin talking about how you are the best. Your alliance culture is heavily brainwashing, and your leaders need you to keep believing that in order to protect their RL income stream.
- Literally anyone can join Goons. Therefore, there is logically no way for one to be upset because Goons hold resources that they don’t. Because then they would merely join Goons. Do you see how baselessly inflated your ego must be to say such a thing? Every time some Goon says someone else is jealous of them (which happens a shitton of times), someone needs to remind them anybody can become a Goon.
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Highsec player here primarily, though I have roamed through WHs, LS, and NS for PVE and PVP reasons as well (but never lived in them besides short vacations to NPC null) who has voted in all 4 CSM elections since I entered the game. So much stereotyping in so many posts here, but especially the quoted part above.
I understand that most highseccers don’t vote in the CSM, but there are also plenty like myself who do. But we don’t all vote on the same page. We don’t want to be part of a large group, or else we’d already be in a nullsec alliance, no? And we’ve all got different ■■■■ in the game that we enjoy. Whether solo or in small, medium, or large groups (or a mix and match of all of the above), we either get what we want or we go away.
It’s a sandbox. All options are available. Pretending that all should play the game the same way is pretty silly.
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It’s funny tha tyou use the word Sterotype in one sentence then go on to say that most hi sec players don’t vote in CSM elections… If most people in a group do something, then describing that thing is not stereotyping that group, it’s a characteristic of that group.
No one said anything about how or where anyone plays. EVE being a sandbox has zero to do with the political and social impotence of high sec. The point is that high sec posters here LOVE to complain about, well, everything. But all they can do is complain, because they sure as hell can’t organize, fight back, or win through.
If you don’[t like whats going on with the game or think High Sec is getting some kind of raw deal, you should be replying to me at all, you should be talking to other high sec players and trying to get your act together.
Again, it’s not our fault that we have enough social skill and awareness to organize and get what we want and high sec people don’t…
The fact that a lot of highseccers don’t vote in CSM elections isn’t the stereotype, it’s the reasons why they don’t vote that you were projecting onto us that I was calling a stereotype.
Things like “unable to organize or cooperate for more than 15 seconds” and such. Surely you can see the unfairness of that phrasing. For one thing, it’s not always unable, sometimes it’s unwilling.
In any event, I read the whole thread but was only motivated to speak up on this issue of highsec vs. nullsec in regards to the CSM. You’ll notice I’m not one of the people complaining about goons and Delve in the thread, I have no horse in this race.
I like how the game is going just fine in terms of what parts of the game affect my daily play sessions, thus I don’t need to “get our act together.” I already am involved with multiple groups of players in the forms of incursion PVE communities, WH PVE roams, and Spectre Fleet NPSI PVP fleets, plus I do plenty of things solo. I’m happy with my EVE experience, I’m not complaining about changes, etc. directed at CCP, goons, PL, whoever.
I vote in every CSM because I vote in almost every IRL election I can vote in, it just happens to be the way I was raised and how I’ve lived the 2+ decades since I became an adult, I don’t see a reason to behave differently here just because “it’s a game.”
Unable and unwilling are the same thing in this context. Even if it wasn’t, “unable” has been proven time and time again. I’ve known people who tried to rally votes in high sec. I’ve personally known 3 high sec-centric candidates who all lost.
Again, instead of complaining to me about word choice, if the observation bothers you you should be concentrating on helping high sec players be less pathetic and whiney when it comes to these issues. I’ve spent the last 10 years reading EVE forum whines from high sec posters (who always claim they are a part of some ‘majority’) about how unfair it all is that null sec gets the attention is does.
We (the collective ‘we’ of null sec) get attention because we care, we participate and we vote. It’s not our fault that most in high sec do none of these things.
In my book it doesn’t really matter why so many people don’t vote and why the voting mechanics are exploitable by larger groups to get their candidates into the CSM. What matters is that the CSM doesn’t fulfill the purpose of being a proper representative body for the majority of EVE. And since that is something many people realize, the CSM doesn’t even function as a symbolic measure in terms of player input. CCP could just save the money it costs and pause the CSM until they’ve come up with a more accepted version that fulfills the purpose.
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Look, nobody says its the nullseccer’s fault to be overrepresented in CSM and thus get privileges. But it’s CCP’s fault to trust this CSM system to reflect all of Eve’s concerns.
I’m not a hisec person. But I think whenever you people from major null empires blame others for not being able to elect their own people into CSM, you ignore this major point: You are the largest blocks. You have out of game means (discord, forums, and everything else) to do propaganda and push people to vote. You have the sense of belonging which motivates people to elect “one of their own”. And you have measures (kicking, penalizing) you can take in case people admit they didn’t vote.
The people of other spaces don’t have none of these means. Thus you have a huge organizational advantage over them. The very tools you need to sustain your major null empire lifestyle also give you an unbreakable edge in CSM elections. But you can’t blame the hiseccer for not having a discord, or a huge propaganda apparatus. They are probably in hisec because they don’t want to deal with such bureaucracy, or be a mere number in a multiple thousand nullsec empire.
So while it’s not your fault to be overrepresented, it’s not others’ fault (as you portray it) to be underrepresented either. It’s CCP’s fault to rely on direct democracy. I think even a system in which they hand-pick CSM is better than this one we have.
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They have to because of the same reason CSM is owned by the nullsec cartels. The game’s narrative and outside view is owned by the vocal organized minority with media power. It’s in CCP financial interest to design the game around these figures, or at least make sure they don’t get too angry. CCP even accepts monetization of EvE by third parties, if it doesn’t interfere with PLEX income.
- This shows how little you actually understand about how Eve works. Anoms, mining and ratting, are hugely important strategic resources since nullsec play is based on ability to mobilize players and those give players a way to earn Isk.
While it’s true that they exist everywhere the way that the Imperium runs delve has turned them into strategic assets; they attract huge numbers of players, which makes everyone safer, which attracts more numbers, which fills the fleets of our Glorious Emperor Mittens with slack jawed cannon fodder, which is the primary strategic asset in Eve.
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That’s impressive. Well done sir. Maybe someday I’ll have the time to get good like that.
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As a Rorqual flying Delve resident I live in fear of dread bombs, wormholes, and marauding Battlecruiser fleets. Rorquals die all the time in Delve, usually because they are stupid but sometimes unlucky. Look at the loss rates in the report if you doubt me. And yes, the losses are small compared to the overall scale of activity, but it’s highly inaccurate to say we live in highsec level safety.
By removing the safety benefits of concentration and organization CCP would be punishing skill, wouldn’t they? I understand there would be more “content” if it was impossible for a trapped ship to get backup, but that would come at a significant cost. Any change powerful enough to break the Imperium and render capital PvE in our space highly vulnerable would utterly neuter any less organized or smaller entity.
- I didn’t say jealous. I said upset. It’s different; you clearly have an image of how the game should be that does not include large groups working for mutual benefit. Fair enough, I get that the inability of a couple dozen small gang PvPers or ‘whale hunters’ to wipe out caps at will makes your PvP less enjoyable. We can agree to disagree here; I remain convinced that if twenty thousand players invest the time and effort in their space to make it a safe place to PvE the game mechanics shouldn’t render that effort worthless.
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Now consider that at least a third of Querious is in Imperium hands, and that most of the organised mining in that region is done by us, and we’re probably actually closer to or even topping 16tril. 
That coming from a null sec player, where people are complaining about everything, too, is rich. Too many cloaky campers, too many bubble camps, too much distance, not enough income for scrubs, too much roaming, no control over stargates to shut out roamers, too much super blobbing, no content at all, too much empty space, not enough empty space, not enough space etc. etc. 
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Nope, the exact opposite, there is no skill in bringing more numbers. That’s the point here, you can brute force every problem by just adding another injected alt or getting more warm bodies in the alliance. You need some marketing and logistic for that but in-game skills are obsolete.
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It’s time to nerfing of Delve…
Imperium turned the hisec level safety they provide into a strategic asset. Not anomalies. The safety derives from having the largest capital umbrella (thus being able to use it fearlessly). That’s the strategic asset. Your capital fleet.
I play with Inner Hell and I belong to the lucky minority who is able to kill PvE capitals in Delve occasionally. Capitals do die in Delve. But the amount (compared to how much PvE is going on) is laughable. Here is an analysis I made months ago. The gap between Goons and everyone else is even higher now. Dreadbombs are things people will do once in 5-6 months because it’s a lose-lose game that also requires lots of logistics. And I heard Goons are way better countering PL dreadbombs now. Apart from that, any fleet from wormholes or a blops bridge is conclusively counterable by your capital umbrella. And if people move a capital force in your area you’ll merely dock.
First of all, maintaining your capital umbrella does not require skill. It requires having lots of capital accounts and ships. Secondly, I am not saying better organization does not deserve more safety in your space. I am saying things should be more balanced, and there should be a limit on how safe you can make your space, which should be way below the hisec level safety you have.
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