yep is the same, the same with the wardecs atm.
Find this opportunity to be very intriguing. I applaud those who take the initiative to create something fresh for the game. If someone has a method to make isk that they want to share with other investors so they all benefit I think that is great.
I applaud this new opportunity and have invested 10 bil isk under plan 2.
No, I invested. Not everyone is a scammer. Players creating content is a great thing in my opinion. I support such efforts. Only invest what you can afford to lose but that is true for all investments.
Receipt confirmed with thanks.
As a banker in real life here in the US for over 35 years, I want to address the question of “collateral” that has been brought up. Collateral typically involves loans and not investments. MoonPire is an investment and not a loan. As Arisah Moon stated, it makes no sense to 100% collateralize someone investing. You would be trading MoonPire isk for an individual’s isk of the same amount. There would be no net increase in isk for MoorPire to use.
Loans are rarely 100% collateralized with cash. It is more common to see a loan collateralized as % of the loan value. Such as 50% loan to value. Banks do this to protect against loss but also to make sure the borrower has some skin in the game. In other words, they have something to lose as well so will be less likely to walk away from the loan.
Investments are about trust. Trust that the people running the corporation can protect the investment from loss of principal and also provide a decent rate of return. All investors need to make that decision.
I have invested 10bil isk under plan 2. Basically the cost of a jump freighter. A jump freighter that costs me money every time I jump her. The cost of the fuel is in actuality “negative interest”. I also could lose not only the ship and fuel but the valuable cargo. It’s all about risk reward as an investor.
Could I get scammed? Yep. Do I think this is a scam? No.
Invest or not. Hammering Arisa Moon with your opinion is really counter productive. Anyone with over a billion isk to invest should be wise to scamming and would have had the same thought process as I have been through before investing so you really are not warning anyone.
Be nice.
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Both are asking for money. This also isnt real life. Out there, investments have a lot to lose if they fail, and investors can attempt to collect on their investment in the event of failure. But this is EVE, where you have no chance at recovering your isk once sent outside of the goodwill of whoever you sent it to. That is why people ask for collateral here. That collateral mitigates the risk of investments/loans by providing those giving the isk a way to extract isk back from failed investments.
Moonpire has none of that. The only other thing available is reputation, which players like ENorn can trade with vast sums of money purely on reputation. The risk of losing their name is currently outweighing the benefits of taking all that money (and collateral they hold as an Escrow Servicer) and disappear. Right now, most posters in MD have valued Moonpire’s reputation as pretty low and a high-risk.
Everyone has a different personal risk differential. I’ve decided to take the risk and support a player who wants to do something special in the game. Player created content should be supported IMHO. If someone decided to not do so that is ok. Nobody is saying you should act outside your better judgement.
Players who can afford to invest have been at this game for awhile. I’ve been playing since 2005. We have made all kinds of mistakes over the years from which we have learned. I once lost half my total assets when I lost a mark 5 I had left to autopilot to Jita. Ya I did that. You did something dumb too! You recovered and are better off for the experience.
EVE is a tough game in which to be successful. It will never be a space WOW. The average player can’t handle the stress of the losses. I just am concerned that people beat the crap outta someone trying to do something special/different on the boards. No reason for it really other than meanness.
If you cannot afford to lose the isk, then you should not invest. If you can and would like to help people create in game content, then why not?
When a banker gives you bad advice irl and ig.
A scam can be considered creating content, no?
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Depends on the quality.
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I dont believe that you are a banker for even a second. If you are, you must be like a bank teller or something. The type of guy that stands at the booth saying “hi, welcome to Citibank. Would you like to make a deposit?” You know, the type of guy that doesnt have anything to do with actual investments or managing the accounts or anything. Just accepting withdrawls and deposits. Because otherwise, you would make a very poor investment banker.
Its not about being able to afford it. Investments are not about whether you can afford to lose your money or not.
If my investment banker called me today and said “Hey, i found these really risky, really stupid investments, but i decided to invest in them anyways because hey, you can afford to lose that money”, id fire him on the spot.
Being able to afford the loss, or assessing the risk, has very little to do with whether the investment is sound.
In eve, there are two types of currencies, when it comes to loans and investments. One is collateral, the other is trust. Trust has to be earned, and people need to assess if the person is trustworthy enough in lieu of collateral.
You may be a 2005 character, but the fact that you made a really, really stupid comparison between real life and EVE online with regards to investments and collateral, show that you do not understand what you are talking about.
As I said before, i dont believe this to be a scam, either. But the level of competancy is a factor that i have to include when i decide to hand over my isk without collateral. I can afford 10 billion isk, but id rather donate it to a worthy cause, then invest it into an idiot who may lose it and end up with nothing to show for it.
There are dozens of threads on this forums where people ask for isk for investments without collateral. Why arent you investing in them, too? The fact that this is your first post ever, and your first forum visit, makes me think that you are either Arisha moons friend, who she asked to post in order to give her credibility, or her alt.
Its not counterproductive, and this only further makes you look like an alt or friend of Arisha Moon, because anyone with over a billion isk to invest should be wise enough to understand that assessing the risk of a non-collateral investment, includes determining if the investment is sound or not, and that includes the competency of the person you are investing.
Our problem with Arisha Moon, isnt that she seems like a scammer. Its that she has taken part in some very, very poor judgements on her part, which does not inspire any confidence in her ability to deliver what she promised. If you truly are a banker, im sure i dont have to tell you the importance of the face of a company, the ability for a CEO to convince shareholders and potential investors to invest and rally behind him and the company. Arisha does not inspire confidence, she does not inspire trust.
This is why we hammer people with zero credibility and an already poor history of investments, because we need to know if they can be trusted with our isk. Trust is earned, not given away freely. Your bank would fire you for anything less, i presume.
No substantial presence in the meta market community, check
asking for 750b for a business plan that doesnt make sense, check
no collateral, check,
no vouches, check
do us all a favor and use your winning business plan and make a lot of isk low scale risking your own isk (hint, if it is under 100b then its not worth posting), then grow our trust. People have issue with people greedy for ISK. that’s prone for scamming and defaults, We don’t know your motives. That’s a HUGE part of large investments.
Part of why myself, Probag, e-norn, etc can secure a lot of public funds is because we have established ourselves as not “needing” isk, but using it isk a tool to grow. Show us that. How can an isk investment grow you, instead of starting your business,
If you’re just SP farming, why wouldn’t I just invest in someone I know, or do it myself.
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Isk(%) sent to investor.
He also had a winning idea of buying plex and then supplying it at the exact same price to every single region in new eden. A brilliant idea cut short by the fact that he didnt have enough isk to drain jita market and supply it.
This really sounds like a scam at first stating that 3% interest per month. I can spare you 1 b, but as we are all aware about the rising numbers of scammers and their styles, how about you give me a collateralize investment plan and we will call it a deal.
We told him to offer collateral, but apparently we are just being spammers when we say anything other than “Here you go, take my ISK.”
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well, that is not the EVE money business works… In EVE you will invest with collateral or you will have a good chance to loose your ISK.
Hopefully he will consider or I’ll just spend it for mercs.
He wont. Trust me, he wont. We tried.
Hi all,
uff i never thought that this thread will live so long… but ok…
just for your information, i have enough isk collected for my business.
i have found here only one investor, but its ok.
its nice to work with people that have a little bit trust over, it makes fun!
but i will still offer my service, because i like to do that what i can. currently i am again at a 200billion turnover a day and its growing now faster and faster. and i have started to make pi with the alt chars from the sp farm things, pi is a stable income like sp farm.
@Martin Dekard why should i now tell everyone how i make isk? i tried, i telled it here… but there were no difference, everybody said its a scam… why should it be different now?
as i said i offer you more interest then most other here and i will never be able to offer colleteral, because i work with the whole isk.
as temujin wrote it… senseless to offer collateral.
but anyway thanks for that great attention!