I’ve read the whole of this thread at length, and there may be something I’m missing, but it raises a number of questions which don’t seem to have a ready solution:
It seems as though these two ideas are mutually exclusive, how can no one know who owns it, yet someone has to be registered and identified to buy it?
If the exchanges hold such a massive proportion of the available coins, then it essentially becomes impossible to acquire a meaningful value without being required to share ID, so becomes no different to normal banking:?
4 of the top ten value wallets (containing $11bn), and a large proportion of the top 500 (each containing over $100m, and many in very round numbers of complete coins) have never seen an outgoing transaction, and many more no outgoing transactions for years, surely this is pure speculation/hoarding? if this BTC is freely available for sale, why is it not being bought?
Except it isn’t possible if the currency is truly independent, in order for BTC to be blocked you would presumably need a significant network consensus to honour the cancellation, and a party that oversees/manages the network (like a bank), to cast the deciding vote, otherwise wouldn’t it cause a fork every time a transaction is disputed with people taking sides, and assuming the currency kept forking surely it would become devalued or possibly vulnerable to a 51% attack?
Given these issues I don’t understand the problem that BTC is solving, as far as i can see it isn’t anonymous and isn’t irreversible so doesn’t replace cash, and with the exception of lightning transactions isn’t low cost or quick, so it seems to offer exactly the same level of flexibility as cash, but with the added benefit of horrendous environmental impact and having little improvement on my quality of life.
It seems you are correct BTC isn’t truly anonymous, I don’t think many people will exchange large amounts BTC for cash with another without knowing who they are as they could get in trouble for funding criminals.
Again, you are correct, the investors involved in crypto exchanges were quick to purchase BTC from miners which they are free to do. This puts them in a position to work with government law enforcement and have a level of control over BTC.
I don’t know, who ever owns it can hold onto it for 20 years if they choose.
Law enforcement can hack criminals and steal private keys for the BTC wallet in question. I believe this is the only way to seize assets, Also an Exchange can freeze wallets owned by one of their customers if police have a court order.
BTC can solve the issue of inflation since it is a finite currency and the only way to introduce new BTC is to mine it. I agree it’s not fully anonymous since it seems one must sign up with an exchange if you want to exchange for physical cash. Since I am not a criminal I am ok with one crypto exchange knowing my details, I never plan to do any crime so the exchange have no reason to pass my details to anyone, if they do pass my details to anyone and it’s not for tax or law enforcement reasons then my privacy would have been infringed.
It depends on your perspective, I am a crypto miner so it has improved my quality of life because I have been able to buy hardware and generate crypto without any issue. I do not have to seek permission from anyone, or goto a job interview, I can manage this entirely on my own without speaking to anyone. I know this can benefit lots of people. If we look at society we have people who are disabled and have difficulty moving around, we have folks with mental issues who don’t do well around others, crypto mining is great for these type of people as they can earn a small amount of money to keep them ticking over and not have to rely purely on benefits from the government (if such benefits even exist where they are in the world).
Again, it will depend on your perspective, someone living in a country where their currency keeps losing value may find a good use for BTC. People from UK or USA won’t have this perspective due to their currency being stable, so the typical UK or USA resident might see BTC as a commodity and start trading for profit BECAUSE countries like El Salvador rely on it. This is partly what I like so much about Crypto, people from different walks of life and different perspectives can get a little something out of it.
I am totally ashamed of what Crypto is doing to the environment and was pleased that companies like Intel have decided to build BTC Asic’s, I am hoping this will result in less electric use for BTC mining due to Intel being able to make a lower powered BTC Asic than everyone else, Intel’s Asic was able to shave off a good 800 watts from the most efficient Bitmain Asic and still do a similar perfomance,
I’d love to see an offering from Nvidia and AMD for a BTC miner to see if they can reduce the electric cost further. I’d also like to see less hardware being thrown away, the Crypto industry needs standards so hopefully we will see swapable/blade type Asic’s where customers only need swap out the ASic blades and not have to throw away the whole 5kg Asic.
This is a very important point, honestly I have no idea how disabled people are being supported, I know many of them are smart and capable but their disability makes them difficult to employ. I strongly feel crypto has can/has created jobs for many disabled people. In UK big employees have to have a certain number of disabled people working for them, I think that is all the UK does.
I have also noted that none of the people who dislike Crypto have an opinion on poor and developing countries and using BTC to avoid inflation. Am I to believe you don’t care for this point?
More than two months have passed since bitcoins began to circulate as legal currency in El Salvador, and a recent survey revealed that, when Salvadorans can choose which currency to pay with, 91.4 percent of people use the dollar, while only a 4.9 percent favor bitcoins.
Yes, EVERY BUSINESS now has a bitcoin purse as they are required by law to accept them, but saying they like it as a solution is a lie, why do you keep telling us the victims in El Salvador outside a few paid actors are benefiting from it?.
Every bank has a website and app these days, don’t you know?
There is no added value to bitcoin besides getting crypto-banksters out of the bubble they stuck tthemselves in AGAIN. Ah, that’s what you mean, but DO NOT say all mentally ill are the small group of narcistic anti-social assholes who steal from the poor . Don’t do that, that is extremely dishonest.
As I already explained, you only need to wait for the electricity prices to increase so much that it becomes a loss to mine, then you can easily 51% because all the miners do it for profit.
And nobody will notice it.
Indeed, it does not generate value at all. The only value you can acquire from it is from speculation or illegal business, making Aaron a criminal apologist. " I don’t care if I help people parasite the society as long as I am making 5$ a day"
Dude only less than 5% use it. Explain me why I would care for the rich and corrupt in El Salvador? Please do so. Explain me, before the truth comes out as yes, you can be naive but all reports on El Salvador show the evil behind it that tries to promote itself as “good”. But is clearly not, these are the FACTS. And yes, it will take some time and poor people will suffer and then I will have substantial information that the bitcoin is a scam making many victims. In some cases it’s too late, like in the Jonestown incident
4.9% of 6.4 million people is 320,000 people. If that’s how many people are using BTC after such a short space of time then I am impressed. I’m unsure how you equate this to a lie. 320k people may mean nothing to you but to me it is a lot of people and it is the start of something good. Be reasonable and give it some time for the 4.9% to see how it goes and the other 91% can watch what happens with the 4.9% and perhaps change their minds.
It is unreasonable of you to expect it to be a success 5 minutes after happening, When you started a new job did you expect to be promoted after 2 months? or when you purchased an investment from a bank did you expect it to be a total success after 2 months? Lets just be reasonable here.
And, LOLOLOL, let them go ahead and launder their BTC money in El Salvador using a public blockchain where records will never be deleted.
I have a realistic view of the world, many BTC criminals have been caught and are either in prison or facing prison. These are very skilled people and with the right resources they can help law enforcement steal criminals crypto assets in return for a lighter sentence. Prison is a shitty place to be for 20 years and I’m sure many would do this to get out.
Even though BTC is largely anonymous you still need internet to access it, this will leave a trail that can be followed, even a VPN can be traced.
I don’t think so. If it is truly the solution for the poor people, many would have adopted it. I am glad to hear only 320000 people in El Salvador are considered poor. Good for them. But I’m afraid those are a combination of corrupt officials and their bitcoin cronies. Like you said, time will tell.
And the geothermal ? I would like to see a country that’s run by a corrupt president that is destroying the institutions (hence people have to drive 3 hours to get cash) make a well concerted effort to build those powerplants and manage them installed and run efficiently. I predict it will be run by some cronies and people will have to take a 3 hour ride to get some clean energy. Because that’s what is going on there, and Bitcoin is helping them get funds to stay in power.
Sure, remember there is normally an older populace within a country who may not be used to techy type things. Also people will be skeptical and rightly so. They will let their friend or family member use BTC for a period of time before adopting it themselves. I was very skeptical of crypto when I first started mining, I literally watched every mining youtube video and read hundreds of hours of forum before I did anything.
I’m happy with the current progress, I am assisting 320,000 people who use BTC for all aspects of their daily financial lives. I am hopeful this number will grow and will have fun being involved. I feel good being part of something bigger than me and doing something unorthodox and receiving a reasonable wage for it, In years to come I can say I was there at the beginning of the financial change.
If you google further you will find El Salvador already mine geothermal energy and put it to use.
You are delusional and ignorant. Your arguments are made from ignorance, or personal attacks, or false quote - in a word, dishonest.
What’s more, you feel entitled to your stupidity - if other people disagree, then they must be haters or whatever - while in reality you are the one with vested interests.
Addressing the structural roots of the problem in the country and get a government in charge instead of puppets of the drug cartels. Again, BITCOIN will not solve the issues but will make it easier to launder the profits.
That is good, I hope the Bitcoin gringo that immigrated to El Salvador teaches children to set up bitcoin machines so they can get a good wage and can stay out of the gangs. But I don’t think that will happen. I hope it does, but I’m not naive when I see what forces are at play.
" A surfer, Peterson first came to El Zonte in 2006 to check out the waves. The town has long been a draw for surfers. He was so enamored by it, he bought a home there. The home has a guest house you can rent for $160 per night. In 2014, he opened another “mission guest house” in Punta Mango with three bungalows, each currently available for $200 per night."
Aaron, call Michael Peterson and ask him how that HYPOTHETICAL STORY (PERSON X,Y,Z) with the housing project works, he unironically literally did what I proposed. Ok, he did it in the smallest (and disfunctional) economy in the world but still… how bad is it that the more I look into these weirdos you present us, the darker the story becomes?
He even has a religious center. You can’t make this sh*t up. https://missionsake.com/
Looking back on 1 year of bitcoin -12.534,53 (27,07%) was depriciated. If we compare this to real money, Between 2011 and 2021 [TEN YEARS], the euro depreciated overall by 15.2 % against the Chinese renminbi-yuan, 15.0 % against the United States dollar and by 12.3 % against the Swiss franc. You don’t see an issue but I do and I don’t think the people of El Salvador have to be stolen from.
(Sorry for the massive editing, Aaron. I changed some things I might not have explained correctly.)
How is this relevant? the video also showed many people happy because now they don’t have to travel and wait for 3 hours to pay an electric bill, they just take a picture of the bill and send the BTC payment via an app.
Why do you care how he built his property? he’s not a criminal so he can pay for his properties any way he chooses. I’m sure to buy any property you need to give your name and you need to go on some kind of register to get the deed and you also have to pay taxes. I don’t get your point here.
This is the first crypto currency ever, of course there will be massive fluctuations in value at the beginning. Due to current demand I think the lowest it will go is £25k.
So El Salvadorian banks have no apps? Well, there is room for improvement.
Some people happy? That’s ok, did you read up on my post about the unhappy people? or are they to be shunned as “Bitcoin disbelievers” and be considered üntermensch?
My point is that guy is doing the same as “my hypothetical evil plans” and you are still completely oblivious to it. That’s okay, he is innocent until proven guilty and in that country, he has the president’s friends in his pocket so no one will bother him. He’s a respectable minister. I will pray for him later tonight…
So you want the people of El Salvador use bitcoin, and don’t mind it’s going from 28.112,06 to 25.000,00? Damn. I still hope you just don’t understand economy.
I’ve discussed why your plan wouldn’t work as efficiently as you think. You failed to answer one of my questions and moved on. Criminals can keep passing the BTC from criminal to criminal but at some point someone will have to provide their name in order to exchange it, and while they are passing it from criminal to criminal records that can never be deleted are being created which could be used as evidence against them.
I don’t think it is possible to rent or buy a property without giving your name or ID, people have got too much to loose these days so I really don’t think a sensible person would sell or rent a home to a random person using crypto without bothering to ask their name or see any ID. I certainly wouldn’t.
Ok, well in your opinion money laundering does not exist. I respect your opinion but think the opposite. And Bitcoin is a part of the scheme. It’s ok, we have opposing views on a obfuscated subject.
I never said that. I implied a criminal must be stupid if they want to use a financial system where the records can’t be deleted and the public have access to them.
First of all, “the public” doesn’t know the criminal’s ID. The exchanges do, that’s what you told us.
Second of all, records aren’t deleted in banks either, they are kept on paper for a long time and since a lot of years keep the records digitally forever. #InBefore5yearRule. For five years after the date the account is closed.
Again, Bitcoin (or other crypto) is not innovative or better than what is already in existence. It does not help the average person. It does help corrupt dictatorships, Belarus will also create a tax-free haven for bitcoin.