NFT's are Fundamentally a MLM-Type Scam Designed to Get You to Buy Crypto

Communications Center Out Of Pod Experience
811

Not a net profit. He wrote the balance is still negative, he didnt get everything he invested. Its still a net loss. I also wonder how and waht he values as investment, if time is taken into account, and if other expenses are included like rent, food etc. How it looks overall, in the “books”. Or are everyday needs financed by work, and this hobby is only the cost of hardware and maybe power? Who knows.

Thats an overstatement. You dont know how intelligent they are, nor how much they agree with me. By simple fact that someone made transaction in bitcoin because he could, because he had been given a small amount of would be money he could exchange for goods, and wanted to use it, you cant say how intelligent they are or what they think of BTC.

You are fabricating some cryptopropaganda as you go.

These are facts:
https://fortune.com/2022/01/12/el-salvador-cryptocurrency-bitcoin-nayib-bukele-trading-loss/

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812

You can say that, but I’m not the one saying USD should be imposed on El Salvador. I’m saying to put both BTC and USD there and let them choose.

Also, it’s good to listen to the actual people this affects, some of them are happy they dont have to travel and wait 3 hours just to bay a bill. Yes, the BTC Bukele brought is now worth less but this is the whole point, it is an investment and everyone knew the price could go up or down.

A crypto currency valued at £27k is still a very strong one. Yes it is a fact their BTC is now worth 61m, but it is also a fact that the BTC value could go up quickly.

813

The problem with you is that you are blaming BTC for peoples mistakes, If people can’t log in to an exchange to sell their BTC due to internet/technical issues then how is BTC to blame exactly?

I know for the example above you will fully blame BTC for it and not understand the issue was incompetency. This is the kind of thinking I find unreasonable and I can tell a few of you think this way.

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814

They are intelligent enough to have financial prospects, and if they use BTC they do not share your beliefs. I know you think they are supposed to do what USA tells them and just use USD but you’ll have to accept they have a choice.

The sheer fact that USD is their main currency and not their own is a massive problem in it’s self. But you think a country is ok without their own currency. It might be better if you kept your opinions to yourself and just let others decide what is best for them.

The USD is also used in some countries around the Caribbean, the countries own currency value is always low where USD are used.

815

If a man goes into business for himself then such a man is more than capable of assessing how much profit is made and if it is worth their while. You must of missed where I typed in clear english that this is the happiest I have ever been financially in my whole life.

Feel free to show me any investment which has about a £1,500 initial start up cost (or free if you already have a couple of 8GB GPU’s and old computers) where one can almost make back their original investment quickly and then be in a good position to carry on earning. Link me the details and I will sign up for whatever it is right now.

I already had a lot of what was needed, For my first month I earned £40 worth of BTC and added another GPU, after 5 months I had mined enough to buy a further GPU, and then found the amount I was earning was enough to pay installments on those retail services. So I was able to pay 3 payments on a £500 GPU over 60 days which was a massive help, once or twice I had to top up what I mined with my own money due to BTC value lowering but overall I had a solid method of constantly buying cards where the miner was paying for the new cards.

816

It’s not investment if it’s active work.

You required to much time to get into that , and the return is so bad. Yeah, BTC you mine yourself are free, because you have no value at all.
Which is consistent with the quality of your interventions.

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817

Who is he? I said I made profit. Enough to even upgrade my pc.

Also, I do work, how else am I going to afford everything up to the point to play the game and pay for the sub? Taking into account things I already cover with my wage to see if it’s worth making money off of a hobby is silly considering it’s already covered. Plus, considering my electric bill and sub combined was less than the amount I made back from actual trades I made a net profit. Regardless, even if I couldn’t cover the cost of electricity and the sub I’d still participate in it. I don’t need money as an incentive to play a video game considering I’m playing eve and making none. I enjoyed EQ2 and the money I made from it made it more enjoyable. I eventually did quit the game but that was before they took down the servers and only because rl friends were playing other games I found interesting and joined them in it. The only people who would treat it like a job are the ones who complain that’s what it’d become and they’re a bunch of hypocrites too because they’d participate in it weather they were upset and quitting to gain something from it or just start treating it like a job and stay silent about it from thence forth.

818

Reddit - Dive into anything
Hilmar : We do desire the future that people play our game, they feed their families (via game), and can ensure their retirement lives, and blockchains are the way to achieve it. I don’t believe it’s the only way though, should try it at least. That’s how EVEs world last forever, and we share the same goal as cryptocurrencies supporters do.

That is extremely concerning, and reinforces my fear that EVE’s days are numbered under the leadership of Pearl Abyss. If this is the future of EVE, then EVE has no future.

I unfortunately overlooked EVE for most of the last decade, and it seems that now is the last chance to experience it properly. Hopefully it gets at least another year before becoming unrecognizable.

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819

You claim USD is bad for El Salvador. You did not say why that is, this is insulting.
About 20% of El Salvador’s population resides abroad, mainly in the United States, and together they send large amounts of money to relatives still living in the country. Before 2001, these beneficiaries got US Dollars and immediately exchanged them for Salvadoran Colones in order to spend them domestically. This resulted in an artificially overvalued Colón that made the country’s exports less competitive.

At the same time, even with a rising currency the country risk kept interest rates high, which didn’t let the economy grow as fast as it could. As long as the currency was controlled by the local government, there would always be a risk of devaluation which was reflected in interest rates.

In order to fix these problems, in 2001 the government adopted the US Dollar as a reference currency establishing a static exchange rate (8.75 Colones = 1 USD), but it also went further by allowing the Dollar as legal tender. At the same time, the banks converted all their accounts to Dollar-denominated deposits and in a very short time, the Colón disappeared: although it is still the official currency, in practice it doesn’t exist.

And the same works for other countries that adopted it to save their economy from vulture-capitalists. Can you explain me in economic terms why the dollar is bad for the businesses?

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820

Have a look at this article written in 2011;

Adopting the dollar in 2001 didn’t work out well for many of the poor in El Salvador. A unified worldwide currency such as BTC can help with global trade.

I’ll quote a paragraph from the link;

The poorest Salvadorians are the most affected by dollarization. When the dollar was adopted, all businesses [needed to change their prices and translate them into dollars. This led to a phenomenon known as “rounding up”. Because the colon-dollar exchange rate was not an exact value, but a fraction, the shift to the dollar caused businesses to change from colon to dollar by rounding up to the nearest dime, quarter or dollar. This left the poorest Salvadorians worse off because while prices rose, wages did not, leaving everyone with a lower real income. However, since the poorest Salvadorans have very low incomes, a fraction of a dollar comprises a larger part of their income than the average Salvadoran.

What I’d like to see is these poorer El Salvadorians get together with their families and all contribute to buying a GPU mining rig and earning money.

Also the Fed plans to raise interest rates in March 2022 which will further affect the poor in El Salvador due to many of them having personal or business loans/mortgages./credit cards.

This is part of the problem I have with society with regard to low-income or poor people, The financial institutions need them to be poor so they can lend them $1 and get back $3. What I like about BTC is that these low income people can now invest comfortably in hardware and use it to generate currency. If this works well then hopefully we will see less poor people in El Salvador obviously this is no good for the people that rely on lending them money, I’m excited to see how this progresses.

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821

I read the article and your post was very good. But there is no ‘helping the poor become gorillionaires’ in the article that I posted. Their central bank did not have the skills to run the country’s economy, thus it was collapsing together with their banking industry. Their only way out was the dollar or even worse conditions for the majority of the people. What did not help is always corrupt people in charge. Thus nor USD not BTC nor FairyDustMoney nor their own currency would have helped much. Society as a whole needs to be reconstructed and in those difficult situarions it’s a struggle of the fittest. All you prooved was that BTC just like any other coin will not help the poor.

Not sure how you look at the poor but if they have over $10000 to spare to mine bitcoin, a cheap house/apartment/condominium, a stable internet connection, I’m afraid they aren’t poor El Salvadorians. In poor regions people use phones as they are very low cost for the albeit limited options the give compared to computers. But this is straying us a little too far out of the NFT/crypto discussion. A coin whether backed by a country or backed by some group of poor people programming. Damn, Obama was right as always, learn to code. :slight_smile:

822

No clue what you’re on about, I said poor El Salvadorians should buy GPUs which cost £500 each, They can mine other crypto currencies like Ethereum via Nicehash and be paid in BTC. I don’t think you’re paying attention. How are you ever going to work out if BTC is a scam or not if you’re not understanding there are different levels of crypto mining? I’ve mentioned GPU/Nicehash mining for BTC about 30 times in this thread alone.

You are an extremely ignorant person why would you think I’m suggesting poor people should buy ASICs? when they are so expensive?

This is the problem with the world, there’s people like you about manipulating all kinds of crap just so you can get paid. Are you even aware that you are an extremely dismissive and ignorant person?

Look, I am here for real talk only and I wish to discuss facts and logic. If you’re going to ignore something I have mentioned 30 times already then it’s no use me typing to you. Either you keep the convo real or I’m out.

How on earth did you read that as buy ASIC’s worth £10,000?

I guess if you ignore the fact one can be paid in BTC by using old/new 8GB GPU’s to mine other crypto currencies then your point makes sense.

823

Sorry to keep deboooonking your fairy tales; In El Salvador,
For people that have jobs, the median salary is 1,600 USD per month, which means that half (50%) of the population are earning less than 1,600 USD while the other half are earning more than 1,600 USD.

A family of four estimated monthly costs are 1,806.36€ ($2,045.84) without rent. A single person estimated monthly costs are 502.10€ ($568.66) without rent. In 2021, it is estimated that 3 out of 10 people living in El Salvador live in poverty. These families live on less than $5.50 per day per person.

Since many people from El Salvador work in the USA, they can send their family USD (that does not get converted in any casino coin) so they can barely make rent. That’s a little solution. So you suggest those 50% invest over half or more of their wage for one video card? I suggest you set up a charity and do that because they can’t financially do that, which is also why they aren’t doing it in the first damn place. Stop claiming you want to help them, you know for a fact the 50% of the population are too poor to join your casino/ MLM game.

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824

You talk crap. a 2nd hand 8GB GPU is around £200, a new one designed and made in 2022 is around £500. Plus I’m sure there will be many PC gamers there so many will have these GPU’s already.

I’m gonna leave this convo, you can go ahead and keep ignoring things and the world will just move on without you. You haven’t debunked anything, all you’ve done is ignore and pretend you didn’t read facts because your narrative is more important to you than getting to the bottom of what’s going on.

You’ve literally ignored almost everything i’ve said, you are a waste of time.

I bet you’ve actually got a few 8GB GPU’s lying around your home and you will most likely leave them where they are and never try connecting them with Nicehash and earning money just so you can continue with your narrative. This is a sad way to live. If you are curious about crypto then try a few things like mining with your old gpu’s, if not ignore it stop typing essay’s about it and get on with your life.

826

Which is actually one of the reasons they introduced Bitcoin as a currency in the first place, as it allows instant global money transfare for almost free.

In stark contrast to this, wire transfares with the legacy system have huge base fees attached to them because of the cost this businesses have to operate. So if you send $100 to your family in El Salvador they will just get a fraction of it in the end.

The idea isn’t necessarily that El Salvadorians use Bitcoin as currency. It’s more that they use Bitcoin and especially Lightning as a payment network. The app the gouvernment provides is interoperable with lightning, but on top of that it can instantly convert to dollars.

So essentially they now can receive money from all over the world, for basically free, on their smartphone, and they can chose if they recive the money in Bitcoin or dollars.

They are not the only one doing this. A company called Strike is doing the same thing, here is how that goes:

The way they do this is they onboard to bitcoin exchanges all over the world to convert from bitcoin to whatever currency localy and back. Bitcoin is only used as a bearer asset for global transfer. Since the transfer is instant volatility isn’t an issue. The most surprising thing is that even though there are two trades, they are sometimes even cheaper than regular Forex rates between the two currencies, which sounds strange, but is probably because the Bitcoin market is actually more efficient than Forex.

This will simply distrupt global money transfers. It’s so much more efficient. There isn’t anything even remotely compareable in the legacy financial world. And it’s all because Bitcoin is a native digital asset. It would not be possible otherwise and this is why we couldn’t even do this until now.

Since Bitcoin has trading pairs and liquidity in virtually every currency in the world this will eventually reach everyone.

In this system, Bitcoin is essentially already working as the global reserve currency. Even if regular people will not own Bitcoin, they will eventually use it when they make cross border payments without even knowing. It’s completely inevitable, because it so much more efficient than legacy banking rails.

If a country bans it, they essentially exclude themselves from the most efficient global payment network and shoot themselves in the foot in the process (hi China). Their financial institutions will be at a serious disadvantage compared to companies in countries that don’t ban it.

So you can hate it all you want, think it’s a scam all you want, the opinion of the regular pleb doesn’t matter anymore. It’s capitalized enough already for this to work, it has essentially already won.

There is obviously one more step to make this even more efficient if you get rid of the two conversions. But I will leave the speculation about what that implies for the future of money to you :slightly_smiling_face:

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827

Nope. BTC is much slower and much more expensive than “legacy banking”.

Thank you for claiming it’s a scam made out of no reasonable idea.

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828

I think this is accurate, In this day and age most people want things done as efficiently and quickly and as secure as possible which is something BTC can provide. Having a dismissive and ignorant approach toward BTC in the future may work against some people and it might restrict them in certain ways if the rest of the world is using it.

Oh look!! Here is a story for you BTC/Crypto haters to chew on. A 14 year old and a 9 year old are earning $32,000 per month mining Ethereum. They started off with 1 gaming machine they already owned.

https://fortune.com/2021/08/16/ethereum-mining-brother-sister-make-32000-per-month/

If a 14 and 9 year old can do it with the help of their dad and youtube then I expect other people on low incomes can do the same and work their way out of poverty. This really is a time for celebration and I am happy for people on low incomes as there really is light at the end of the tunnel, I might even spent a little of my time helping them get set-up free of charge.

If there’s anyone who needs some pointers on getting set up please feel free to shoot me a mail in-game, maybe we can get a Voice chat server going and build a nice little community full of miners, investors, NFT’ers.

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829
830

Those fees you obviously do not mention range from $0 to $2 for your $100 example for Western Union and 7 other money transfers I tried.
Transferring 0,000025 BTC would cost how much? Hypothetical I have 100 euro and want to send it to my brother in Mali who will pay for things in CFA-Franc. How much will it cost? Also is that cost fix or variable.

The app needs to be programmed and maintained and secured. This costs money.

The exchange of money might be where they get their funds. Again, with low fees how can they scale and keep it working.

Its not because a thing works you can build an economy on it.

Oh a video of Jack Mallers, a rich kid. How edgy! Whoa kewlzors! We should all stay children. He grew up as a millionair’s fils a papa. lol. Baby Power. Anyways, I use my bank’s app to pay and receive money. Works just like that app he showed. Not sure what it’s contributing. He does play a very good role of the “edgy teen” at 27, lol like in the movies. But he knows he’s scamming. He’ll just 420 blaze it when more “greater fools” are stuck in his way to earn money.

I guess followed by… peace on earth.

831

Good point, if millions upon millions use it then this is a great tool for advertising, maybe a 5 second add pops ups when the program starts on your phone? If I wanted to market a product/service to lots of people quickly then I would pay a company like Strike for advertising space.

This is exactly how Google makes their money, they got everyone googling information and then made it easy for companies to market products to those people. On top of that whatever you searched for is stored and then you see adverts for it on other websites you visit. So, through people using a financial money transfer network you can drum up lots of advertising opportunities.

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