After a long time dealing with these people, I’ve decided to make this thread to rank and catalog various null-sec alliances in terms of how cowardly and risk-averse they are in relation to their empire-space operations. Their null-sec behaviors would be for a different thread, but that thread would pretty much have the same scores and descriptions of botting and blobbing across the board anyway, so what’s the point?
Multiple factors are going to be considered here, such as how they handle themselves in engagements, how prone they are to attack, defend, or run away, what kind of fits they use, how much they try to stack the odds in their favor using N+1 mechanics, how salty and/or toxic they get in local chat, et cetera. These rankings are of course subjective, and I’ll edit the post accordingly with new experiences and input from other posters.
PS: I’ve been getting a few threats recently. If you’re angry about something I’ve said about your alliance, you can simply right-click my alliance and send a mutual war invite. You won’t even need a war HQ, or to pay a war fee (I recommend using the money to bankroll a ship replacement program for your campaign against us). Alternatively, you can challenge me to come to your space (a.k.a. where the REAL PvPers live); just let me know where to go, and how many hundreds of people I’ll be fighting at once after waiting for you to form up your response fleet. Thank you.
Good old Russian EVE orgs!
Let’s get this out of the way right away: not a single one of them has ever been war-eligible (and the irony considering what’s going on in the world right now is not lost on me). The only way to get them into a war is to infiltrate them and dump a structure somewhere, which gives you just enough time to shoot them for a day during the war cooldown period after their commissars kick the structure-holding group and execute the mid-level managers who let this incompetence slip through, just like back in those good old Soviet days.
Using stabs, cloaks, various forms of ECM, and every other avoidance item or mechanic isn’t just prevalent, it’s downright a requirement in order to be a member. This is somewhat mitigated by the fact that these players don’t seem to know how to actually play the game, and their ship setups usually reflect that. These players literally exist to farm as much ISK as possible for their RMT mafia bosses, and nothing else. And if you do anything to interrupt that daily grind, you get levels of toxicity unheard of not just in EVE, but in any other game:
While members of other groups lash out occasionally, when you attack a Russian org member, you get this sort of reaction pretty much every single time. They don’t even bother to fight back (if they even know how to); they just start the racism, sexism, and real-life threats the second a warp scrambler hits their ship.
Though let me clarify an important distinction: this phenomenon only seems to apply to Russian EVE organizations. Encountering Russian players outside of those organizations yields slightly more conventional interactions. But something about getting them in a group results in an unprecedented, legendary level of social dysfunction.
Oof. Where to even begin.
These players do everything in their power to avoid any and all engagements they don’t specifically seek out, and their kill board reflects this fact well. My two most recent engagements with these players were an Omen Navy Issue that dumped ECM drones and warped away from my destroyer (I caught him later with a Vigilant to ensure destruction), and a Kikimora pilot who instantly ejected the moment I tackled him. Their losses are full of ships with cloaks, stabs, and ECM of all varieties. Also, they get pretty weird in chat:
I mean, yes, but…do you really have to ask this in front of my BLACKFLAG. chaperone?
Just a terrible showing all around, which is a bitter irony considering their alliance name. I think they should disband, and their members should all go their separate ways to mine in high-sec, which seems to be their preferred activity anyway.
Yikes. What an absolute disaster.
Out of all the groups I’ve ever fought, this one is all the way up there in terms of never engaging back in fights, even when having a considerable ship advantage. On top of that, like lizards shedding their tails when being threatened by predators, these players have a disproportionate tendency to immediately eject from their ships when attacked:
I have stacks upon stacks of haulers, battleships, Orcas, Bowheads, that were all Pandemic Horde ejections. Probably close to twenty Deep Space Transports. Three Bowheads. Three!
They will very often cry in local like pigs being butchered in a slaughterhouse:
They will beg for help:
They will be super-toxic and insult you:
In very rare instances, I’ve run into Pandemic Horde players who were up for a fight, and we had a good time. I guess with an organization that large, the law of averages dictates that it has to happen at some point. That’s the only reason why I’m not giving them a “perfect” cowardice score.
This ladder was intended for null-sec groups only. However, I’d be doing the community a massive disservice if I don’t include groups that are such extreme null-sec aspirants, and that are so egregiously null-sec adjacent in their gameplay and behavior, that they might as well pack up all their stuff and move into the drone regions (PS: let me know if you want to borrow my jump freighter when you do).
S R S. are ostensibly a high-sec mercenary organization. However, they don’t seem to do much of any actual mercenary work. Mostly they look for little mom-and-pop carebear corporations, and extort their owners into paying protection fees under the threat of dumping a few dozen Paladins on mining-fit Athanors defended by two or three AFK Retrievers.
In recent times, they were able to beg their way into becoming BLACKFLAG. pets (something they brag about often), eliminating the one source of danger they had in the game, and freeing themselves up to farm ISK from their racket because they no longer have to worry about being a near-peer adversary to the biggest fish in the pond. That’s pretty cowardly, if you ask me.
They also do high-sec “wars” against most of the other alliances on this list. However, these wars solely consist of sitting on the Amarr hub station and popping corvettes, shuttles, and pods. Here’s how their kill board looks like today (2023.08.31):
What a bunch of absolute space-Chads.
I decided to plug their statistics into Excel, and here’s what I got:
Only 35.7% of their kills are actual ships.
Let’s go a little deeper, and take a look at how they stack up to null-sec blobbers:
Their solo ratio is lower than that of the two largest, blobbiest alliances in the game, whose main PvP gameplay consists of massive-scale fleet warfare. And other, smaller null-sec organizations have higher solo ratios than this. No one tell them this, but groups like SICO and Absolute Honor have nearly twice the solo ratio of S R S. The shame might just be too much to bear.
We can therefore conclude that S R S. most definitely belongs on this list. But what caused them to be this way?
The answer lies in the self-imposed culture of risk-aversion and cowardice. One doesn’t need to look far for evidence. In fact, they can’t stop talking about it to anyone within earshot. It’s almost as if it’s a source of pride for them:
But when some group comes by to poke around on occasion (e.g. The Red Kings Guard, Phoenix Naval Systems, and ATLAS CORPORATION S.A), they are strangely quiet, sitting inside their space hut and waiting for the threat to go away so they can get back to farming the empty pods of players looking for an express ride to their null-sec homes.
Though one that’s entirely par for the course.
They get 7 points, for a total cowardice score of 43. The only reason it’s not even higher is because what they do can still technically be considered as “PvP.” And because 7 is the average number of alts used by their members.
(37 38 because Wadiest Yong is being a meanie)
(38 41 because a Praxis safe-logged instead of fighting my Merlin)
Your generic null-sec bot-farming blobbers. I’ve rarely been engaged back by any of their members whenever they flew combat ships. They never take any bait (even bait they should easily be able to defeat), and must be aggressively pursued. I’ve laid out Ventures in front of their interceptors, assault frigates, cruisers, and even a battleship once, and they never, ever went for it. Cloaks, stabs, and ECM drones are standard fare on pretty much everything they fly. While they aren’t particularly whiny or toxic, occasionally they’ll complain in local as they’re being killed.
They get a few points for being one of the few groups willing to attack war HQs. However, they only do so to smaller groups and/or only when they can bring enough people to ensure an easy win, so it’s actually kind of a wash.
The only exposure I have to C C P Alliance is from back when I was in R I O T and we started a war with them before some event. Then they deleted the war (without refunding the war fee) and warned us not to try griefing them again. That’s pretty cowardly if you ask me. Almost as cowardly as teleporting your titan away after getting tackled in low-sec, which is exactly what a frozen treat-themed GM did a few years ago. And while I get that there were some technical considerations at hand, the honoUrable thing to do would be to self-destruct the thing and give players a wreck on which to chew.
I’m not going to drag these guys all the way through the mud, because occasionally they do fight players. Just not, you know, in any meaningful capacity. I know that if I were a dev, I’d continue playing exactly the way I do now, being open season for anyone who wants to try.
( 25 24 because I saw a lone Goon manhandle an entire MSF gang in Amarr)
Good old Goons. If ever there were Olympic games for middle-of-the-pack mediocrity, Goons would be dominating the podium. Everything about them is just so…average. There are no experiences that I’ve had with them that particularly stand out. I can’t even find any interesting screenshots of Goon interactions in my pile.
Some avoidance, but not all the time. Some smack talk, but only occasionally. Their fits are workable. They will engage back when being attacked at an acceptable rate. They will occasionally take bait, and not make a big deal about it afterward. They will more often than not say “gf” in local after a fight.
Like the baby bear’s bowl of porridge, Goons are just right. Goons are like the 6/10 wife you settle for, even if it’s not exactly the one you wanted. Goons will be there for you when you come home and ask you about your day. Goons might be a bit plump around the edges, but they’re going to carry their own bag when you go hiking instead of burying their face in a cell phone. Goons are the epitome of a steady stream of content that might not dazzle, but also won’t disappoint.
Because of the whole null-sec blobbing stuff, I was going to give them a 30/50 score, as I’m not particularly willing to go below that for such groups. But since a Goon recently absolutely dunked on me, I felt like shaving off 5 cowardice points, and putting them right in the middle of the pack.
Not bad. I haven’t seen them do anything egregious, though have noted some risk-averse gameplay like using warp core stabs and a disproportionate reliance on cloaking devices. They also have a higher than average rate of engaging back during fights, which is respectable.
I’m docking them a few points for the way they (unsuccessfully) sieged our war HQ once. Their gang was just a bit too big for the resistance they were expecting (1-2 people), and even then they tried to do the whole ranged-kitey thing instead of going for a straight-up brawl.
I’ve been consistently impressed by IVY. They will form up and take the fight to you, and also engage back during individual encounters. Some light smack-talk here and there, but nothing that stands out.
Still, they aren’t getting a perfect score, mainly due to their moderate tendency to blob and/or rely on allies, and their, dare I say…political aversion to non-conventional PvP mechanics like piracy, wars, ganking, scamming, et cetera. Their leadership views these with relative disdain, and only teaches avoidance mechanisms instead of offering classes on how to proactively engage in these activities as part of a complete EVE curriculum.
These cobra chickens absolutely terrify me. I might be a sly fox, and have managed to pick some of them off from the periphery. But most of the time, whenever I tried to snatch a gosling from the gaggle, the mama goose would puff up her chest, spread her wings, and charge at me like one of those horror game animatronic puppets.
The only reason I’m docking a few points is because they aren’t proactive attackers. A couple of times I laid out some feed, but they never bit, opting instead to honk at me passive-aggressively as they continued on their migratory flight south toward the Catch region.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? (??/50)
I’m, uh, not entirely sure what to say here. I’ve had a few run-ins with these players as war targets, but I don’t have the words to actually describe those interactions, because they felt devoid of any of the idiosyncrasies associated with common human behavior. It felt like I was engaging in PvE content every single time, as opposed to engaging in combat with other players. I would attack, and they would lock me back, and just either sit there motionless while their weapons auto-fired, or maybe go off flying in a random direction. Their ships would die, and their pods would warp to the next gate on their routes, sitting there until they could finally jump through (I don’t usually pod players, so I’ve been able to observe this behavior directly). And they never said anything in local (neither positive nor negative). It felt like I was shooting at NPCs.
Additionally, I’ve tried to interact with their leadership verbally on a few occasions, mostly in the form of offering to ally in on the many wars that they routinely get. In the rare instances when I was able to get through to someone, it was a person who barely spoke English. As I explained to them what I wanted (which usually took a primer on high-sec PvP mechanics because they mostly didn’t seem to be aware of what the war system even is), I always got the feeling that the people I spoke with didn’t pay attention to the conversation, and that their attention was entirely elsewhere, as if they were trying to meet some deadline or quota or something, and couldn’t even bother to look at the chat for more than a few seconds. It felt like trying to communicate with a ChatGPT bot.
As such, it’s impossible to assign this group an actual score.
More to come. If you’d like to recommend an alliance to review, please feel free to do so!