I would just like to point out that while capsuleers could easily repeatedly by entire regions’ SCC markets empty of slaves to set them free, this is generally not done at “fair prices”, because it is accepted wisdom that it feeds slave raids and slave trade. Mock orders of 0.01 isk to transfer legal papers are more common, and some question even that practice.
We do buy people into freedom, obviously. Concerted campaigns, targetted groups. But rarely indiscrimnantly.
Until they up their breeding programmes to meet the demand and more slaves than ever before become a partbof the system. Unfortunately, slaves are not a finite resource to make supply and demand a long-term target for those who wish to stop the trade altogether.
You are looking at slaves as if they are a freely and regularly traded commodity on the whole across the market and that there would exist a means of making a margin on said commodity, Mr Hyasyoda.
This is not the case. Amarrian slaves, on the whole, do not change hands overly often and tend to stay from generation to generation with the same Holder family, or at most a handful of Holder families through that particular slave’s bloodline. This is intended within Amarrian society as slaves are meant to be working off the sins of their forebearers while also being educated in the faith. A Holder would be disrespecting their duty if they treated their slaves purely as a commodity to margin trade or exchange at a frequent rate.
The listings for slaves on the Capsuleer market is a drop in the ocean compared to the general slave population and often serves as a means of offloading excess stock, so to speak, by Holders and/or organisations. The reasons for this are many and varied, from attempting to wash one’s hands of more troublesome slaves, trying to liquidate them due to urgent financial reasons, or simply looking to make an unscrupulous profit without any care of the end owner.
Trying to buy out slaves, or end slavery, in some kind of SCC market manipulation is a prime example of crying out into the wind.
That is a massive stretch, sir, with absolutely no founding apart from empty conclusions. ‘X’ happens, therefore ‘y’, without any demonstration of evidence how x actually connects to y. It’s also quite the lead from arguing slaves across the board are a good you can margin bet on and manipulate the price of easily.
Slaves, while indeed traded and sold for both legitimate financial reasons and also far less scrupulous ones, are not as a whole a regular marginable commodity like wheat is, for example. That is the only sound conclusion one can draw from knowing the facts. Again, to refer to the original post here, attempting to bet a position on the SCC as a means of freeing (mass purchases, price manipulation) slaves is not a tenable ongoing position since the SCC listings are not the majority of the slave market/population.
… this is really not accurate. For one, the sale of slaves has no contradiction with traditional Amarrian religious beliefs about slave holding. If anything, it upholds it. For two, this does happen. Slaves are sold as a punishment, they are sold as a product (my lord’s family dealt in the training and sale of highly educated slaves for high-end occupations), they are sold as excess stock, they are traded around determined by capabilities (a slave trained or experienced in a field that is unneeded in the Holder’s industries), they are sold because they can no longer benefit the Holder that employs them (due to sickness, injury, stubbornness, etc), they are sold for collections or as trophies, and they are sold for pure profit to unscrupulous actors (sale of slaves for the purpose of sex trafficking, Sansha’s Nation, Nauplius, and to other foreigners by organizations like the Civic Court) in spite of religious customs.
Slave sale and trade is a massive industry in the Empire, one that some Holder families focus entirely on.
And many Holders have said that Amarr is in a state of slave shortage right now.
My point wasn’t slaves aren’t sold period, my point is they are not on the whole a commodity bought and sold with the frequency such that one can bet margin positions on, nor is it the case that as a general rule individual slaves on the whole are traded and moved between large numbers of holders within their own life time like a corporation stock or a futures bet on the price of wheat.
Slaves are indeed sold and traded, but under the basis of more of a long term commodity or investment, as they produce labour. The profits of that labour are one way to reclaim cost, as it’s unlikely you’re going to see a slave produce profit simply from margin trading their perceived value for every owner. That emphasis on labour production brings the likely average number of owners of a given slave down, since the primary value comes from its produce (similar to marketable investment bonds) not its fluctuating price (such as with stock or currency).
I also note my comments, again, were specifically in relation to the SCC market, since the original premise of the post was about freeing slaves from purchases on the SCC and also Mr Hyasyoda’s market manipulation tangent.
Two things:
When I spoke of “fair” price, I meant that as a trader technical term: market price with acceptable margin, not manipulated.
I spoke of the SCC market as an example of where the thinking already exists, because one, most people buying slaves free have limited access to internal Holder markets for fairly obvious reasons, and two, SCC market is only semi-legal (open trade, no checks whatsover for whether the buyer is legit) and thus feeds the raid markets even more directly.
Hope this clarifies.
Buy the slaves, give em guns, kill the slavers, take the slaves, give em guns, kill the raiders, buy the slaves, give em guns.
Giving criminals guns… what possibly could go wrong?
I’ll just hope they’ll shoot you first.
In terms that you would likely understand: Give Caldari POW’s guns so that they may break out of POW camps.
The biggest issue is the more slaves you by the more profitable it becomes, so you end up encouraging more raids to meet demand. Honestly raids against holders and cultivating rebellion are a much better way of liberating anyone. Try to aid Minmattar forces in liberating their kin, smuggle weapons and supplies to rebel groups, help transport freed slaves out of Amarr space.
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