Permabumping fix

[BIade_Runner]

No, you need to let your iwin button to be taken away

[BIade_Runner]

Suicide ganking is just not a reasonable counter for a freighter pilot. What are you saying is that suicide ganking must be a mandatory and mainstream form of game play. Are you sure that is really what you want?

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

What are you saying is that suicide ganking must be a mandatory and mainstream form of game play.

I’m not saying that you are misrepresenting my argument. I merely provided you with one potential counter.

[Merin_Ryskin]

@Bronson_Hughes

Why is this the criteria exactly? Not your personal opinion, not why you feel it should be so, from a purely game mechanics standpoint, why is this the criteria? Are there any other situations where a ship gets to magically escape if its attackers don’t have sufficient forces to kill it on-grid when they start an attack?

Because the standard of “must be prepared to execute your gank” is an incredibly easy one to meet, and I see no reason to pander to incompetent gank groups who feel entitled to have success handed to them.

Also, a ship doesn’t magically escape. You’re free to warp disrupt it and keep it from warping out just like you’d warp disrupt any other ship. You just can’t indefinitely exploit the fact that the game doesn’t (and probably can’t) flag bumping as an aggressive act even when it is clearly being done as one.

[BIade_Runner]

Must be a reasonable counter, not something who demand from everyone to adopt the game play style of the suicide gankers.
You also must to take in account an unexpected effect from excessive proliferation of suicide ganking, and that is the inevitable nerf bat. So i ask you again to be careful with what you wish

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

Must be a reasonable counter, not something who demand from everyone to adopt the game play style of the suicide gankers.

What are your definitionsl(s) of reasonable? I feel like we should clarify this before going forward because it would be too easy for you simply claim that a suggestion is “not reasonable” and disregard it

[BIade_Runner]

As i said, suicide ganking is still a very niche activity, if you push everyone and his dog to use that, will be most likely targeted by a swing of the nerf bat.

[Anderson_Geten]

@Jake_Javelin

You will also be racing to get to the freighter unless it lands within your limited web range.

Not at all. read my post again, I explain why.

@Jake_Javelin

As to the 1 minute weapons timer, long warps and or the 1 minute gate cloak has you covered there.

NO FFS read my post before answering random nonsense.

@Bronson_Hughes

i.e. when you have a collision box tens of kilometers wide, that tends to muck up game mechanics near said collision box

titans have a very detailed collision box. It’s fun to travel through a NPC titan in a pod.

@Bronson_Hughes

you are vulnerable to hostile action from other players.

FFS you are saying that since everything that is possible by the engine and allowed by the eula is possible in the game, then it’s free for all ? Then every game is free for all and your statement is completely meaningless. “White is white, hence eve is a shoot-them-up”.

@Bronson_Hughes

There are consequences for the person doing the bumping. They’re making themselves a massive target for friends of the ship being bumped to be suicide ganked, or their corp to be wardecced, or their market orders to be undercut, etc.

ROFL. So you are saying that it’s the same exact threat as anybody else. Those are not consequences to bumping someone. Those are consequences to playing the game. So there is no consequence to bumping someone following your own explanation.

@Bronson_Hughes

So by your own definition, taking 5, 7, or even 9 minutes means you’re not incompetent and not unprepared, right?

No. from “people who need more than 9 min are incompetent” you can deduce “competent people need less than 10min”, but NOT “people who need less than 10 min are competent”
( Contraposition (traditional logic) - Wikipedia )

@Scoots_Choco

Have you tried shooting them? There’s ‘a’ counter.

Freighters can’t fit weapons. and even if they could, this would not work as concord would kill it.

So no, no counter.

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

if you push that everyone and his dog to use it will be most likely targeted by a swing of the nerf bat.

This is a very poor argument. You are claiming that “if killing the bumping ship becomes the norm, CCP will “nerf” ganking in general, so you better come up with a solution that I like or you’ll be sorry!”

[BIade_Runner]

No it’s not, because if a quarter of the server population will start tomorrow to do suicide ganking in high sec, soon you will have huge piles of ship wrecks everywere and nobody will dare to undock anymore.

[Anderson_Geten]

@Bronson_Hughes

Are there any other situations where a ship gets to magically escape if its attackers don’t have sufficient forces to kill it on-grid when they start an attack?

Whenever they can’t point him and the ship warps off ?? You can’ point him and you can’t alpha him, he goes away.

@Bronson_Hughes

Why is this the criteria exactly? Not your personal opinion, not why you feel it should be so, from a purely game mechanics standpoint, why is this the criteria?

well if it’s why he feels, it’s his opinion. You can’t ask his opinion and say you don’t ask his opinion.

Mine is that twice the align timer should be enough. IF your ship should align in 10 s, in 20s you are sure you are in warp unless you are pointed.

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

will start tomorrow to do suicide ganking in high sec

Given that (1) shooting the bumping ship is something you can already do and (2) the entirety of high sec has NOT resorted to ganking everything in sight, I believe you are completely wrong on this claim.

Why would everyone randomly have the urge to start suicide ganking everything tomorrow?

[Anderson_Geten]

@Scoots_Choco

Given that (1) shooting the bumping ship is something you can already do and (2) the entirety of high sec has NOT resorted to ganking everything in sight, I believe you are completely wrong on this claim.

Why would everyone randomly have the urge to start suicide ganking everything tomorrow?

replace “shooting the bumping ship” by “biomass his own character” and you understand why you idea makes no sense.

[Scoots_Choco]

@Anderson_Geten

and you understand why you idea makes no sense.

Where are all these carebears coming from?

You are flying a freighter, a ship whose purpose is to be a big, defenseless hauler. If you want protection, reach out and ask some people to help provide you cover, shoot the ganking ship, or use your own alt characters to keep yourself safe.

The suggestions here only work to serve lazy, risk averse, and entitled gameplay of “I want to be safe, but put zero effort into it, so make this change for me, CCP!”

[BIade_Runner]

With more guys like you pushing suicide ganking as main way to interact with other players, is not a impossible scenario

Also think about bumping becoming so popular between players, that you have at any moment on all pipe systems hoards hundreds of Machariels bumping the s…t out from all trespassing freighters…
What do you believe that will be the devs reaction, will they let bumpers to break havoc on large numbers of their customers?

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

Also think about bumping becoming so popular between players, that you have at any moment on all pipe systems hoards hundreds of Machariels bumping the s…t out from all trespassing freighters…

The thing is, this is something people can already do, but as you can see, it’s not that common place. As much as you want to believe that harassing high sec freighters is a big issue, it’s actually an incredibly niche gameplay that most people literally could not care less about.

Your continued claim of “if I don’t like your idea, you’ll be sorry!” doeant really hold water because, again, people can already do this, but you see that they are not.

At best, this kind of freighter harassment happens occasionally to see tears and whining from highsec carebears, but your situation is not new, nor will CCP take your side and “nerf” (whatever that even means according to you) highsec ganking. With Eve being almost 16 years old and ganking not having been “nerfed” despite years of this mechanic being part of Eve, history supports my side.

[Merin_Ryskin]

@Scoots_Choco

The suggestions here only work to serve lazy, risk averse, and entitled gameplay of “I want to be safe, but put zero effort into it, so make this change for me, CCP!”

And the opposition to the suggestions is purely “I want to have guaranteed ganking success with no chance of failure, even when I’m too lazy to bother preparing an attack”.

[BIade_Runner]

@Scoots_Choco

The suggestions here only work to serve lazy, risk averse, and entitled gameplay of “I want to be safe, but put zero effort into it

Your definitions suits the suicide gankers perfectly. High sec dwellers who prey on soft targets, doing an activity with no risk involved.

The only reason for what CCP let you to go on with your disrupting and parasitic game style, is that your small numbers make your group irrelevant on grand scheme.
So stay irrelevant for your own good, or the nerf bat will land on your dear game play.

[Scoots_Choco]

@BIade_Runner

So stay irrelevant for your own good, or the nerf bat will land on your dear game play.

You keep claiming the “nerf bat” will happen, but you never actually explain what kind of “nerf” it’ll be. Do you have an actual idea in mind, or are you trying to appear threatening with a vague concept of a ‘nerf’ in general.

I would argue that you don’t even know how to nerf ganking as an activity, but that’s off topic.

The point is, people have already given you a suggestions. Your refusal to accept any of them is more evidence that this is a “I want to easily win, but not put any effort into it, CCP do it for me!” idea.

[BIade_Runner]

As i said before, the need for a fix for perma-bumping is beyond debate, as devs already tried to come with a 3 minutes warp timer to fix that.
So feel free to bring constructive critics about the fix i suggested, or move on.