Just say what you mean, you vapid troll.
Harsh words and no answers.
I apologise to all for my previous response. It was too short to convey how I felt effectively but, had I expressed more in the emotional state I was in, it would have only escalated tensions that some seem to wish to raise incredibly high already.
To my original point - should an ‘Imperial’ world declare that it does not wish PIE to attend, would they leave it off of their itinerary? - I felt it a valid question to ask.
If PIE wouldn’t attend, that would be fair on all worlds impacted by Deathglow but could become a referendum on PIE and overshadow the planned event.
If PIE would still attend, it would nullify their whole reasoning for not attending Rens. It would suggest that they don’t want to risk being shot at whilst paying respects or that they don’t want to negotiate a temporary armistice. Both are understandable explanations but it is better to couch it in honesty than to say it’s what’s best for the Matars.
I also included the reference to individuals because I felt that, if I did not, someone from PIE would pull apart my question and try to use it to avoid answering as they often do. Little did I realise that it would strike such a nerve with their Summit attack dog that she would throw out ad hominems as her only way of answering a valid question.
Now, should Ms Elkin wish to actually take a moment to be calm as I did and answer the question, I would be appreciative. Should she not be able to, I would be happy with a response from another representative from PIE. If my question, despite this explanation, is still considered only worthy of personal attacks, I would be happy with an explanation as to why that is the case also.
After all, I may be missing a key part of the equation - for all I know my question could be like a garden without any plants - to which I require further explanation.
Thank you for demonstrating that Paladin Elkin was absolutely correct to dismiss you out of hand.
All the best for your jubilee celebrations.
Imperial treasury is still stocked, right?
I’m inclined to agree that a visit to Rens and certainly Matar would be improper.
However, I strongly encourage you to recognize the victims at Rens as well as Sundsele and Atgur in some way, if only by pausing for a moment of silence at whichever point of your journey is nearest to the Republic.
Cleared Deathglow shells from a beach adjacent to her clan lands
This would be a very good compromise that would solve the quandary I posited. I hope it would be acceptable to both sides?
Or, perhaps, if both sides launched memorial fleets simultaneously and communicated that they would pause in reflection whilst the other side visited their memorial site then neutral pilots could fly with both and visit all?
Go away, des Larmes.
What was wrong with what I said this time, Arsia?
The quandary you posted is ridiculous.
You come here, having run off to the Kingdom for roughly 5 minutes, not having properly learned our Faith, laws, or customs, but because they were nice to you, you launch an absurd inquisition against those of us who have lived here and served served God and Empire for our whole lives because we’re mean to your little Kingdom friends.
You don’t understand that the animosity towards the Kingdom has good reason, you don’t understand why we hate their heretical little seal that places man above God, and you absolutely have no idea about how the Kingdom ignores our Scripture whenever convenient. But still despite your ignorance, you advocate for Kingdom worlds, like Kahah III, which is the site of some of the Kingdom’s most heinous crimes in recent history, to be enabled to opt out a ceremony honoring the victims of said crimes.
To make matters worse, you push the idea of Kingdom worlds having this autonomy in a time when the Kingdom wants control over the Fabai constellation, mocking the reference to Kahah III as an Imperial World. The Kingdom can’t have its cake and eat it too. If they can request control of territories, have representatives on the Theology Council, and the King can compete for the throne again and again, they’re part of the Empire and we should be invested in cleaning it up. Kahah is the system we should most visit.
Go away, des Larmes.
What does that have to do with a compromise with the Minmatar where you both hold memorial fleets simultaneously? Or even just holding a vigil for the people of Rens in Amarr space?
Your obsession with Aga-Count Chakaid blinded you to my actual point which was that ignoring Rens altogether cannot be down to you believing it is in their best interests. My analogy to ‘Imperial’ worlds was merely to take the same situation but remove the warzone so it, I thought, would be easier to see the other side’s point of view.
Whilst PIE flying into Minmatar space was a daft suggestion before it was raised, there was a compromise to be found. Melisma has come up with one that is very good. My addendum to it is more… ambitious?
Unfortunately it appears you have, once again, posted in rage without reading.
I hope that someone else in PIE - even if they wish to ignore my suggestion out of hand because of who I am - responds to Melisma with either ‘Yes we can do this - thank you for the idea’ or ‘No, we can’t and these are the reasons why’.
No, you fool. The reason why I didn’t give an answer as to whether or not we can carry out Ms. Ramijozana’s suggestion is because I lack the authority to make that decision. I personally like her idea, for what it’s worth.
The fact that you think Kahah was a good analogy (if I am to give you the benefit of the doubt that it was an analogy) to Rens proves that you know nothing about the situation.
Brother Paladin Commander Kazari,
The Paladin Wardens of the Providence Marches would be honored to come and once again renew our vows to God, Empress, Empire and our Margrave. If we forget why we fight and whom we fight for then all our efforts would be in vain.
We shall hopefully attend given if the battlefield of our home allows us to. For in these dark times our enemies are legion and we survive only by our faith and duty to our people.
On a brighter note it would be nice for us to go on vacation to the Empire proper. Our frontier home is rustic and a beauty to its own. However, to be in the presence of our brother Paladins and our Empress will replenish the spirit in our souls and bring joy to our hearts. Why I almost feel bad for the heretics, traitors, and Pirate scum that await us back on the battlefield in Providence.
Amarr Victor Ave Providence
Paladin Warden Kyle Saltz
You are assuming the Minmatar has an interest in participating in Amarr Empire Jubilees by holding memorial fleets.
Pro-tip: we really don’t.
Let’s review the suggestion next Tribal Assembly or Liberation Day or New Year, shall we?
So, let me get this straight…
If PIE go to Rens to pay respects, Minmatar will get mad.
If PIE don’t pay respects to those in Rens, Minmatar will get mad.
If PIE offer a compromise, Minmatar will get mad.
This sounds reductive and, in all honesty, it is. But is there anything PIE could do that either your or yours wouldn’t find objectionable?
If you table the alternatives you mention, there’s go to Republic space on one axis, and acknowledge the victims of Republic space on the other, for a standard four quarters choice diagram.
I’ll leave it as a practice to locate the quarter that would work best in the circumstances.
But personally, I was just objecting to the idea that all victims were on ‘Imperial worlds’. I don’t give a ■■■■ about what happens in the Jubilee.
PS. Look up Sundsele. It’s not in Rens.
I’m bored and feel like addressing vapid and reductive claims, so I’ll take a shot at these.
The event in question involves floating Amarr ships in Jubilee colors on a predetermined flight path. If this fleet came to visit Rens, Atgur, or Sundsele (which is on Matar, which is the Minmatar homeworld), a few things would likely happen:
The members of that fleet with low Minmatar standings would be shot by Republic military ships based on standard protocol. This would happen before they could make it to Rens.
Matari capsuleers who object to the presence of this fleet in Republic space, ie most of us, would line up at the border and wait for them to arrive, then shoot at them.
Baseliners hearing about 1 and/or 2 would freak the ■■■■ out.
“Mad” is a stupid word. Stop using it.
The Blood Raiders are typically an Empire blight. We don’t usually have to deal with them. The two occasions on which we did could be considered outliers. At Rens, Chakaid has long since been considered the culprit, and the fact that Sundsele and Atgur were attacked right after Elsebeth dared Chakaid to come for her (she has lived in both places) is nothing to sneeze at.
Chakaid has been an agent of the Kingdom, and therefore the Empire, since before these attacks began, and so an acknowledgement during the memorial fleet, even if done by Amarr loyalist capsuleers rather than the Empire itself, would go a very long way toward earning good faith among Matari capsuleers, baseliners, and maybe some factions of our government. If it isn’t done, Matari capsuleers will probably be miffed for a moment, but the rest of the Republic won’t even notice.
They haven’t yet, but at least one of their upper officials, albeit one without the ability to really make that call, appears to be interested in the one I proposed. By and large, that’s good enough.
If PIE offer a dumb-as-rocks compromise, we will roll our eyes. But in the end, it’s not our event. It doesn’t affect us. It’s their Empress and their anniversary. They’ll probably react the same way to us when Liberation Day rolls around again.
She’s conflating the attack on Sundsele with the one that happened at Rens IV last October, because instead of spending the time to research the different attacks, she’s read three IGS posts and then tossed all Minmatar under one umbrella, as she always does.
This is a ridiculous conversation. But I can assure you that PIE Command does not care about what Matari IGS commentators think of our memorial.
It should be mentioned that nearly all of PIE’s casualties from the Deathglow attacks were inflicted by Minmatar reactions to the Blooder attacks, not the Blooders themselves. It speaks to the incredible success of their operations that they achieved such results via unwitting proxies rather than direct actions. At least their ill-fated assault on Tanoo offered some form of reprise.
Perhaps if you wish us to pay respect to your dead, you should respect ours. I believe the best way to do this is to stay away from Imperial space and cease hostile operations against the same authorities that are tasked with eliminating the Sanist threat in our borders. That is, respect our dead by not creating any more.