Proposal for Rebalancing of the Suicide Gank

I already explained this is incorrect. The cost of a freighter gank in 0.5 or 0.6 is not just 20x t2 catalyst. The price is 1.9 bilion x 20 gank alts + at the minimum 1 scan alt, but lets count with two as due to the fact that the hs is so empty these days you would be looking for a target at single gate entire day and you might not find it and 1 looter alt. 23 accounts * 1.9b = 43,7 billion or 460$$$ per month.

There are perhaps groups able to gank with real players, but that is extremely rare from many reasons which only get more emphasis on with less players playing overall. I used to be ganking with one group in past and this group has disassembled and now its multibox ganking and they didn’t want me to help them anymore. It is sad, but game mechanics and state of the highsec are enforcing this.

Of course, you don’t need 20 ganking alts, it depends on what is your target and primary aim, but if you want reliably gank freighters or Orcas especially if they aren’t x3 cargohold (because that then heavily limits number of your targets - there might be a 7bil freighter passing your sector, but because you have only 15 accounts you have no way to kill him because he fitted one reinforced bulkheads. But still, the price is 1.9bil per account and at miimum 2 accounts for scan+loot will always be needed.

This price will not pay itself if you choose to gank miners, that is unprofitable activity overall - I made some money ganking those using harvester drone back in 2018, but it is very rare to find such player in 0.5 or 0.6 and in 0 tanked Hulk as well. And even if you find such guy, and he will often be dozen of jumps away from your staging area, he can still avoid the gank easily if he pays attention or is just lucky. And all the time and effort you spent into it is lost. I used to gank miners with a friend, but he quit that exactly due to this reason - long time waiting doing nothing till I find a target, and then they dock before we get there or after we enter local and we spend 30 minutes of stupid jumping between sectors for nothing. This is just an example why is ganking purely multibox activity now.

So again, if you want to realiably gank miners you need at minimum 1 combat probe alt and at minimum 4 catalyst gankers total price is 9.5 bil a month. And you need to make money for this elsewhere because ganking miners is not going to fund this even from 10%.

If you still think that ganking is cheap you are idiot.

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I said that the Catalyst ganking of freighters made it too cheap, you decided to extrapolate that to me saying all ganking is too cheap, who is the idiot here?

When I stop seeing empty freighters being ganked and when I see that freighters are ganked when they are carrying 4bn + then I will think it is fine on that. Until it is at that level I think it is unbalanced

That is the point there on the Talos, that is what I want to see. And this is why the OP’s post was good, he hit the nail on the head with that one.

Why should empty freighters be immune to PvP?

It sure sounds like you want to end ganking of empty freighters!

JUST DRACVLAD BEING DRACVLAD

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Oh those are very nice tables, but they are missing the crucial thing that I am repeating over and over and that is price of a sub. If you would do the math you would see that even freighter ganking is barely profitable. It starts to be profitable if you kill dozens of whales and get decent loot fairy rolls and get to loot it all. If you won’t manage to kill this many either due to the fact that you can’t play that much, or because you find no suitable targets or because they outplay you, you are bleeding ISK here no matter if you use 30 catalysts or half that amount of taloses. Or you pay 460 euro for this if you are another type of whale yourself but that won’t make it any cheaper ingame.

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Which Aiko player are you?

Cost / benefit

One of the players that runs Aiko decided that I said that.

Aiko being Aiko, except, Aiko could be one of three different people perhaps?

Eve is supposed to be a group game, sorry but bringing together a fleet should involve more than just one player.

That’s not much of a reason - for someone who writes so much, it’s interesting that you seem unable to actually address the issue. I think maybe you know it’s not a rational argument.

JUST DRACVLAD BEING OBTUSE

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I am being very direct and to the point on this. But which player are you?

Why would I tell you which Aiko I am?

No you are wrong here. This is the idealism that most players have, me included.

CPP clearly made this game to be a multiboxing game. If you don’t multibox you can’t do pretty much anything efficiently. Every single activity in this game is boring as hell with tons of time you just sit on a screen where is nothing happening which further encourages multiboxing.

And it is not just gankers who multiíbox, miners and índustry players often have even more alt accounts than gankers.

Dracvlad doesn’t actually like EvE, so he expects CCP to change the whole game for him.

I would like to propose an additional balancing to ganking:

  • Gankers shouldn’t be allowed to gank while docked at a computer workstation in a safe space. If someone wants to gank, their IP should only be allowed to come from Somalia, North Korea, the Donbass, that place in Mexico where the drug cartels are beheading all those people, or NYC’s Upper East Side.

If you want to gank, you shouldn’t be any more safe than your victims! Time for some realistic consequences, gwankers… :smirk:

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I am fine with multi-boxing, I am against what I call excessive multi-boxing. Perhaps you should go look at this video in terms of the boring part:

I did notice many gankers get fed up with their endless farming cycle, they were begging AG to contest them, but due to the nerfs to AG no one bothered so they gave up. That is the issue that I refer to.

Because you want to end ganking?

Let me go down the Ganker forum way of things:

Anything anyone says about anything in the game, gets this:

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It’s just that everything you propose is designed to nerf, limit, reduce, or prevent ganking.

I saw that video and as a game designer of a Neverwinter Nights 1 multiplayer server Arkhalia I totally agree with what is said in that video. I put a like to that post yesterday if you check it.

However the points made in that video are hardly applying to EVE still being the hardest MMO on the market with tons of adversity, ganking being one of them.

And it is absolutely irrelevant to a multiboxing, that wasn’t even mentioned there in that video.

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The Adversity you talk about in the game in terms of boring is getting enough players together to do the target, which I know from my experience in 0.0 sitting waiting for more numbers, or the pain of maintaining a multi-box fleet. I understand that, still I don’t think excessive multi-boxing is good for the game. Just an opinion…

I don’t think invulnerable freighters are good for the game.

Maybe they should make it so one character can solo gank a freighter?

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Maybe you should ask CCP for a ship type to do this in hisec?