On the one hand, no stabs is great game design that only Jesus could bring us on Easter. On the other hand, mocking the community with a fake change that’s been needed for years, is only something CCP could do on April first. Decisions, decisions…
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No you misunderstand. I think everyone understands that the system needs a rethink, but in the current mechanic wcs allow farmers risk free access to plexing, which ultimately means farmers dictate the WZ not FW entities - for a quick QoL change introducing risk for farming botters & mission runners is a good step…as long as it’s not the last.
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Not currently an FW player,
Played FW from its release for 2 years on the amarr side (that character has been biomassed)
I strongly disagree with this change for a simple reason.
Bandaid solutions like this and specific cases have a way of stacking up.
Personally, I dont think this problem is as serious as people think.
An instalock/high alpha damage ship can still kill these frigates quickly if they are not paying attention. If they are paying attention, they deserve to escape. And when they escape, you already achieved your goal of removing the enemy from the plex.
Unless warp core stabilizers are deemed, as a whole, to not have a place in EVE. In which case you should remove them and any warp core strength bonuses from the game as a whole (including ventures and capitals).
a huge part of EVE’s allure is that it is 1 universe, with rules (or a lack thereof) that applies to the whole universe.
If you are re-evaluating warp core stabilization as a whole (including ventures, and capital ships) you have my full support either way, keep it or ban it.
But “they only don’t work in fw plexes cus farming” does not have my support. It doesn’t make sense from the lore side or from the gameplay side. The module itself has its risk/reward built in, making it very difficult for you to fight any combat-ready ship, but giving you the ability to disengage as well.
And a counter already exists in fitting multiple warp scramblers.
For the record I also disagree with the Monitor ship on similar grounds. “Anti-headshot” ships already exist in the fleet command ship line. And headshotting itself is a worthy strategy that should have its applications and counters (fly a fleet command ship)
Having said that, I am very happy to see evidence that you are taking an interest in FW. I stopped participating in FW, along with many members of my faction, because we felt it was abandoned by CCP. Nice to see that this has changed.
Fly safe
o7
It’s a bit rich to invoke the ‘sandbox’ reason when FW plexes are one of the most egregious sandbox bending mechanics in the game. Literally their primary purpose is to gate ships to create space for similarly-classed opponents to fight each other. It seems perfectly reasonable to tweak those gate parameters to keep out farmers or others not actually looking to fight.
If WCSs are only a problem for FW, then the problem probably is with FW and a specific fix like the proposed one is perfectly reasonable. Maybe there is a more elegant one possible, but probably not one as easy as this one to implement.
having played a long time in factionwarfare I welcome the change, farmers need to get out of FW, They undermine the real player efforts to the warzone. When I go for a roam I should not be forced to choose if I wanna fight stabbed farmers (use dual or triple scramblers) or if I wanna fight regular players (and do a normal fit on the ship).
Another thing that annoy me is that neutral people come into the plexes and if you attack first you lose sec-status. So if you are an active person in Faction warfare and not a pirate you almost always have a low security status just for defending your “own” space. So me and my friends are barred from entering the minmatar republic even if all we have done over the years has been protecting their space. Quite Ironic. I dont have a solution to this but its something I have thought about.
FW missions not attacking their allies that come to help them against the mission runners would be great also. But if they implement it they would need to make a way so people cant farm them being in the same warfare faction as the rats. Heavy penalties for shooting your own rats maybe? Its not a priority I understand, and I will admit, it is hiliarious to get blapped by your own faction while trying to help them.
The whole station blobbing in FW is quite severe. Fighting over space is now even less important. Now its all “E-honor” and Tiers you take the systems for. Since locking people out of a system is not an option anymore.
Hope this is not just an April 1st Joke.
No stabs and no cloak sounds good but then also disallow the Ventures.
If someone refits with stabs and/or cloak inside the complex (anywhere on the same grid) they should instantly explode 
No problem with the change, though I also think as posters above, a good fix should make all activities around FW be active so stabbed or non-stabbed bots are just not an effective solution. Don’t go for the lazy solution again. Same for nullsec botting, which is a much bigger issue.
This can be combined with a tweak to WCS making ships fitting them completely useless in any combat situation. The current penalties are just not strong enough, when you see stabbed FW mission runners.
Cloaks are fine with the 30km decloak Radius inside plexes.
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+200% mass per warp stab, lol. But tbh afk plex runners don’t care about being useless with a stab on as they can still complete the site while completely useless.
Actually, no, in that case you are the loser.
The farmer can just go to a nearby system, wait for you to leave, and keep rolling the plex. Plus you have to rollback his time and then cap the plex if you want to deny him that option, wasting your time and leaving ample of it for the farmer to just do the same thing elsewhere. This is why Timer Rollbacks are the real solution to this problem.
This is clearly a band-aid solution. The real issue is that FW is a risk-averse activity now. What the farmers are doing is the optimal thing to do, never engage and keep rolling plexes.
WCS are the easy scapegoat here, surely banning them will solve the issue?
What will actually happen is that people will just find other ways to not fight, ECM frigates, Agility, Ventures, etc… And CCP will have to ban those as well following their logic, which is a losing proposition.
The only real advantage of this solution of banning WCS is that it tampers with botters. Just for that it has my support. But the effects on FW will be average at best.
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I am the only person who can’t catch any bot just because they warp off too fast? (yes, i’m slowpoke) ok, we remove warpstabs from fw, so what? I get more fights? I get more LP? When I was in militia few years ago - i didn’t fit warp stabs, i just go in quiet system to farm. Good try to get rid of bots. Why you don’t want boost plexing with someone in it? srsly, best option to farm in militia - farm solo. wtf? it is mmo game?
Total agree it’s what we FW soldiers have been asking for years but make sure you can’t either refit or have wcs in your hold to prevent refitting
Except that there are ship-class restricted acceleration gates everywhere in this game. Missions. Exploration sites. Class restrictions on wormholes
Make the change,
Ban the warp core stabs,
Do it now.
Either so they cant pass the gate. or so stabbed ships dont run the timer.
I’m less concerned about cloaks - I’ve not come across that many -but stabs are a FWer nightmare. espoecially when combined with the botting problem.
You seem to know a lot about what I want. All of which is incorrect. I want Low Sec to thrive, all aspects of it. In order for that to happen every side has to accept responsibility and risk/reward conditions that make sense across the entire spectrum. The presence of WCS inside a FW Plex add ZERO to the value of that experience for either side of that coin. Zero. Nada. Please feel free to try and make a pro-WCS argument, it is essentially impossible to do so.
I know. So to claim that restricting a module from FW complexes somehow breaks the sandbox is silly. There are restrictions on what types of ships can enter various places all over game.
my point was that FW plexes are not specially-restricted.
To my knowkedge. No where, in the entire game, restricts your entry based on modules.
I personally think it is ridiculous to say a gate detects warp core stabilizers, so your ship cant enter.
It would make sense if they banned warp core stabs from working on ANY accelaration gate, anywhere, ever… I know some certain saviors of high sec that would be very happy about this affecting mission runners.
But it doesnt make sense to say “people don’t like that warp core stabs let you leave a plex” “lets ban wcs from plexes”
So it breaks your immersion because whatever magical force that locks certain ships out of sites may now apply to modules?
To me it seems that good game design should always take precedent over such lore consideration, but guess others might feel different.
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Well. For as FW is currently structured, this changes not only are they desiderable but necessary.
I want lose my ship, is the risk that i take in LS/FW but i also want the possibility of being able to catch a farmer that not risking anything, just 2/3 M isk, pod included.
Limitation ship is the last of problem, rather they can help.
You have to accept the fact that you have to take a reasonable risk (losing the ship / pod) with the LP you earn.
Farmer/bot (I think a lot of them are bots) don’t bring any content to the game, they only ruin it.
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This has been overdue for too long, finally it gets changed
It is extremely annoying to find targets that just warp away when pointed/scrammed. Hope this gives more good fights in these FW sites even without beeing in FW.
And are there really bots in FW sites? I have never seen people botting in FW systems, but maybe I’m wrong
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Oh there are bots.
Just yesterday, warping through a FW system on my way to the fleet, I spotted about 4 of them in 2 systems. With obvious names. FW1424551 or something like that.
They didnt even respond when I jumped in on top of them in my Griff, but as soon as I locked the warped. Straight to another plex site… I followed one bot for about 15min. Same MO, everytime… if it was an active player he would have warped somewhere to wait me out.
I see them all the time. The fits are always the same… something like a Venture or a Atron with 3 warpcore stabs in the lows. I havent bothered to build a double pointer to catch these bots. But they are an issue.
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