I apologize, if I did take that tone with you, I welcome the discussion, and don’t want to appear snittish. I do roam and solo, but prolly not as much as I particpipate in defense fleets, you are correct. But I do solo roam, and I never use safe log. If I make a decision that puts me into a position that I know i’m going to get caught by a gang I can’t possibly defeat, I choose to try and get away even if I die, rather than deliberately remove my ship from the game world for a period of time, and bypass the consequences of making a dumb decision, or getting outsmarted. if that makes me a bad PVP player, so be it, I just think safe logging, specifically to avoid a loss mail, is cowardly, and wondered if others felt the same.
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Can be argued, undocking an unbeatable fleet for a solo ship is equally cowardly. It’s not like the fleet intends on giving the solo pilot good content, so why should the solo pilot stay on field to give content to the fleet?
There is no one being outsmarted by anyone. One side just decided to undock something unbeatable by the other side.
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no I agree 100%, I hate being blobbed, I don’t agree with 20 people against one, that’s just ensuring a win, however, that is not exploiting a game mechanic. as despicable as it is to pile 20 against one, it’s not taking advantage a console mechanic, to avoid an unfavorable outcome. safe logging is, unfortunately, just that.
I don’t defend blobbing, but you roam into someone’s space the likelihood they are gonna 1v1 you are small, used to be a lot better, but not anymore, people who do roam who don’t understand the concept of sovereignty defense and wind up in a bad situation, sorry bout it, but people shouldn’t have a magic “Get out of jail free” button to escape the consequences of their choices, in a game that is all about your choices and the consequences of them.
Might I add I am really enjoying the debate. lol
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[quote=“Maekchu, post:40, topic:141571, full:true”]
So at this point, it is just a variant of the “afk cloaky” discussion?
not really a variant on the afk cloaky discussion, cause even in a cloaked ship there is chance you can crash gate and cloak up to get away.
Like I said i’m specifically talking about about people who roam into a pocket, get boxed in by a gate camp, know they can’t get by it, and safe log to avoid having to try. they remove the risk of getting caught by manipulating a game mechanic, rather than by any skill of their own, in any other game that’s called exploiting.
we kinda went off track, I apologize to the members of this thread, for getting caught up in one of my posts on someone elses.
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join a corporation
Mate, I understand the frustration. Heres some backstory: I have a wife, 4 kids, and a second shift job. My time is very limited online, and it’s hard to form for a fleet in the 30 minutes I have after I get home. I get the struggle to find fights. And the pain of getting blobbed when you do. For all that I have 300+ solo kills, and love flying as a lone wolf.
Heres some advice:
If people consistently blob or drop on you, set them with a personal standing as a way to remember to not take the fight. I have several corps set that way, and it saves me on the regular.
Fly stuff with a large engagement profile, and low commitment. I like a kitey Tristan or Vigil Fleet Issue in FW space, because I can keep range, engage a wide range of targets, and if his 10 friends show up, burn my mwd to get out of range. Kiting is less than fair, but it’s a good way to avoid getting stuck fighting stuff you dont want to fight.
Fight on your terms. If you dont want to fight it…don’t. Watch dscan, and bail if you have incoming, or if the guy about to punch in is a hard counter to your ship. No shame in running.
Get to know a community. My (usual) Corp has links to several channels of content creators. If you have an hour, hit em up. In the MinMil warzone, Schneckt, Black Rebel Rifter Club (always good for a T1 1v1), Electus Matari, and Wild Geese are always good for content. You’ll learn a lot flying with people occasionally, or just chilling in their discord. Mail me if you’d like an invite to mine. We love to help, and see people go from Victims to Victors!
Semper Pugnandum!
(Always Fight)
Verdis
[Special Operations Brigade Six]
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According to the game mechanics, you don’t really get a kill by gate camping someone into a system. Warp disrupting them and shooting them down is what will get you a kill.
So I honestly, see no exploit here. If the person could safe-log out while being scrammed down, then we can talk about exploits.
If you want to go get kills, then maybe don’t bother with slippery solo players and do something that requires holding a grid, like contesting structures or space.
As someone who has been roaming FW for a long time, I was extremely annoyed whenever the ship in a plex turned out to be a stabbed farmer. Obviously, I should be entitled the kill, cause I was obviously the better player. They were just running, right?! However, with time I’ve come to accept that is just part of eve. I’m not entitled to any kill until I’ve actually gotten the killmail. If chasing ghosts is getting tiring, then there exists other ways to PvP that don’t bother with chasing people who don’t want to fight you.
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fair enough. I would bring counter points, that’s not what this thread is about, would love to continue the conversation in the actual thread if you like, cause it’s a fascinating conversation. but Ella posted this thread for a different subject of conversation, and we’re doing her a disservice by shifting the topic.
And in the most deliciously ironic turn of events, cry threads have shifted from “I’m mad because someone ambushed and killed me” to “I’m mad because I tried to ambush and kill somebody, but they were prepared and they actually fought back.”
This is a flavor of tears I could get used to.
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When ti comes to the topic of PvP in null sec the grouping aspects of it is a little more complex.
In general pvpers should not be limited to the size of their responses. This being said the game should be restructured in a way that makes pvp more consistent, and less of a job. This will improve the over all frequency, balance, and enjoyment of pvp. The changes should look soemthing like this
- Standings gained and lost over time
- This will prevent alliances from just opening standings tab and making someone a “pretend” ally.
- Standings require specific levels for specific actions (war, peace, Docking, etc).
- This will place value on relationships both negative and positive and will help make renting come at a cost (of an ally slot)
- Corporation and alliance tickers removed from overview
- This will prevent work arounds to the standings changes, making people on the battlefield, a color appropriate to their relationship.
- Limit the amount of allies an alliance can have (just as we limit war decs)
- This is probably best done through a hard limit, as opposed to war decs “scale with more” option. Other wise massive nap webs may be still sustainable through such relationships (renting etc).
- Limit fleets to 50.
- This is a logistical change that will place stress on alliances to train and field more fleet commanders, and will help cause more havoc in the pvp battlefield which will further make “out of game” arrangements more difficult (since identifying news by ticker will not exist)
- Rescale the size of corporations and alliances
-Limit corporations to 250, and alliances to 10 corporate members. This will place a significant amount of value on “Who” is in an alliance and create competition for the slots. this will also scale alliances to more manageable numbers, specofically when it comes to coalitions that will still find ways for work arounds.
At least with these changes null pvp will become a huge headache for people who want to try to maintain super massive coalitions. This will result in coalitions naturally scaling down to a more reasonable number, which will result in more coalitions, smaller naps in return result in more conflict, which means more pvp content.
the problem here is that we are not addressing how we can make or balance eve, the problem is that ccp’s primary form of advertisement is done by news and pushing larger sizes. Basically, this is another grab at money and not the overall well fare of the game. any serious development studio would of simply made these changes after investing the hours and lag fests that come from blobbing.
eve is still dying because of the insanity of one idiot who calls himself a designer.
Interesting theory.
What is a “pretend ally” ? And what dictates standings loss/gain from a player corp/alliance?
Ok, so now I just need a ‘docking alt’ to keep my standings with renter corp high, kewl.
Have you done much PvP? My overview generally only contains threats (anything not an ally in null/low)… how is this going to help change anything (cause my docking alt keeps my standings good)?
Again I don’t see how this will effect the change you want. There are already limits on Alliance sizes, and most if not all use out of game communication methods, so artificial limits in game are not going to work.
Heh, there are already fleet size limits (250 i think) and you know how people get around that now, they make more fleets. Having to add additional FCs won’t be the massive inconvenience you think, because again, out of game comms. So you’ll need more in-game pilots with the FC Skill trained, but once the fleets up, everyones on comms listening to the ‘one true FC’ and all is as it was before.
Again, already limits on corp sizes and alliance sizes, and guess what, we get ‘coalitions’ formed because, wait for it… out of game communications.
Yeah, just no.
All the NAPS I’ve been involved with were of the “I won’t shoot your structures if you don’t shoot mine”, because grinding for SOV is a massive PITA and no one wants to do it. So I think the issue is initiating large scale pvp fights (over sov/etc) can be very tedious, so you see the big blue umbrellas we get now.
Regards,
Cypr3ss.
Unpopular and mixed opinion (also out of subject since this thread now is about wardec and stuff).
Most people in this game plays like cowards, are they really? Well yea, some of them for sure, but maybe not everyone.
I play EVE because I love PVP. It’s fun to control range, to make him think your tank is out but you just didn’t ran your rep to make him think so, to split them, make them aggress at gate, jump and kill this single dude that jumped in.
So I don’t care about ISK, I don’t care about loses, I don’t care about corps, blues, alliances, diplomacy, wars, etc…
But these guys, what do they like in EVE? I would say it’s to make ISK. Or to have kills (I’m saying they like to fight, no, they like to look at zk and say “i’m elite”), or to join the last big tidi fight and the next week brag at mom “look, this shitty video game websites did an article on the biggest virtual battle of all times, I was in! I pressed F1 mom!”.
I think the real difference between you (…let’s say us, can I?) and them is we like difficult games and fights, but they don’t, they like easy wins.
We like to take a fight saying “looks like hard to win but let’s see” where they like to take a fight saying “HAHA you r dead xd”.
It’s same IRL, so I see it like IRL: I have chosen the difficult path for fun rewards, now I have to deal with it.
That being said, you should remember something: They are surely worse player than you. So use this knowledge because it’s your situation: Your knowledge VS their blob.
To summarize: If you have chosen the difficult path deal with it and do not fool yourself, they will blob, every single time.
Your job is to have few kills and gtfo laughing at them because they could (they sould) have killed you in a second, but they don’t know how to do so.
Making sure to take a fight at a place and a moment you will be able to finish it or warp off before full fleet lands on your grid is part of PVP, it’s sometimes frustrating, but it’s up to you to make it part of the fun…
(not saying EVE PVP wasn’t funnier 10 years ago, i wasn’t there, yea, lot of stuff could be done to make fights funniers, but it’s not the point here)
EDIT: Also, 1v1 me, I will do my best to gives you a gf 
(but i will keep range and align because I don’t trust you)
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I do not care about you and your PVP skills I just want to play EVE my way not disturbed from PVPers.
P.S. and that gf is stupid habbit …
And here comes another alt from LSG
You’re playing the wrong game if you want to just do your own thing. In this massively multiplayer always-pvp game, there is unsurprisingly always pvp. Or at the very least, the potential for it.
I recently picked up Elite Dangerous, it may be much more your speed. Mindless grinding, in a solo environment where you don’t need to worry about other players stealing your thunder.
I paid with my money and I wanted to do just my own thing, simple as that.
In one thing you are right, game is wrong, I mean broken and must be repaired.
Tell me, if you buy yourself a car and decide to drive it across a lake, will it work? No, you should have bought a boat. Or, if you need to drive some screws into a wall, do you buy a drill or a hammer?
Don’t pay money for a product that won’t do what you want it to do. Eve was always described as a pvp game. You’ve not been mislead, you simply chose to ignore what was right in front of you.
So find an offline game OR learn how to play EVE.
The day where carebears will learn you can play EVE almost 100% safely is far, far away. Maybe it’s because you have to undock and take a few fights to learn that…
Today I was doing a 3/10 in lowsec on the wrong side of Hagilur. There was a guy who appeared in local and started probing. I was doing the site and I checked his KB and realized he kinda smelled like Cyno Fluid so I realized I might have a real problem here. I got a fair drop about 65m ISK but what good is that if he’s just gonna use his cheese fit alt with a Proteus and capture me on a gate?
I zigged when he zagged on a gate and he jumped through with his faster-than-me Proteus. I went back to station and convoed him and he said he was just checking his moons and probing but I told him he didn’t need to be coy. I didn’t appreciate his lies and he still played dumb so I told him I was gonna go afk for a week and he just said ‘ok’ and left chat.
I swapped to a probe launcher and probed out a different road than the only possible one I could have taken and Bob willed it, a direct to another lowsec wormhole to Costolle. It doubled my journey to Hek but I didn’t have to try to outrun that cheese-fit tackle Proteus.
Not a single shot was fired but that was thrilling PVP to me and why I play.
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