Remove/reduce Bastion Weapon Timer

With the increased warp speed given to many ships over the last year, the gameplay problem of creating a weapon timer for any activation of a Bastion module becomes a larger issue. Marauders are caught “hanging” at gates, unable to dock at NPC stations, and unable to tether or dock at PC stations. This results in an unbalanced penalty for a non offensive module. I have had to burn safe spots just to “time” my arrival at a safe harbor with the end of the weapon timer.

No other siege module has this penalty.

Bastion does not effect any other ship’s capabilities or stats like a web, dampner, TP.

It is not AOE like a Command Burst.

It does not cause any damage to any opponets, unlike any weapon system does.

It does enhance the ship that activated the Bastion module, but along the same vein as an active shield or armor hardner does, neither which currently activates a weapon timer. Of all the other modules whose use causes a weapon timer to activate, only the Bastion doesn’t adversely effect an opposing ship or boost an allied ship. The current gameplay should be modified to remove or reduce the current illogical mechanics and offer the Marauders a more even playing field.

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I will agree, but freely admit it does better for my Vargur :wink:

You would probably have to change the code to prevent docking/tethering/gating during bastion. I believe it is coded to rely on the weapons timer to prevent those things atm.

Curious, can a bastioned Marauder be booshed by a Command destroyer?

The reason why they gave bastion a weapons timer is to prevent people from playing silly station games, where they tank the world while in bastion to wait out their weapons timer to then instadock the second it runs out (or when bastion is deactivated). So yeah,sorry to burst your bubble, but it ain’t going to happen

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Welcome back @Arden_Elenduil.

Long time bud.

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You did note the option mentioned “reduced”?
Even a reduction to 30-40 seconds would remove the problems generated by increased warp speed, while still allowing for plenty of vulnability at stations. Probably will get a “reduce warp speed” reply.:wink:

Let me get this straight. You want to take the strongest tank available for any subcap in the game and buff it?

Cue the obligatory “You did not think this through” video…

On a ship that hardly anybody uses for PvP? A subcap ship that costs as much as a capital ship? You are referring to the tank you can only use when you self-tackle yourself?

The request to buff the ship class is not entirely ridiculous.

I’m referring to the tank that had a weapons timer added to it specifically to keep pilots from playing silly station games.

If you want to solo tank a 100-member kitchen sink gang in a subcap, you probably should have to commit yourself to the field in order to do it.

For clarification and education, what “silly station games” are you suggesting would occur by Bastion alone? Everything I can think of that would adversely effect an enemy ship is covered by the normal weapon,suspect, or criminal timer.

It’s about risk mitigation. The weapons timer exists in the first place in order to prevent players from aggressing other players and then immediately ducking into safety, be it a station or a stargate. I think everyone can agree that this makes sense; if you’re intent on hostile action, you should have to commit to the field.

Conversely, if you are simply tanking and not being shot at, you can dock and jump at any time. So at first glance, it’s easy to come to the same conclusion that you have, that Bastion is purely defensive and shouldn’t incur a weapons timer.

The problem is that this conclusion fails to understand the notion that it is possible to weaponize tanking, at least in Hisec. Let me explain how.

  1. Undock in Hisec, preferably a crowded trade hub, in a big, tanky ship while being flagged suspect.
  2. If you wait long enough, someone will likely shoot at you. You now have an Limited Engagement Timer so you can freely shoot at them without CONCORD intervening. As an added bonus, they also have a Weapons Timer so they cannot immediately dock.
  3. You dock up and re-ship into a hard counter for the pilots(s) who shot you and proceed to ZOMGWTFBBQ their behinds.

Ideally, this all plays out just as your suspect flag ends so that when you re-ship the only people who can shoot at you are the ones with an LE timer.

Having access to a Bastion-level tank would let you do this at an absolutely bonkers level because you could tank local indefinitely, even if you can’t leave. But CCP didn’t want players being able to go from near-invulnerable tanking (Bastion mode) to 100% safety (docking) without some amount of vulnerability in between. Risk vs reward and all that.

If you’ve mostly played in null or WH space, you’ve likely never encountered this and it almost certainly has no impact on how you play the game. This relies entirely on the flags and timers associated with Empire space, particularly Hisec.

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Thanks for the detailed reply. It gave me a new perspective on the mechanics. Never underestimate a player’s creative thinking, I guess. I still think the penalty for the use of its primary advantage (bastion) of being immobile for 60 seconds followed by a weapons timer which restricts movement again for 60 seconds is too much. Perhaps a reduction of 25 % of the timer or allowing movement while bastioned would be a class perk, but I question CCP’s ability to be creative and skilled to re-examined the class and tweak like it has done for almost every other class of ship.

…or, knowing what they did to certain ships (looking at you Proteus), perhaps I should just let sleeping dogs lie on the issue.

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No problem. While the weapons timer for a defensive module does seem counter-intuitive at first, I do stand by my initial point: Bastioned Marauders are already, by far, the strongest-tanking subcaps in the game. They don’t need any kind of buff to their tank.

If you want to do away with the weapons timer, you’d need to compensate somehow with another penalty, either making the Bastion Module cycle considerably longer or adding a fuel cost.