Sanmatar pisses on the Ray's grave, again

That’s really the only way to describe offering blanket amnesties and pardons to the terrorists that targeted her government, herself, and injured and killed thousands of innocent Matari.

Not that tarnishing and destroying everything she stood for, right after some pretentious praise is anything new or unexpected from Shakor.

■■■■ you, Shakor. ■■■■ you.
Oh, and the Council too. ■■■■■■■ useless toadies.

For some reason, our current government loves to be in cahoots with numerous mercenary groups that are basicly terrorists for hire, Seykal and Krullefor as most prominent recent examples. I can only imagine Sanmatar is looking to hire some new talent from Bloody Hands and Defiants for some more good old domestic terrorism.

Honestly? If this is the price to pay for a Tribal Republic? The price is too much. We’re being dragged to the level of the Empire, or even lower.
And it pains me to watch my own Tribe just let it happen.

Are you really that surprised? Even the little Liberation day reel they released features ships with Bloody Hands livery flying alongside the main fleet. That the Minmatars’ terrorist government is dropping the pretense of being lawful and openly receiving the more overt Matari terrorist cells with open arms should be expected at this point.

Surprised? Not at all. Just disappointed.

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If the Ray had her will, the capsuleer who freed me would have been named a terrorist or outlaw, and I would be dead or still a slave. It is about time the men and women who had the will and strength to do the things that had to be done were acknowledged as such. There is little room for fetishizin’ naivete and Ray worship in a universe where peace simply means slow surrender.


Like killing people who had nothing to do with politics? Not that killing politicians is any better, tempting as it may be.

You know better than to think this is actually about the Defiants and Bloody Hand though, Miz. This is about indemnifying the murders and conspirators who carried out thousands of murderers of Minmatar in order to secure Shakor’s hold during the waning days of the Midular administration.


If it had to be done. Occasionally the path of lesser evil is one that many don’t have the stomach for, leading to inaction which leads to greater evils. I will never pretend the actions taken weren’t grim, but nor will I pretend they weren’t necessary.

As for you, Red… I’m sure it is precisely that, and the exact same answer applies. When the rot is that deeply embedded, you can’t remove it with wishes and ideals. It must be carved out so it doesn’t kill what it infests.


Or so you can install your own rot. If all of that ‘evidence’ planted after the murders was real, then they should have been able to just go public with it beforehand. Expose the corruption and force the hand of those actually empowered to execute justice.

Instead, they went about it in a way that screams of deception and manipulation, and poisons any good that might have been hoped for. Those actions weren’t ‘necessary’, they were calculated. They were a scheme, a con, and those responsible, including Shakor, should face justice for their crimes.


You seem to be under the impression a system that is rotten to the core can execute “justice”. This is naivete I’d never expect from you. Do you think slamming footage and dog-tags of Imperial slaver fleets in our systems on the table would lead to “justice” from the Empire? Of course not. Think a corrupt justice will open the door to be prosecuted themselves? Of course not.

Law is nothing more than words, which can only be enforced by consent or force. These would not consent, and they owned the force. Worse yet, trials of such extent would take a decade at the very least to investigate, process and prosecute. Do you really think the Tribes had that kind of time? That it could survive a decade of rot and internal sabotage?

Those in power always have been and always will be immune to the law, unless their peers unite against them. This would be an absolutely nonsensical scenario to expect with rot set in that deep, and the only solution is what was used. A night of long daggers. Trying to take it through the rotten system would be much akin to if our people chose never to rebel, trusting in “the system” to free us on its own.

I’ll carry a knife instead, and use it when it is necessary.


I think justice from the Empire has nothing to do with murdering other Minmatar and leaving fabricated ‘evidence’ behind.

I think if the evidence is compelling enough, public outcry will force the hands of those above the corrupt officials. And if there isn’t anyone above them… then you’re not ‘carving out’ the rot with anything less than shooting the Tribal Chiefs in the head.

Funnily enough, that did happen to one of them. The one who wasn’t pushing for war, and who—a comfortable decade later—the leader of her killers is using as a fig leaf to hide behind, feigning respect and citing her goals to explain his own lack of any desire to deliver on what he promised. The same one vilified by the Shakorites and U’K. 1 ISK for Midular, right?

Funny, though, how ‘carving out the rot’ didn’t actually change any of the policies toward the Amarr. It didn’t do… anything, really, except to cement the power of the anti-Sebiestor coalition under Shakor, while fooling people into thinking the victims were some great existential threat.

It’s almost like that’s all it was ever intended to do.

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I think y’all miss the Sanmatar’s point in trying to be reconciliatory.

Nice try tho, I give him that.

No, I just don’t believe him.

I’m sure you can back up this claim.

Naivete in the extreme. What force do you think anyone at the top can wield when the system beneath is rotten? Next to none. The absolute best case scenario is the formation of some investigative committee that’s stonewalled for a decade or more, and that is something the Tribes can not afford.

It’s almost as if the ‘dictator’ obeys the people, the Tribes and the Council. His many failures so far seems to have utterly fallen short of forcing his way upon the Tribes.

I will never believe a politician. There isn’t one in New Eden that isn’t a liar and beholden to their peers to even get into power in the first place. Shakor has most certainly failed too, but the simple fact remains: There is no other way to get rid of corruption that deeply seated. It can only be carved out, or you can let the system die trying to heal itself.

Edit: Else is right though, I’ll leave it here. Have the last word, it won’t change the facts that relying on any system or law is a fool’s errand at the best of times. We don’t live in those.

The very fact that none of the evidence was ever made available for independent corroboration and verification does that.

Well gosh, I hope we could, cuz that’s basically what happened. Nothing’s been done for a decade. Nothing. Instead, we’ve sat around playing patty-cake in the pendulum, dancing to the tune even Gaven’s willing to openly say is all about bleeding us out. So I guess the Shakorites deserve praise for doing the Empire’s work?

So, lemme track this…

Those at the top aren’t answerable to the law or public opinion.
Nobody at the top can wield power if the system below them is rotten.
Shakor’s lack of making any meaningful changes to the cosmopolitical situation is a result of… him being answerable to public opinion.

Open your eyes. He never intended to make any changes beyond ‘me and my guys are the ones in power’. That was it. It was never about the Tribes, or ‘carving out rot’, it was only ever about himself and his co-conspirators.

Abandoning the law in favor of violent extremists who answer to no-one but themselves is just an excuse for being able to screw over the people around you in search of self-gratification. Dress it up in whatever pretty justifications you want, that’s all it is.

I dread to think of the state we’d all be in now were it not for such groups and individuals like Muritor.

Shakor’s only fault here is being too slow to reach out.

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Missed it? Nah, but lip service like this kind of a backhanded compliment.
“Oh, the Ray, light of our life, whom I never really hated by the way, we miss you so, have a statue in your memory.
BTW we’ll be pardoning everyone who wanted you dead.”

international peace balance of power has not been this precarious since the Elder Fleet. Domestically, the government agencies have started to back off from the most blatant abuses of power - RSS turning rioters to their own jurisdictions, officials overstepping theirs getting sudden promotions to Skarkon. There’s more to “political and criminal terrorists” pardoned than just Bloody Hands and Defiants.

It is what it is and the Enemy does not rest.

No one likes a civil war, and despite it being less bloody than it could have been, we more or less had one. But maybe it’s time we all move on.

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I’ll remember this when someone in my family will be brought down on invented charges, never to be seen again. Though mark my words, if that happens, I will be tearing one planet a new asshole with my bare hands.


Defeatism breeds defeat.