you misread… i give them ISK PLUS 10%. Say Angels extrav gives 40 mil in estimated loot… i add 10% to that They give me all the salvage, and i give them isk plus 10%.
The venture is a great little ship. I have used it plenty. I recommend it as a ship to take into low/null to make some quick ninja isk and have some excitement.
3 Likes
One thing you are completely leaving out however OP, is the fact that any new player, will go through the NPE, and will then be herded to the career agents which at the end of the military agent they’ll get a destroyer, basically making your guide useless.
This is not a matter of opinion, this is a matter of objective facts. A good guide enumerates alternatives and weighs their pros and cons. You are literally only writing about the least profitable and enjoyable of all the possible options.
Not true. Even if you only ever got the “crappy” missions, you’d still make more per hour doing L1s than hisec Venture mining. I’m amazed you’re challenging the CEO of a mission running corp whose organization has been in operation for over 10 years on this point.
Let’s keep things in context:
- My critique was on Hisec Venture mining
- Those fits I mentioned? A fit that costs less than 1 million would score more than a T2 fitted Venture mining in Hisec. My organization doesn’t bother giving them to newbies because they can afford them themselves with money netted from the NPE and career agents
- Newbies that complete the NPE and Career Agents have hulls and ISK that they don’t need to be stuck with Rookie Ships. Rookie ships are used for like what? 15 minutes before you get something better?
- Hypothetically, let’s say you burned through that and have to start from scratch so you have no ISK and no assets. Yet again, the objective is to move away from Rookie Ships are quickly as possible. Technically Venture mining is an upgrade, but of all the alternatives in existence it’s literally the worst one (if you’re planning on using it for Hisec mining). So do something for as short a period as possible (rat/mine with your rookie ship or do Project Discovery, which is the best option objectively speaking in terms of revenue) until you have enough for a cheap fit (<1m) that will end up netting more in L1s than a Venture can mining in hisec.
Your guide is about getting started, right? Instead of glorifying Rookie Ships, the focus should be on moving away from them ASAP. Interestingly enough, Rookie Ships have uses in the end game, but since the purpose of the guide is on helping newbies, and that means letting go.
That only means that YOU don’t know how to do it properly. Yet again I repeat: low skills + <1m good-composed fit + proper flying = more money than a T2 fitted Venture mining in hisec. Obviously a destroyer is better, but the reason I’m talking about frigates is to emphasize the point that you take a ship whose investment is on par with the Venture and you end up making more ISK and having more fun with it. Even if this were not true wth a frigate, you literally need to invest only one or two million more to get a destroyer fit, and that is true by a wide margin there.
This is not advisable…
What you’ve said in this paragraph demonstrates a great deal of ignorance when it comes to how to best complete missions. Extremely suboptimal. Very low throughput. Very little ROI with the time you’re spending.
Wrooooooooooong. YOU do not know how to complete missions quickly, so YOUR returns on investment are poor, but that doesn’t mean the potential isn’t there. YOU are ignorant, and that ignorance is keeping YOU from achieving the true earnings potential of missions. Now you are writing a guide that is perpetuating ignorance based on your “experience”.
On the forums you have the opportunity to learn from those who know more than you, and who have better experiences than you do because they apply the knowledge that they have that you do not. If would be willing to consider the possibility that you are wrong, you might learn something.
Opinions vary, but numbers do not lie. My 5m SP Alpha character can make more than my Omega char which has max mining skills using a T2-fitted Venture hitting up the better valued Hisec ores. This is a quantifiable reality. The reason it is MY reality and not YOUR reality is because, when it comes to mission running, I am competent and you are not.
Believe it or not, none of the above was intended as an insult, including statements of ignorance and competence. Clearly there are ISK numbers that separate you and I, with the ISK being in my favor, and that validates these claims. Once again I implore you to consider the possibility that you are wrong and that you could learn something. Pride and stubbornness will not serve you here, nor would it benefit readers who might have received a more accurate and comprehensive education if you had enough humility to change your guide with what you have the opportunity to learn.
1 Like
This guy must be trolling with this dumbazz guide. Just go play the game…join a group like HORDE or some other new bro friendly outfit and ejoy the game and all that it has to offer.
2 Likes
I have two civilian autocannons thanks to the OP. I am unstoppable.
7 Likes
The only useful information here is How to find help.
Instead all this… onanism with rookie ships just spend a couple of hours doing career agents (the game will lead you to them) and end up with a couple of millions in cash, two Ventures, two industrials, a destroyer and a couple of frigates.
2 Likes
There are two arguments here -
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About my original post. This was advice to new players and those starting over.
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about mining and mission running - that came after that. This is an argument between you and I.
I remind you AGAIN that the title of my post - I wouldn’t call it a Guide - is Starting Out - Starting Over.
This is about a couple of days play during which - doing what I mentioned - someone starting with nothing but a Rookie ship - and not knowing how to do ANYTHING can make some quick money.
All the things you have talked about - are beyond that time frame OR done with the guidance of someone like yourself. To do what I suggested - they don’t need any more guidance. They can do that on their own. Doing what I said - ANYONE - can go from a Rookie ship to a Venture in a hour or less - and they are out of the Rookie ship. At that point they can make a million isk every 10 or 20 minutes or so. With no more skills and no more money and no more experience.
What that does - is get them in a position where they can buy the skill books they need once they start taking the Career Agent Missions and anything else they want. Those missions don’t pay squat and they are time consuming, running little errands for the Agent so you can learn about an aspect of EVE - but - not making any money at it. Thus - making some Starter Money before they start learning how to play the game with the Career Agent Missions. That is what I said this was about.
And - if you’ll notice - I mentioned that you could to this before, during or after you ran the Career Agent missions. So - if you run a little short on cash - you can just go mine some rocks for a bit and refill your coffers.
THEN I said that they had to make a decision as to whether or not they wanted to go into mining or do something else.
For a brand new player - there is NOTHING more simple than mining. You don’t have to have any skills - you don’t have to know how to do anything. You don’t have to know how to run missions. You can just go mine some rocks and make some money. AS I SAID there is nothing easier to do in this game than warp to an asteroid belt and mine some rocks. THAT counts for a lot with a Rookie player brand knew to the game - and - without guidance.
The only thing they really needed to know - was how to find the best price for their ore - and I told them how to do that.
That is all the original post was about. That was my advice to new players.
After that …
You are arguing your experience - and I am arguing mine.
I’ve been hearing things like what you’ve said before - and they weren’t true then and they aren’t true now.
Once again - you say that you are doing it better - but that means - nothing.
If you think you run missions better than me - well … maybe you do - why don’t you write or include a link to something telling new players how to run missions. I did not start this post to advise people on how to run missions.
Now - as to low level missions vs. mining - one flaw in your argument - is - how much money YOU are able to make in a certain period of time vs how much money could a new player make in that amount of time doing what I’ve mentioned - as an option - as opposed to what YOU would suggest they do?
I am not in a competition with you - for ISK making. But - I am talking about what a new player could do. IF you take them by the hand and SHOW them how to do things your way - then great. They will undoubtedly benefit from your experience. But I’m not going to be there to take these guys by the hand and show them anything.
Can you run missions better than me? Maybe you can - I’m not a Mission Runner. Can a new player with no one to guide them run missions better than me? If they can - they don’t need my advice. Maybe YOU should provide them links to how to run missions - and maybe I would read them. What I posted was what I do - if you have a better idea - then instead of just Bragging about how much better you are at Running Missions than I am - you could show us how you do it.
Since you couldn’t be bothered to say I can guess …
Are you one of those guys who say - “Don’t loot your level 1 wrecks. Just GET TO THE NEXT MISSION!!!”?
or
Are you one of those guys who tell new players to loot their wrecks - but dont’ salvage them?
Which all comes down to “I know the best way to play so if you aren’t playing the way I play your are doing it WRONG!!!”
These guys pretty much think that what you want to do - is get to where you are running Level IV Missions as fast as you can - and nothing else matters.
I’ve seen those schools of thought. Now - if they are giving their Rookie Corp members money, ships and skills - so that they don’t need to make any money of their loot or salvage - that’s one thing - but if they don’t have that kind of a benefactor - looting and salvaging can come in handy.
The Destroyer thing actually had nothing to do with new players - the original post was about starting out. I mentioned that I could get that character in a destroyer pretty fast as a way of pointing out that I could actually start running Level 1 missions without ever bothering with the Career Agent Missions. I mean - I know how to play the game - I don’t need to run those Career Agent missions again.
What’s important for a new player about running the Career Agent missions - is that they teach you how to play the game. If you don’t need to spend the time running those missions - but use it mining ore - you can make more money and buy more ships than they give you. So - the reason for those missions - is learning about the game - not getting free ships.
Again - One of the biggest problems for new players - is lack of money. What I outlined was a way they can quickly get to where they can make a million isk per run in a Venture. If you have a method they can used to make money faster - then post a link to it so everyone can benefit from your wisdom.
The other thing about that is - guys like you - who have high skill point characters - tend to forget what it’s like to not have any skill points. So - we have three situations here:
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The amount of ISK YOU could make Running Level 1 missions vs. Mining in a venture.
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The Amount of ISK I could make Running Level 1 Missions vs. mining in a venture.
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The Amount of ISK a Rookie could make Running Level 1 Missions vs. mining in a venture.
You are talking about #1 above - I’m talking about #2 & #3.
My experience playing this game - is that mining - on average - is more profitable than running Level 1 and 2 missions for the average - and new - player (without guidance).
Now one question you need to ask yourself is - on this issue - are YOU able to make so much more ISK because you are such a good player - and - is the average person playing the game going to be able to duplicate that?
Now - I actually do not believe your claims. I’ve had these arguments before - with people who were just as certain as you are - and they were wrong. They weren’t lying - they just did like most people and saw what they wanted to see.
But - in any case - what you are able to do and what I am able to do - doesn’t matter. What matters is what the average player is able to do - and for the average player - mining is more profitable than running level 1 and 2 missions. And - that - is a fact.
Of course - here - we are talking about - the Average Miner - vs. the average Mission Runner.
Oh … and lastly - I was NOT “glorifying Rookie Ships” The problem with people like you - and you really should think about this - is that you don’t really read what people write. You skim through it - and come up with what YOU think they were writing about - when they weren’t.
My little talk about “Things you can do with Rookie Ships” was just providing some information on how they worked. Yes - OF COURSE - you want to get out of the Rookie ship as fast as you can - which IS the way I suggested getting into a Venture.
AS I SAID - my main point about the Rookie Ships - was showing new players how they could get two guns or two miners just by repackaging and then re-assembling them. This is only valuable in the first few minutes to hours of the game as after that - you’ve got better stuff. But - as brand new players - it IS something they can do that doubles their effectiveness for whatever time they are in a Rookie ship. Yes - I know that the New Player Experience gives them some better guns - but what if they get that ship blown up? New players get their ships blown up all the time.
Now one more thing - you said that they were only going to be in a Rookie Ship for fifteen minutes … This would indicate that you have forgotten what it was like to be a new player who had absolutely no idea what they were doing and was having trouble understanding what the Tutorial was trying to teach them. These people can spend hours on one little thing - because they simply don’t understand what they are being told.
Again - here you are - acting like other people can do anything you can do.
I have on occasion dealt with new players who were completely lost. So - I do not assume how long they are going to be in a Rookie Ship. I don’t know how long they’ll be in a Rookie ships - especially if they get whatever they have blown up. It used to be that the Starter Systems were fairly safe - but now - they’ve got these little burrows of rats in them - that if some Rookie blunders his way into - he can easily get blown up.
You are typical of the advanced players I’ve seen in this game who think that everyone should play the way they play - and are “ignorant” or stupid if they don’t.
Lastly here - I’m a Miner because I find Mission Running to be mind numbing boredom. It’s not as bad as it was in 2007 - when some agents gave out the same four missions over and over but I’m really sick at this point of running the missions in this game.
People who are Mission Runners - have some literally brainless NPC telling them what to do.
I was going to give you kudos for demonstrating humility in your post and keeping things in context. Your response was starting to earn my respect and I was about ready to shake your hands… until you challenged the numerical evidence. Apples-to-apples comparison on skill levels and ship fit quality, L1 mission running in a frigate (let alone a destroyer, which is day-one accessible) makes more than Hisec Venture mining: the numbers don’t lie. There is no disputing numerical results. To do so is illogical. If you’re a smart person (which I believe you are), then making the conscious decision to refute in-context numeric results is outright stupid.
I regularly roll a new character precisely to refresh my memory on what the new starting out experience so that my memory is grounded in reality. I’m not dissociated from the facts. I can easily punch in pyfa a Venture for a newbie a few days old with a character sheet of appropriate skill levels and fit (ie. not level 5) and see their m3/s and then apply that to the ores in hisec and get an approximation of the money I’d be making +/- a margin of error after a bit of math (ie. converting m3 into units of various ores and converting that into market rates). Then I compare that with my own experience regularly rolling new characters and hitting up missions with a 1-3 days worth of skill levels and the numbers add up in my favor. In THEIR favor if they elect to have fun making more money running L1s than be bored to death making less money Hisec Venture mining and then ragequitting when CODE ganks their ships.
Furthermore, in the past year alone we’ve literally had maybe 20 or so members join us on their first day of playing EVE (even more if you expand the window to their first week), and we set them on their way. Guess what? We do NOT give them ISK or ships - instead of spoonfeeding them, we guide them with GOOD and PROPER advice so that instead of boring low-income Venture mining they can have fun and make higher income while actually playing the damn game. And because we would never, ever be so cruel as to recommend hisec Venture mining to anyone, not even our worst enemies, if for some reason they burned through their ISK/ships from the tutorials I just tell them to rerun the tutorials (if it is apparent they could refresh themselves on EVE mechanics because they didn’t quite get it the first time) or to do a few minutes of Project Discovery (which makes orders of magnitude more income than either L1 mission running or Venture mining) so they can afford a fully fitted frigate that will score them more income than a Venture in hisec with the same amount of skill levels (apples-to-apples comparison on skill levels allocated to combat vs mining and respective ship fittings quality). And to be clear, I’m not talking about being paid by us; I’m talking strictly about what they earn from the missions alone.
You are obviously a smart guy (this is not a “backhanded compliment”) so I don’t know why you’re challenging numeric results. Bounties + Mission Reward ISK + LP + Loot > Ore value from Hisec Venture mining. If you have not encountered this, it isn’t beyond the reach of a newbie low-skilled low-fitted newbie. The only thing keeping apples-to-apples L1 mission running from outperforming Venture mining is knowledge… isn’t the purpose of a guide to share knowledge that empowers one to do better? That’s what I meant when I mentioned earlier discussing alternatives. How a day-one Alpha could score tens if not a hundred million on their first day playing with an exploration frig. Or how you can earn 45m + numerous rewards per hour doing Project Discovery. All this is readily accessible to day-one players, and the only thing they need to access it is knowledge. A getting started guide doesn’t have to go into all the details, but it should at least mention the existence of these things and ideally direct them to other resources that go into them in detail (eg. EVE Uni articles).
Bad advice can be more harmful than no advice.
(And yes, I have read all your posts in detail - I am responding to the points I feel undermine everything else)
Then still it is the worst suggestion ever.
A new player with absolute no ISK is more helped by doing the tutorial, career agents and SoE epic ark as it will:
Give them raw ISK
Free ships and some simple modules
A nice look at what eve has to offer
Instead of mind numbing mining and rookie ship stuff.
2 Likes
OK. Two things here.
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First, what a rookie with no experience, no skill points and no guidance can make per hour their first day playing EvE. My contention is that doing what I said - they can make 4 million ISK per hour once they get out of the Rookie ship and into the Venture.
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Mining vs. Mission Running for the average player.
I) It is my experience that in less than an hour I can get a brand new pilot into a Venture and have them making a million ISK every 15 minutes or so. Now … I haven’t actually timed that - but I could. Are you saying that a New Player - with NO experience - No Skills and NO GUIDANCE can do that any other way that they are going to know how to do?
A problem here for you and I in trying to demonstrate something like that - is that you and I are both Veteran players. I, for example, know that by simply repackaging my Rookie Ship - I can get two miners - where as the average New Player who has created their character and done nothing more what so ever - is not going to know that. Which is why I mentioned it. Yes - that is only going to make a difference for a few minutes until they can get something better - but - those few minutes are some of the hardest in the game - as they know NOTHING.
Don’t talk about Project Discovery - or - how you guide new players - or exploration - or what YOU do for new players - because in the time frame I am talking about in my original post - the average New Player isn’t going to know ANY of that.
YOU and your group do NOT train the average EvE player - nor does anyone else. The average new player - doesn’t know anything about Player Corporations - much less how to join one. So - anything and everything you have argued about that references ANY of these things - is irrelevant. It only matters to those few players that you have taken under your wing - and yes - knowledge is the most important thing you give them. But - AGAIN - we are not talking about THOSE people. THOSE people are being taken care of by their benefactors - but everyone else - isn’t.
- Mining vs. Mission Running for the average player.
Now - here - we have two different arguments.
Argument A) is about people who WANT to be Miners, in the time frame from getting a Venture to getting a Mining Barge. Can people with that level of skills and experience make more in their Venture than someone who wants to be a Mission Runner - running missions in their Rookie Ships, first Frigates and Destroyers? I don’t believe so. That has not been my experience. AGAIN this argument is about an average player - who does not have the knowledge you have or access to that knowledge - because the average player - doesn’t. So AGAIN don’t mention Project Discovery and all the other things they are NOT going to know anything about. Those are for people under the guidance of such as yourself - NOT - everyone else.
Argument B) is about people - the average Miner - who have moved on to Mining Barges as soon as they could as opposed to the Average Mission Runner moving on to the missions he can run. We are not just talking about someone who is staying in a Venture. Just as the Rookie Ship was a stepping stone to a Venture - the Venture is a Stepping Stone to a Mining Barge for a player who wants to be a Miner.
If you look at the path a new player takes who WITHOUT GUIDANCE (because - again - most of these people do not have guidance) is Running Missions - they are NOT making the money that someone who has worked their way in to a Mining Barge is. So - for the average new player as they work their way up in their Mining or Mission Running Careers - the Miner is going to have the edge initially.
Now - this is NOT just me saying this. This was the consensus of opinion back when I was playing a lot (which was 8 years ago). That consensus was that it was during their access to Level III Missions that the Average Mission Runner drew equal to the Average Miner in making money. This was something back then - that everyone knew - except the people who were mining haters and just would not hear a positive word said about mining. Once you got into Level IV missions - then - Mission Runners were seen to be making more ISK/hr without dispute.
So - you have YOUR experience and I have mine. I do not believe your numbers. To YOU - they may seem valid but to me - they are not. I have lost count of the number of arguments I have had with people like you who were adamant that they had indisputable PROOF(!!!) of the validity of their numbers - and were wrong. So - instead of you sitting there in certain assurance that your numbers are right … you might just consider that they may not be.
Again though - these are YOUR numbers for YOU. I am talking about the Average Players I have known in the past.
Now - one factor in this - is that some people are just better players than others. This isn’t JUST a matter of Knowledge of the Game. Knowing HOW to do something is only half the battle - actually being able to do it - is the other half.
It is common place - for people who are more knowledgeable - to be out done by people who know less - but are better able to DO what they know how to do - than the more knowledgeable person. As a simple example - think of the difference between a Sports Nerd and someone who is actually a Sports Player. The nerd may know more but the player is actually better at playing.
That can be a factor when it comes to who makes more ISK than who. At one time - I was a fairly knowledgeable person about certain aspects of this game (though abysmally ignorant of others) but I’ve never been that good a player. One of the reasons for that - is that I’m slow. When I was active between 2007 and 2012 - I was slow. Now - I’m also 8 years older - and that is for someone who looked up at the night sky when he was 8 years old - and saw Sputnik pass over head. So - in the Sports Nerd vs. Sport Player - I’m very much in the Sports Nerd category.
Now - there is one more factor to the question of which can make more in the Mining vs. Mission Rumming comparison. A real factor in how much ISK Miners make - that may not be obvious, is the fact that EvE has been DESIGNED to be played using multiple accounts at the same time.
So - you can have a vast difference between the ISK a single PERSON can make playing EvE and how much ISK a single Character can generate.
One thing about Mining - is that it very much lends itself to Multi-Boxing. Of course - this is only for Omega accounts. But - back when I was really active - as I said before - I could run Mining Ops using at least half a dozen characters. There is a logistical penalty you pay getting all that set up - but once you do and all those mining lasers are going - you can really generate a lot of ore. You also have to be careful about how you do this - as if you get attacked - it can lead to being a real disaster really quick. But - as I used to point out - Mining IS a PVP activity - some people just may not realize that. Here - the PVP on the part of the Miner is - not getting caught. But - that is one of the Risk/Reward things people playing EvE have to deal with.
Other activities do not lend themselves as well to Multi-Boxing. You can do it running missions and I have - but - not with more than 2 or 3 characters. It’s just to much stuff to keep track of when something is actively trying to kill you. If you don’t pay attention to how all your ships are doing and don’t realize one of your ships has become the Primary Target - you can lose it before you realize what is going on.
Now here - it really helps to have multiple monitors. I’ve had computer configurations where I’ve had … eh … about 4 computers … depending (cause some of them were much older than others) on how useful they might be. So that - I had computers I could multi-box with if I was MINING - but that I would NOT use if I was running a mission. I also had some computers that had two monitors. Here - I could run an Instance of EvE in a window on one monitor and maybe a full screen version on another. I can’t remember but I don’t think I could run two full screen versions on one computer. I could of course run two windowed versions but the windows were slower.
For PVP - I would not try multi-boxing. That’s just asking to get more than one ship blown up. Maybe someone who’s a better player than I am could do that - but I wouldn’t try it.
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Yet again you challenge numeric truths and accuse of 5 of being less than 3. If you knew how to run missions properly, you could teach newbies how to get that 5 on their first day playing running missions instead of a 3 from Venture mining.
Players are born ignorant. They read guides to learn better. The purpose of the guide is to teach players to be better. This guide rehashes and reinforces their ignorance. Instead of teaching them better, it is written like a nostalgic experience of ignorance when you first started playing. When I first read this, I honestly thought this was a “hey, do you remember when you first started off and this is what it was like?” - then I realized you were trying to help newbies, and how much harm your advice is inflicting on them. I’m a learning specialist in real life - I find this advice to be harmful rather than helpful, and to me it is patently offensive.
You want to help players? Delete this “guide”.
As I said - this isn’t a guide - it’s just a post with some information.
What you are advocating is much more complex that what I am. And thus - more difficult for a new player to understand. This is something that you continue to fail to grasp. A real guide that actually teaches people to do the things you are talking about will be much more complex than the idea behind my initial post.
But am I stopping you from referencing such guides? Didn’t I tell you in my first response to you that if you had a better way of doing things - you could post a link to it instead of just condemning what I’ve done?
Why haven’t you - in any of your replies said “New Players - here is a better way to do things; [link] [link]” Why haven’t you done that? The new players are NOT going to know which of us is right - but - if instead of just acting like I don’t know what I’m talking about and that you do - why haven’t you posted an alternative?
And - no - it is not me who thinks that 4 > 5 - it is YOU.
I told you just how much ISK I could make in a new character per hour once I got them into a Venture. 4 million ISK per hour. How much ISK do you think they could make per hour - their first day - doing things YOUR way - but - without any more help than you can provide in a guide. Let’s SEE your guide on what they can do. I’d like to see it. If you actually write up a detailed guide on how to do Project Discover - I’d like to read it. If you haven’t got one - but know of one - how about a link to it?
Wouldn’t actual information from you be more useful to a new player than simply telling me I’m wrong?
Again - 4 million ISK an hour once they get into a Venture and do what I said to do.
If you can see a way for the average new player to make more than that - tell us what it is - and how to do it.
I’ve given you a figure. Lets see one from your end.
Tell us how you are going to do it - and tell us how much we will make.
Oh and one last thing about my previous post - that bit about Multi-Boxing - was NOT necessarily about Average Players. I don’t know how many Average Miners Multi-Box (which is a misnomer as you can and I am running 3 accounts on this crappy computer).
4 million?
L1 mission running makes more than that. So does exploration and Project Discovery. On day one. Didn’t we already have this conversation?
Call it what you want - guide or not - any newbie reading this is going to suffer for it.
I’m getting stuck on the idea that OP is the only person who has the ability to give new players advice … on a forum section dedicated to giving new players advice. WTF?
What my actual advice was - as opposed to the arguments I’ve been having after that - was a simple way someone who didn’t know anything about the game - could make some quick money before they did those other things.
I also included some information on how Rookie Ships work. Most new people don’t know anything about that. They may not be in a Rookie ship very long - but isn’t it a useful bit of info for them to know that while they are they can just repackage their ship and have two guns instead of one?
Now - most people are going to do just what you say. They’ll never read this thread, they’ll go from the NPE to their Career Agents - because that is what the game is going to guide them to do. But - on the odd chance that someone does and there it is more likely to be Starting Over than Starting Out - this is a quick way for them to make ISK with nothing but a Rookie Ship.
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Now - NOT HAVING ANYTHING TO DO WITH NEW PEOPLE here is something YOU are not thinking about.
What about the people who hate mission running and LIKE mining?
I hate mission running. It is boring beyond belief. You have some Mindless NPC telling you what to do - and you have to go do it. What is interesting - what is fun - about that? And - it’s the same damn missions - over and over. I’ve got 40 or 50 characters … I’ve run those Career Agent missions more times that I even want to think about. I ran the Epic Arc - one time - and hated every boring minute of it.
Then of course there are all the other games I’ve played that had Quests or Missions or whatever they called them. That’s what I like about shooters like Planetside, WoT or WT no NPC’s telling me what to do.
I run missions because I have to. The primary reason is to gain standings with a Corporation but the other reason - is to find missions with Asteroids in them I can mine.
And another thing about Mining - is that if you are running multiple accounts - it is not boring. I can keep very busy managing multiple ships.
And - if I’m running multiple accounts I can mine in some of them - and run missions with the others.
The thing I really like about mining - is I am making the decisions about what I do. I am determining my fate.
Now there are other aspects of this game that I may not be familiar with that would also be like that.
Lastly - there is what I believe to be one of the Big Lies about EvE - and that is that people quit the game because they are bored with mining. I don’t think so. I think they quit mining because they are bored with it. If they are quitting EvE - I believe it’s for some other reason. Maybe they are bored with Mining and Mission Running … I don’t know. There are other things to do in the game.
For me - I get restless now playing any game after several months. I didn’t use to be that way. I exclusively played Planetside when it first came out in 2003 for 4 years - and then played EvE exclusively for 5 years from 2007 to 2012 but … after that … I just seemed to roam about. One of the guys I used to work with called one of the other guys A Game Gypsy … Ha! Ha! Maybe that’s me now …
I was playing EvE with 3 Omega accounts last fall for a few months - then I quit and now I’m back with 3 different Omega’s … shrug …
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Yeah - we did already have this conversation and you are still saying the same thing you did before - without proof.
How much can they make? Not more - how much? I just did that. Tell me - how much will they make per hour?
And - tell me how they did it.
Project Discovery … what is that? How do you do it?
I have challenged you to provide links to how to run missions your way and how to do Project Discovery and - what have you come up with?
Nothing.
How has ANYTHING you’ve posted helped a new player?
“Toshiro is wrong” … that’s it. How does that help a new player?
Links. How many times have I asked you for links? Wouldn’t that be more helpful to a new player reading this than “Toshiro is wrong”?
AS I SAID LAST TIME - a new player doesn’t know which of us is wrong. Why don’t you tell them how to do something instead of just say “Toshiro is wrong”? Prove it to them.
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You are a waste of time.
I left that out because everyone already knows that.
This was just to provide a little information on Rookie Ships that most new people do not know and a suggestion on how to make some quick Starter Cash before they get into the Career Agents.
One of the things I dislike about doing the Career Agent missions - is that I’m stuck in these crappy little ships they give you because I don’t have the money to buy something better - or fit what I’ve got - or buy the skill books I want. So - what I do now - is go make some money and get some better ships BEFORE I start all those career agent missions.
And - it’s not a guide. Just a suggestion - and how to do it.
It’s a guide. An extremely limited and biased guide, but still a guide.
Edit to fix nested quote silliness
Eh … OK …
I didn’t think of it that way. I thought of a guide as something more elaborate than this. But that’s fine.
I’ll stop telling people it’s not a guide.
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