If you think gankers need more consequences, than undock and bring the consequences. Stop begging CCP to solve your problems. I think miners deserve more consequences, and I practice what I preach.
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Not opposed to that. Dont want the clone soldier value to plummet though. Give em something else.
They can also be sold to NPC orders just like other tags iirc.
Then they would be just another loot item that increases the ISK inflation.
Tbh, I totally understand the frustration, the current system makes absolutely no sense, but we donât have a better one. Being able to kill people in HS is fundamental to this game and you canât make it so hard and so unattractive that basically nobody would do it any more. So, while I would agree that this repeated cycle of losing and resetting secstatus for ISK is ridiculously stupid, I also believe if you want to remove that, you would have to give HS criminals other ways to keep doing what they are doing and make profits if they are good at it. HS isnât meant to be a safe zone where everybody can just float around afk in multibillion ISK ships and expect nothing will happen.
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Why doesnât it make sense?
I am allowed to hunt in Highsec if I pay the hunting in Highsec fee.
Whatâs the problem?
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I was thinking about maybe borrowing a catalyst if you have any to spare?Also, your gangking permit was approved pending another deposit of 2b <3
That paying to offset a consequence turns this consequence into a âcostâ. There is, from a design point of view, no need for a security-satus system at all if people can just pay an amount of X to reset it at any time. The game could rather deduct X amount of ISK from your wallet anytime you shoot some one as a âfeeâ then.
Also I believe that most players would expect a somewhat realistic lore behaviour of the NPC law-enforcement entities. In no civilized country you can shoot someone, get your gun confiscated and then pay 20 bucks at the next police station to have your criminal record erased, then buy the next gun and shoot the next guy right around the corner. And just repeat that process over and over. Itâs something nobody would believe you could build a society upon, not even a fictional sci-fi one. Lore and immersion simply play a great role in game design and I think this system of security tags is simply very bad design from that perspective.
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Come on man, youâve been playing EvE longer than me. You know EvE is set in a cruel universe, with corrupt governments and rampant piracy. Iâm a Khanidian High Princess, of course Iâm allowed to hunt the peasants. I think itâs ridiculous I have to pay anything at all, but I do it graciously, as hunting is a noble pastime.
Thats my point. You shouldnât have to pay anything. Just living with consequences while opening up other opportunities.
You should be good at the profession and then be able to make your profits with piracy in HS, making yourself a fearsome name and reputation and not pay with ISK or tags or anything to reset a repetitive circle of 20second-kills after waiting semi-afk in the ever-same multiboxed dirt cheap throwaway gankships until the scanner/scout reports something. Thats cheap design. EVE could offer so much more than that.
A Princess should enforce her reign in a blinged to the teeth Machariel, not the 6345th replacement catalyst.
Sure, if you want to delete CONCORD and remove Highsec from the game - Iâm fine with that. Until then, tags exist to ensure that I exist.
Weâve had this. The Zombies brought logi to keep their blockade fleet alive through CONCORD, and repping criminal ships was changed to get you flagged criminal also. Then they banned dropping drones to slow CONCORD down. Then Globby invented hyperdunking, ie having a ship such as an Orca or a Bowhead drop fresh ships for you to swap into as your old ones get destroyed, and this too was deemed an exploit and patched out. Even basic techniques like stationing bump ships along certain routes to buy time to bring a gank fleet over got nerfed basically out of existence.
Any attempt to make ganking more effective/more interesting/more skill intensive than âjust bring a lot of destroyers/attack battlecruisersâ get patched out and may well earn you a ban.
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Oh you donât want hers. She buys up all the decommissioned Catalysts that are falling apart. She gets them at a discount that way since theyâre just going to be destroyed anyway.
I would change CONCORD and change HighSec, not removing either of them.
But, the discussion is moot anyway, since CCP in itâs current state probably neither have devs nor designers capable of creating what I imagine.
Poor choice of CCP, but very easy. A simple and lazy solution, which lead to the current system that somehow both sides of the coin dislike: the ganked ones complain that ganking is too easy, the gankers complain that they have been nerfed over and over and need a quadribazzillion accounts to gank. If you take the wrong turn at every fork, you end up where we are today.
Thatâs exactly how it works in some GTA games. I think thatâs how it works in most GTA games.
funfact, you can pop a poor fit retriever in 0.5 with a single cat whack. We need more capsuleers to start ganking and even the playing field.
I certainly agree, but regardless the idea of âconsequencesâ should not be enforced by NPC game mechanics. Thatâs one of the brilliant and compelling aspects of EvE, that should not change. If you want consequences, you as a player need to enforce them via PvP. That is playing the game as intended. The security tags are intended to slow me down, because CCP realizes I need to be handicapped before I exterminate all the new players, but itâs silly to suggest we go full Harrison Bergeron.
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They can already be sold for isk iirc. I would also bet that the low volume of soldier tag drops would make them a literal drop in the ocean when compared along with the rest of the raw isk generators. (Ex. Null stormy ratting, Pochven, etc.)
Itâs not about making high sec ganking impossible. Ganking can, and should, be possible, but thereâs a difference between spear fishing a freighter that you know has 10b isk in cargo, and shooting a random T1 hauler just because thereâs no reason not to. Itâs not like tags are the only way to fix sec status. You do naturally recover it over time as you kill pirate rats. Tags just allow you to super torpedo your status with zero downside.
Thereâs a section of empire space for people who want to do this. Itâs called low sec. If someone wants to be a blood thirsty pirate? Thatâs where they should be. Suicide ganking in high sec should not be a primary form of content. Because it is a massively one sided interaction where the ganker has perfect safety to pick and choose a target they are 100% sure they can kill. See the Tornadoes that are permanently stationed off the Jita undock as an example.
(Would reply to everything youâve said in general because you raise good points, but responding while at work.)
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No worries, I get your point. I also have said what I wanted to say, too much things to do to invest even more time into a discussion that wonât change anything at all. Becuase CCP wonât touch the system anytime soon anywayâŚ
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Iâve been told that this is precisely why BLOPS is so successful. There are whole write-ups about it. Iâve read a couple of them.
Unfortunately, youâre probably right. CCP added clone tags because they were scared that the people who pushed PvP content would leave if they didnât get to both eat their cake (illegally attacking targets), but also get to have their cake too. (Still being allowed into high sec with zero downside afterwards.)
They likely decided that the gankers leaving would result in a bigger player base drop than the number of people who leave the game because they got ganked.
Which is kind of stupid, because even if they did remove tags, the sheer volume of multiple alts and multiple accounts makes the Outlaw penalty nearly a non-factor.