You can look through the other replies. I don’t want to cry and paste the same argument for all replies.
They serve a role as introducing people to the game. While that may or may not be CCP’s intention it is what is now, and it works. I was an alpha clone, tried the game, then impulsed purchased omega to pursue my logi career. Newbros may not impulse purchase omega for the sake of a mining barge, as venture mining doesn’t give them enough isk to enjoy stuff. They may want to expand to exhumers because a mining barge gives them basic mining income, and gives them a good impression of the game and mining career. This is also good for us players for the sake of player retention.
Alphas need to be restricted from barges, and ice mining cause of the way industry is scaleable.
Giving free accounts ability to mine, produce, and do PI like Omega accounts will literally destroy the economy that is for the most part player operated.
If you think Botters would not take full advantage of that then you are stupid or crazy, or a bit of both.
I pay a sub, I can literally box a mining fleet that can do 1.5 million m3 per hour…but im paying CCP cash to do so.
You give alphas barges…whelp guess what those botters botting 50, 100, 150 accounts all at once, and create new accounts every day sometimes just for spite as well as replacements when they get banned are going to be all over your belts, and you wont get a thing.
So really argument for alphas getting barges??? please all of you children arguing for this, just shut the F up already, you have no clue what you are talking about, and if you are too broke to multi-box then dont…if you are to broke to pay for 1 account…go play a browser game that is free and get the hell out of EvE, you dont belong here with your incessant whining.
And that is really it, you want free free free…get Rekt and shut up, or pay up and stop trying to ■■■■ on veterans and those paying that really do want to play and support the game.
Put some figures on the board. What can a venture mine solo in m3 with alpha skills and what can a retriever mine solo in m3 also with alpha skills.
I’m sure you’ve done this as you are attempting to use income as an argument here.
The fallacy in your argument here is that CCP’s intent regarding Alpha accounts seems to have changed significantly since their introduction, so references to statements made in the early days of Alphas are probably irrelevant. Yes, they were originally intended as trial / taster accounts, but now CCP actively advertises the game as free to play - it is the single most prominent message on their advertisements - at the same time as relaxing the restrictions on Alphas massively. As an aside, not sure you are right to say that barges are the mainstream mining ship - I see far more exhumers and Orcas even in HS than I see plain old barges, and for anyone serious about mining they are no more an end state than a Venture. I certainly skipped through them as fast as I could.
Now I am not sure I agree with giving Alphas access to barges; on the downside, it would be counter-intuitive given all the efforts CCP are making to mess up ore supply - sorry, encourage greater scarcity - but equally, IF CCP are really wanting to encourage Alphas to upgrade to Omegas (and I agree with @Lily_Inkura that that may not be an absolute given), then some access to something better than a Venture might tempt individuals to try out a mining career beyond hobby mining in a Venture. It need not be full Level V access - after all, Alphas only get Level I on Industrials.
No, it hasn’t. They expanded the range of ships. That doesn’t change the base intent behind alphas though. So the principle remains the same, alphas are consumers.
Also as above, check the actual maths. I’m pretty sure ventures turn out a significant portion of what a barge can from an old presentation.
You’re the person who’s destroying the market with 1.5 million m3 of flooded ore per hour. CCP and CODE are doing a great job with botters and I hope they continue. This change would even incentivize CCP to take anti-botting further.
Well, not many alphas have money with mining. If CCP’s goal is to run all the newbro miners out of the game or convert them to ratters… Also, it’s much more of a gf with a faction frigate vs a high skilled Enyo, than a Condor vs a high skilled Enyo.
Maybe now that they can mine more they may want to mine more expensive ore deep in lowsec with a mining fleet. Not much point coming to a mining fleet with a venture.
3 m3/s vs 13 m3/s? Maybe 12 if it’s not a Covetor. Quick plug in pyfa. (0 skills, but too lazy to emulate alpha skills, just an idea)
Well, they should get rid of that guy multi boxing 70 rorquals and mining 1.5 mil m3 a hour above.
As of above. Ventures yield like nothing compared to barges.
Hey dipshit, I said I can, not that I am…learn to read arsehole. and Code dont do ■■■■ but sit mostly in Uedama instead of hunting bots…CODE is in for the profits, not bot hunting idiot.
These discussions are a lotta fun because CCP, like any other company, sometimes explains their decisions, but those explanations often seem to be light years away from what is apparently, or even obviously, true. So its a big circle jerk of guessing games. (sigh)
Something to consider that I do not think has been brought up is the sheer number of combat vessels in the game compared to mining vessels. Percentage wise I am not sure if access is equivalent or not.
As for CCP reasoning on this, they may reason that for the people who gravitate toward mining, being stuck in a venture but gazing over at the mining barge is going to push the maximum number toward omega. They may have even researched it enough to declare that a hard truth (even if they don’t tell us). The character of combat oriented people is simply different.
One thing I think I can tell you for sure is that they don’t give a damn about balancing mining ship and combat ship access for alphas for the sake of having that balance. The base reasoning for such a move would be cosmetics at worst and consistency at best, but once you start asking the question “How exactly does this increase real world profits for the owners?” you start to realize why this is going nowhere. You need a real good answer for that question, or, you really need a dev enthralled with the idea for some reason. I cannot see either happening. (I could see an EVE player mass strike also having an effect, but it won’t happen just to get alphas more ships).
I may be muddying the waters here but I can suggest two alternate routes to simply giving alphas barges for anyone interested. 1) Considering the relative lack of variety of mining ships, push for and even suggest some new types. One thing that I always thought bizarre was that (at least in my time) there are no race specific true mining vessels with unique traits, if we don’t consider corvettes to be mining vessels (and I don’t). Even increasing the number of ORE mining ships would be cool. Maybe even introduce a vessel that blows up (larger) asteroids into chunks and then you pilot that manually to scoop up or tractor said chunks for reprocessing or sale or something. 2) Rather than just ask for mining barges, combine that with some serious nerfing of the T1 venture. The venture is WAY too good/advanced for its position in the mining vessel line up. That simple fact probably helps explain why alphas cannot get something even better in the barges.
I am not convinced it is a good idea, but making Mining Barge I an Alpha skill could be interesting. Alphas would then need to upgrade to Omega for a potential extra 8% reduction in strip miner duration, and access to exhumers.
What’s easier than killing defenseless bots? Also there are people who actually do it anyways.
Most newbros are alphas to try out the game. Ok. Alpha miners. CCP shouldn’t try to drive off alpha miners either.
A venture is almost impossible to tackle unless with a specialized 3-point ship. People don’t go ventures. Also ventures give low isk/h even with boosts so venture pilots usually see no point.
Alphas SHOULD be mining.
Lowsec ore is like twice the price of regular ore and that’s it. Also, 1/5.
Seriously? Maybe you should be making the skills instead.
And that balance is needed. Alphas have no choice but to rat currently, and that’s part of what’s causing all the isk faucets of bounties now.
I dunno what variations could be done.
It’s the difference between these 10 people each multi boxing 10 accounts. Also these people could chat and have a fun social time in eve. The leader of that group would also get power and be happy about that (eve is advertised where “everyone could become the mittani”.
You missed the point. Say Max is mining 1.5 million m3 of ore with say 10 accounts. 2 pockets over you have 10 players with 1 pilot each, no multi boxing pulling 1.5 million m3 of ore. Which one is doing more harm on the industry? And Why?
@Aphrodite_Sexy
If you want to see more mining fleets, is anything stopping you from starting one? I realize that you are only one person, and one is a little less than a couple.