Is that why whenever there’s a new MMO released on Steam, they get extremely high concurrent player counts? MMOs are still very popular, the problem is every attempt at a modern MMO has been poorly implemented, but the interest is there. Does that mean EVE is going to manage the same kind of numbers as New World with 913,634, or Throne and Liberty with 336,300? No, but it could sure as hell do better than 29k (many of whom are now multibox alts).
Call it what you want, most players in online games are casuals. If I had to wager a guess for why EVE Echoes died, it was probably more to do with the very clunky controls and monetization. Never once saw anyone in local complaining about not being able to gank, though. Low and Null exist for a reason.
Eve has a problem, yet an unsafe high sec isnt it. Eve is niche simply because its biggest draw, the fact it is full loot, highly unsafe and that you can be the villain, is also its biggest drawback. People naturally want to build and grow and in a full loot system where you can backstab and be brutal to others to such a degree that would get you banned in other games is seen as a detriment to many. This double edged sword will keep Eve niche for as long as it stays true to its original vision.
Destruction in every area of space is what makes market opportunities for manufacturers and death dealers alike. I am still fully convinced that Helicity Boson, the creator of Hulkaggedon, was a hulk bpo holder. Amazing idea to create your own demand! I am fully impressed with innovators and entrepreneurs like this in Eve.
So next time you think it needs to go away just remember the ecosystem it supports. Humanity has forever dabbled in destroying ecosystem “invaders” and “threats” and all it creates is more imbalances as prey flourishes and wipes out other lifeforms until the original predators are reintroduced and suddenly the balance is achieved again. Remember what you all are advocating for here, on both sides, is to unbalance an equation that changes by the minute in real time in MMOs such as Eve. Because you are affecting everyone with every move you make.
Nevermind that in the end it is a game, given to us by CCP, now Pearl Abyss, for their own profits and motives. Many of which remain shrouded in secrecy.
Also, from a personal standpoint… youre advocating a snooze fest!!
Every game has a set of core players…whilst the rest, and probably a large majority, are largely vagrants who come and go and yet who are also the whiniest. THE golden rule for any games company is…do not piss off your core players.
Or they could change the way defenses work. It’s not logical for a T1 destroyer to match the firepower of a T3 cruiser. They have already made it si that a large ship has a lot of trouble hitting small ones, but there is no penalty for a small ship damaging a large one.
And they can be. The problem with EVE casuals is, they want to live the easy life of a casual but earn the riches and rewards of the hardcore players.
They are like the Diablo2 guy who don’t want to grind a 1000 tower runs on Hell for countless hours, but want HighRunes dropping from his little normal difficulty Baal Run once a day.
My T3 Tengu can do 1000 DPS at 24km and has waaaay more EHP than a Catalyst. T3s are good in that you don’t have to compromise between tank and DPS…with a good fitting you can have both. A single Catalyst vs a T3 hasn’t a hope in hell against that. There’s only really a ‘match’ when there’s half a dozen Catalysts…and they all have to be within 7.5km ( I havent ganked for some time so I forget what the exact range is for Void…its pretty small ).
I would rather play a fun game than a boring one with millions of players.
How would EVE be more fun if it had a million players? If anything by making the game safer it would be less fun than the EVE today.
Sure, EVE requires a minimum amount of other players to be a fun interactive MMO, but beyond a fee thousand other players I don’t see the additional value of ‘more players’ when it comes to how fun the game is.
Beyond that point game mechanics are more important for the delivery of fun, and sacrificing good game mechanics to pray you can maybe get more players doesn’t seem like a good idea to me.
I’ve undocked plenty in my 18 months of playing… Look at my killboard… I’m definitely not a carebear, just made alot of stupid mistakes that I learned from… I quit five years ago because their encroachment in monetizing the skins destroyed all of of my investments… They changed the rules of the game in the middle of it out of nothing but pure greed to monetize the game away from players… I lost tens of billions when they started that greedy crap… Then I lost a 4 bil Kronos to my own stupidity and everything together got me to put the game away for five years… On the positive side, I had amassed all kinds of the rarest skins and had bought five Marshals at 4 bill each before I left, so I was more than well off when I came back… I had never stopped loving the game, but what they were doing to it was getting me POed, so it took me five years to cool off and come back… Lol…
“Boring”? Compared to what, being alpha-struck off the grid with zero agency?
Let’s talk facts, not nostalgia.
“Only 1% of noobs are ganked in the first 2 weeks!”
That comes from CCP Rise’s 2019 retention presentation at EVE North (YouTube, ~19:50). He said ganking isn’t the primary reason players quit during the first two weeks. True. But here’s what usually gets ignored:
1. Ganking increases churn risk for those it hits
In that same talk, CCP Rise clearly states that players who get ganked are more likely to quit. The percentage affected is small, but the impact is serious. Just because it’s not a mass event doesn’t mean it’s harmless. A small percentage of house fires burn down entire homes too.
2. The post-tutorial stage is the retention bottleneck
CCP Ghost’s 2017 Fanfest presentation backed this up. Players who find a sense of purpose after the early game are more likely to stay. If a new player decides to try trading, mining, or hauling, and their first experience is getting deleted by a Tornado alt with no warning or recourse, that purpose dies with their ship.
3. Most players don’t quit from “boredom.” They quit from confusion and disempowerment
Community feedback and interviews (see Markeedragon’s video interviews) confirm that the majority of new players who quit do so because they don’t understand the mechanics, feel like nothing they do matters, or get punished for simply trying to engage. “Boredom” is often just the label we slap on confusion and discouragement.
The idea that ganking is exciting PvP doesn’t hold up
Highsec ganking is rarely a real fight. It’s one-sided ISK farming with throwaway ships. The “thrill” comes from bullying weaker players, not risk or strategy. Removing non-consensual PvP from highsec wouldn’t remove danger from EVE. It would just push PvP back into places where both sides can actually fight back.
Duels and wars would still exist. Gankers could still gank in low and nullsec. But new players and solo industrialists would finally be able to build something without random deletion from an alt that doesn’t care about losses.
If your idea of exciting gameplay is pressing F1 on a Retriever and losing a 17,361,002.85 ISK Catalyst to CONCORD, maybe the problem isn’t highsec being too safe. Maybe it’s a lack of creativity.
That mindset is textbook gatekeeping. It says, “If you’re not playing the game the way I like, then you don’t belong.” It’s elitist, short-sighted, and it’s one of the main reasons EVE has stagnated.
Calling EVE “the best space combat multiplayer game” while mocking people who don’t want forced combat 24/7 is peak irony. Not everyone logs in for space bushido. Some want to build, explore, trade, or roleplay without being farmed by suicide alts. That diversity is what made EVE unique. Not killboards.
This bittervet mindset is why EVE’s population peaked in 2013 and has slowly bled ever since. Players who adapt and welcome change grow communities. Players who mock others for how they play shrink them.
You want the sandbox to grow? Stop peeing on every new player who sets up a sandcastle and calling it content.
