Adapt to what? EvE is now basically “Join me or Die”. It isn’t a sandbox anymore. Big alliances has too much control over the game that new players only has those two choices.
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Really? Well, then I’ll have to be careful.
For now I haven’t seen that yet, but I didn’t play much, ventured into lowsec but never too far from high sec (a good thing about wormhole exploration: it can be done anywhere).
Maybe I’ll see that further down the road or when I join a corp. Which, I admit, kinda worries me: due to previous experiences I know some guilds can be really miserable, but at the same time you make friends so you don’t really want to quit.
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Maybe MAKE the damn t1-t1 frigate/dessies worth a damn in fleet wars. People who leave after one month mostly because they see that they can’t do jack or feel like slug with t1 ships after being lured by “PvP experience”.
Okay. Another pass to demonstrate that we are in fact dealing with ingrained attitudes, views, ideas that are the result of years of Marketing.
A quick refresher. Here are the two statements that we are concerned with, first one is from CCP Falcon and the second one is from Ragionier_Sunji.
As I already stated this particular criticism, by which I mean, this particular Marketing Strategy did NOT start with CCP Falcon, the first use of it by a game studio was during the development of “Age of Conan.” This particular marketing strategy teaches you to dislike, be dissatisfied with, and even hate World of Warcraft because it tells you that you are a “unique hero” but everyone is doing the same things.
You obtain a quest to kill Hogger. You go down to where he spawns, kill him and are hailed as a “unique hero”. Then you watch as player after player picks up the same quest, kills Hogger and is hailed as a “unique hero.”
Ragionier_Sunji finds this situation so senseless, he describes it as “Schizophrenic.” And that makes it intolerable! He must get away from World Of Warcraft and its schizophrenia!
What I am saying is, that this view is NOT the result of experience and it is NOT the result of your own analysis of World of Warcraft (or GW2). It is the result of Marketing. Years of Marketing.
In World of Warcraft a player gets a Quest to kill Hogger. He kills Hogger, 
ONCE He’s hailed a Hero and moves on to the next Quest(s). And that player will never kill Hogger again!
In EVE Online a player gets a Mission to kill DREAD PIRATE SCARLET. He kills Dread Pirate Scarlet and is hailed a Hero. And then, he’ll kill Dread Pirate Scarlet again. and again. and again. and again. and again! And as long as you run missions in EVE Online, for 2 weeks, for 2 months, for 2 years, for 20 years, you can look forward to being given the mission to kill Dread Pirate Scarlet AGAIN!!! And this is true for EVERY mission in EVE Online.
Why is the system used in World of Warcraft intolerable and the even more ridiculous system used in EVE Online tolerable??? Marketing! You are taught to hate World of Warcraft. And it is NOTHING but Hate! there is no Reason, or philosophy, or anything of the kind behind it, it is just Hate due to Marketing.
Essentially, they hold up two fingers to close their nose and point at World of Warcraft. And you think; “World of Warcraft must be poorly made! I’m leaving!”
Congratulation: you have just proven you are incapable of reading what I write.
I told you that my beef with wow wasn’t only that one, but there is one even bigger.
And again, I already told you that that was only ONE of the many problems that made me leave Wow. Including the fact that that level of omologation was also in the GAME MECHANICS.
Oh, btw, in Eve it makes sense: Dread Pirate Scarlet is a CAPSULEER. That means she is immortal like us. Thus it makes sense we will have to kill her OVER AND OVER AGAIN. In Wow, not so much.
Oh, also, the mission asking you to kill her is treated as a market transaction: the giver SPLITS THE BOUNTY WITH YOU. So much for the great hero, huh?
I could have told you that ages ago 
And I’m telling you: Go Back to School!
Childish Denial doesn’t change anything.
You know…I read this and I can’t help but wonder if perhaps somebody here is having some sort of crisis. Not intending to be flippant. This post looks at possibly the worst feature in EVE, missions, and makes a comparison to one of the few features in WoW (as I understand it) and then goes completely off the rails.
Yes, missions suck. They are repetitive and boring and predictable. Once you figure them out it is just a rote activity. I doubt you’ll find very many players who would proclaim EVE super awesome (and/or that WoW sucks) simply because of missions/quests. In fact, many players would point to the open ended aspects of EVE that they like, not missions. That empires are being built and torn down. That wealth is accumulated then destroyed. That you can play however you want.
And the focus on marketing…it strikes me as an unhealthy obsession with a view that is extreme. That marketing makes us do things we do not want to do. That we have zero free will. CCP wants us to (supposedly) hate WoW so we hate WoW without batting an eye. I have to wonder how he feels about the targeting marketing that Facebook and Google do? I’m sure I’ve written all this because of marketing…that I only think I have free will because of marketing. But Auto here…he and he alone is free of this can can see the Truth™. He sees the power of marketing whereas I am simply a puppet being operated by CCP and their pernicious and all power marketing department.
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First of all World of Warcraft does NOT ask a player to kill Hogger over and over again. A Player kills Hogger once.
The Dread Pirate Scarlet mission is not only the same, it is also being run by others in EVE Online that run missions.
But let us grant your argument. ie. That EVE Online takes account of its Mechanics.
What explanation does EVE Online give for Dread Pirate Scarlet, a capsuleer, coming back over and over again in the exact same scenario, with the exact same number of jump gates, with the exact same Dialogue, using the exact same tactics, and the exact same number of ship waves, over and over and over again??? What explanation does EVE Online give for the vast sum of ISK that Dread Pirate Scarlet would have to have in order to field the same amount of ships every time she is engaged???
Not only that!
What explanation does EVE Online give for the fact that an unlimited number of pilots can do the Dread Pirate Scarlet mission simultaneously??? Jump clone??? Plural? meaning unlike a capsuleer, Dread Pirate Scarlet can occupy an unlimited number of Jump clones at once???
Based on your response to the Quest system of World of Warcraft, shouldn’t you admit that a schizophrenic can live a quiet life on the right meds, but EVE Online should be committed to an asylum???
Your actions in EVE Online are so meaningless, that you’ll have to do the same thing over and over again, fight the same Capsuleer, over and over again, in the exact same way over and over again, ad infinitum. Sisyphus would pity an EVE Online player! Even Bill Murray in “Groundhog’s Day” could alter things!!
The Mission system in EVE Online is a thousand times worse than the Quest system in World of Warcraft!
The Quest system of World of Warcraft is absolutely intolerable, because of Marketing. Not reason.
Okay everybody. Because of this super compelling reason CCP will have to shut down the servers and we are all going to go play WoW from now on. /sarcasm
Holy crap…
I have always preferred Laurence Olivier’s response to Dustin Hoffman during the filming of Marathon Man. After Dustin talked about his experience getting into character.
Sir Laurence: You should try acting, it is so much easier.
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Urban Dictionary: #gbtwow
#gbtwow. Top Definition. GB2WOW. An internet acronym short for “Go Back to Wow”. Used mostly on MMORPG-forums. Used as a hostile term towards people that, for example, suggest Wow-like features or whine about features that are characteristically unlike Wow. - I think this game needs bigger swords. And more elves.
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This topic needs more posts. I find the arguments contained herein to be very entertaining at the moment despite not having something to munch on.
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CCP runs their business like an old married couple.
Really? Are we?
A lot of EVE players used to play WOW and a lot still do. People don’t just play one game.
Fact is, EVE and WOW are two completely different games. The whole “Go back to WOW” meme only ever appears if some gamer from another MMO comes to the forums and thinks because he was really the king of his server over there that makes his some kind of special person with insight into game design and therefor he has to share his vast knowledge about how to make EVE the next WOW clone.
Because everything always has to be exactly the same. Every game has to work completely as the other game does, god forbid there are different flavours appealing to different tastes.
So Auto, I really don’t get why you are sticking around this forums. You don’t like the game, that is fine. There are a lot of other games out there that may suit your taste, EVE obviously does not because you have some fundamental issue about how it works but let me tell you, it worked like that for over 15 years, and it is still here!
It is not gona change now just because you are unhappy with it and not satisfied with it’s game mechanics. There are people however who are very satisfied and like it the way it is. And that has nothing at all to do with marketing, it is the simple fact that most people playing EVE have a good time doing so and actually HAVE FUN doing it, which is the single reason why you should play a game in the first place.
You are completely wasting your time here.
Go back to WOW!
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Not really.
Yes, there is always bigger fish.
But similar to Earth Oceans you can be pretty safe living next to huge carnivore (and even use his prey to feed yourself) if you are too small for it too care.
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Hey! A coherent response! Was it so hard?
Anyway, two things:
One. Yeah, Eve isn’t perfect. But it still explains a lot more than Wow. Killing people has meaning because at least you keep them at bay. Hogger will face no repercussion for getting killed, if we try to explain why he is back by saying he just keeps on respawning like we do. I’ll take a bit of repetition and synchronization against the game failing to take into account everyone is immortal.
Two. Don’t like missions? DON’T DO MISSIONS. You can do that in Eve. I don’t do them. I ventured into lowsec the moment I looked up how exploration worked, found a quiet place and now what I do is scan down wormholes, get inside and grab all the data/relic sites I can.
You might say “it gets old”. But well, it doesn’t: even if the place is quiet, I still have to deal with competing explorers, local corps that might decide to blow me up, other corps at war with them, invaders coming out of wormholes and so on. Every day the scenario I have to navigate is difference.
AND it gets even better. Despite the fact I’m a new player in a crappy ship with t1 modules and only the few skills an alpha account can get me, I can “compete” with explorers that use top of the line exploration ships (like the Astero) with perfect modules, or with explorer hunters with t3 destroyers or cruisers.
Then, when I get more money I can afford a bigger ship to do combat sites, or enough capital to expand my station trading capabilities. Or planetary interaction. Or pvp.
When I played in Wrath of the Lich King, I HAD to do quests in order to level up. Not only that, considering the game is exclusively centered around a combat career, everything I could do depended on the level and gear of my character. In other words, the game controlled my progress and made sure there were very few things I could do, no matter how much I knew or didn’t know about the region and the game.
Once I got to level 80, I could either grind to get pvp gear in unfair fights against people who already had it, or get into dungeons.
There is only a set amount of them, and in order to get the gear you need you’ll have to do all of them. Like everyone else. Hell, thanks to the soulbound mechanic making money is almost useless. So even if you understand the market and provide useful resources, or actually step out into the game world and risk pvp to farm mobs or gather stuff, you are still not progressing in a way the game considers meaningful.
After that, you do raids. Again, like everyone else. And oh boy, didn’t I have fun doing the same raid over and over again as an off-tank, being told to do the same limited tasks juggling a bunch of mobs every night.
I enjoyed so much I didn’t even care when I got better gear. Because let’s face it: it would have only lead me to do the same thing, just in another raid. I couldn’t even feel more powerful, because I was still a small specialized part of a raid, with a build that was equal to the one of any other tank paladin on the server.
Of course, the fact that I was in a guild with three assholes deciding the strategy with no room for discussion or objection didn’t help.
Maybe had the game been more self-concious and aknowledged things would be this way, that I wouldn’t be a valiant hero but more of a specialist in a group of mercenaries, maybe I would have enjoyed it a bit more. Maybe.
Also, can we all agree how crap of an idea flying mounts were? Every day I would get invited to the raid, fly there without interactiong with anyone else, doing the raid, get some gear to do the same boring job a tiny bit better. If you allow me to be semi-serious for a second, I got more unexpected interactions with players outside of my group in Dark Souls than in WoW after level 80, and Dark Souls is not an MMO!
Again, not saying WoW is crap. It’s just that there were many things I didn’t enjoy. Not because of outside advertising, but because of the kind of game it is. It can be a good thing or a bad thing. For me it was often the latter.
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Moral, ethics, fairness, cyniscism? Am I the only one that thinks that these are not the reasons that EVE is slowly declining but the reason why it is still afloat after such a long time?
So many games where every low IQ lame-ass gets the same stuff as everyone else just for logging in and doing the most mundane tasks. And you are not even allowed to tell the stupid ones that they are stupid because that is against the rules of care-bear paradise. EVE is one of the very few games left where you can not only call the stupid ones stupid –no– you can even make them feel it.
EVE is one of the last games where you can bask in the glory of your flawlessly executed master plans that not everyone able to follow the idiot proof steps of a youtube tutorial can copycat. Most game developers have forgotten what is best in life: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear their lamentations on the forum!
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you don’t even need to fly to the physical raid anymore. with LFG and LFR you don’t even need to go to the physical location, you just queue up, wait for some randos to be grouped with you. run the dungeon in total silence, and then part ways never to see each other again.
sure there are the harder raid difficulties, but all that does is get you a bigger stat-stick, but any actual progression from one raid to another is completely dead. there are mythic dungeons as well, and those ones get you bigger stat sticks as well, but sometimes they add special modifiers that can mix up the way the dungeon plays a tiny bit… but its still running through the same 8 dungeons that you’ve done a billion times before on the CHANCE that you might get something that is a couple numbers bigger than what you’ve got now.
at least most grinding in eve is reliable, if I go and kill pirate scarlet for the hundredth time, I know that i’ll get the same reward as the previous hundred times. instead of “oh boy, lets go kill scarlet again, maybe this time she will drop the one thing I need that will make my numbers .01% better!!!”
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Hey I love Eve Online just as much as I love WoW when i need to go planetside and human interaction I play WoW, when i want to be an arsehole and ignore everyone then Eve Online is my go to place. Been playing both for ten year plus, When it comes to money paid out for both games then Eve Online has had way more rl cash from me than WoW ever will.