The Rivoda and Zarmazd


(elitatwo) #1

It is a little sad to see that there was no official thread from CCP where the new precursor ships where introduced like all other ships that came before.

I will start this thread as a placeholder thread for the upcoming precursor logi cruisers, which except that they look very cool, not much is known about them.

Hoboleaks just informed me about precursor remote armor repair modules, the spool up reps, as I like to call them.

The precursor remote reps come in the following variations:

  • Heavy Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer I
  • Heavy Mutadaptive Scoped Remote Armor Repairer
  • Heavy Mutadaptive Compact Remote Armor Repairer
  • Heavy Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer II
  • Perun Heavy Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer (faction)

Edit 1;
Only one spool-up remote repairer is allowed on a ship. Range seems a little short and the maximum spool up bonus is 200% or 3x 184hp at 5 second cycle time.

Edit 2:
The Zarmazd looks so damn cool OMG, you have to see this!!! She also seems a lot more ready to role now. Generous fitting and a similar signature radius to an Oneiros. She has nice thermal resistance and a glaring explosive resist hole like most Gallente ships have.
Call me excited how she will perform.

Edit 4:
So the mutadaptive remote armor repairer seem to be close to finalized and look more polished now.
However, even though they are currently listed in the medium remote armor repairer, those monstrosities belong into the large remote armor repairers list.
As of today (November 28th) the heavy mutadaptive remote armor repairers start at 448 hp armor per cycle with a 6 seconds cycle time and 512hp for the t2 one.
That’s 1280hp per cycle at full spool up or 2.5 large remote armor repairers, pretty cool huh?
But that also means that the fitting has increased to more large remote armor repairer levels with 48 cpu and 330 powergrid for the meta ones and 72 cpu and 396 powergrid for the t2 one.

The Rovida:

This one reminds me a little of the Oneiros and comes with a 4/4/6 slot layout with plenty of cpu and powergrid to work with if you treat her like an Exequror.
As soon as I get more details, I will update this.

The Zarmazd:

So here’s a nice look into the future, the Zarmazd looks like having a more Guardian like resist profile and just got another low slot, which gives it a 4/4/6 slot layout in need of a bit powergrid.

Both ships had a significant increase in drone bay size with the Zarmazd having 125m³ and 75mbit and the Rovida 50mbit and a 100m³ drone bay.
So my hope is that the drones get the Exequror drone rep bonus, which would make both ship the strongest subcapital logi so far that isn’t a sleeper boat.

If I am guessing correctly that would give the Rovida 4.5 remote reps and the Zarmazd 5.5 remote reps without the drones at full spool up - yikes.

Keep an eye out for updates and nervously chew your fingernails with me.


(techzer0) #2

not a very impressive rep amount or the fact you can only have one that has to spool up


(elitatwo) #3

Dude, I said the stats are probably not final yet and here we are.


(techzer0) #4

Dude. Now it is an impressive rep amount but still stuck with only 1 rep.
Dude. Dude.


(elitatwo) #5

And here they are:

- The Rovida

Precursor Cruiser bonuses (per skill level):

  • 12.5% bonus to Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer amount
  • 5% reduced Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer capacitor need

Role Bonus:

  • 525% bonus to Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer range
  • 100% bonus to Remote Capacitor Transfer range
  • 50% reduced Energy Neutralizer capacitor need
  • 50% reduced Smart Bomb capacitor need
  • 50% reduced Remote Capacitor Transfer capacitor need

- The Zarmazd:

Logistics Cruisers bonuses (per skill level):

  • 10% bonus to Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer amount
  • 15% reduced Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer capacitor need

Precursor Cruiser bonuses (per skill level):

  • 20% bonus to Logistic Drone transfer amount
  • 80% bonus to Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer range

Role Bonus:

  • 100% bonus Remote Capacitor Transfer range
  • 50% reduced Remote Capacitor Transfer capacitor need
  • 50% reduced Smart Bomb capacitor need
  • 50% reduced Energy Neutralizer capacitor need
  • 50% reduced Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer power need
  • 50% reduced Remote Capacitor Transfer power need

(elitatwo) #6

Just some numbers, so you have a view of how powerful that is.

The Rovida

Let’s fit a tech 2 mutadaptive remote armor repairer with the ship bonuses at level 5:

512hp + 150% + 62.5% = 2080hp / 6(seconds) = 346.66666 hp

(A large meta remote armor repairer fit Oneiros reps 300hp armor per second in comparison)

Okay let’s put the drones into action and add 70hp armor per second, which gives a total of 416.666hp per second without links or heat.
With 2x medium capacitor x-fers you also get 48.8 capacitor per second (centum a-type medium capacitor x-fer) or you fit one on a solo fit and a medium neut - lololololol…

However, with 20km optimal range for the tech 2 mutadaptive remote armor repairer, the range is a tad short for my taste.

The Zarmazd

We also fit this tech 2 mutadaptive remote armor repairer:

First things first, this Triglavian Guardian can be fit like an Oneiros or a fleet Guardian and with 2x 800mm plates that ship gets about 73k ehp.
512 + 150% + 50% = 320hp armror per second or equal to a large tech 2 remote armor repairer fit Oneiros.
Now here comes a twist, you have 75mbit drone bandwidth and 125m³ drone bay, so let’s look at those drones, shall we?

A tech 2 give the Zarmadz 40km optimal range and with the faction one 49km. The mutadaptive remote armor reps have no falloff range.

With 75mbit you can do 2x heavy armor maintenance bot II, 2x medium and 1 small one for a total of 107hp armor per second.
That gives a total of 427hp armor per second + 52.4 capacitor (corpum a-type medium cap x-fer) and a bonus for a medium neut - lol.

Edit:

Sorry for my haste, a typical 10mn afterburner fit can still fit the mutadaptive remote armor repairer and 2x large capacitor x-fers which of course give you 140.4 capacitor per second for the tech 2 capacitor transmitters and a little more ehp.


(Tellyra) #7

very nice ships, but cap transfer range 2 short. Ppl wanna 40+ km


(elitatwo) #8

Most of us would agree on that one. 15-ish km is a little too close to the action to be at.


(Captator) #9

Ok, a few things:

At points I’m going to mention a few things that aren’t a factor unless you’re moving fleets through wormholes. As these are Triglavian ships performance/mass is significantly more relevant than for the other races.

Comparing rep performance after two minutes repping the same target is meaningless, as target-switching is the name of the day vs fleets with logistics. Realistically the current iteration of the Zarmazd gets approx. 3-6 LRAR equivalent, and takes 2 minutes or so with maxed armor links to reach that peak, and this is in the limiting circumstance of being within 15km (100% range on med complex rep), outside that it’s 2-5 reps, which is, at the low end, around the ballpark of a 100mn 1600mm plated Oneiros, and the high end around a standard fit rep guardian.

The bonused drones, if t2, are equivalent to an extra LRAR, except that they’re useless for anything other than close targets because they’re so slow, and they die pretty easily. If they were significantly faster, and/or had significantly more HP, they might be reasonably factored in to repping power outside 10km.

The ships you need to compare this to are a 4 LRAR 1up/down guardian, which gets about 80-90k EHP with armor links, for 13m kg, and compare two of them to a rep nestor, which, unless your opposition is very heavily neut biased, outputs 9-10.5 LRAR stable when fed with cap, or 9+2 burst with an ancil rep, and will easily pick up 200k EHP for 25m kg, and has a load of utility mids, 400 dps from drones, and an MJD on top of all that.

Considering 2 x Zarmazd vs 1 x Rep Nestor, you win in EHP, you (opinion may vary) break even on mobility AB+MWD vs AB+MJD, you lose out in rep power for at least a minute at 10-15k, and beyond that even at max ramp, never mind that target switching within 20-30s is almost an inevitability.

I’m not considering logi T3, but roughly speaking they come somewhere between 3-4 LRAR with equivalent EHP, 100mn fit, but provide links among other powerful utility options.

Where this should be balanced, in my opinion, is the low end of competitive in repping power vs t2 empire logi at the start of its ramp, breaking even at around the 30-60s mark, and then exceeding them from that point onwards, breaking even with half a rep nestor around the 90s mark. The previous iteration, that had fitting reduction for standard LRAR and Large E-trans was about on point for this, providing the fitting for 130k EHP, the t2 mutadaptive rep, a t2 or ancil LRAR, a complex MRAR and a complex med E-trans, while fitting mwd/ab/med battery/sebo in mids.


(elitatwo) #10

Sorry for the delay, wasn’t home and don’t get me wrong, I am not trying to undermine any of your experiences flying logi yourself or a group of people who bring logi and discussing and optimizing your fleet fits on comms.

I tried to only bring you the earliest possible information that hoboleaks would allow.

The second more information came along, I did my due diligence and simulated some possible ways to fit this ship with those special bonuses and the most out of all bonuses without having to go back and fit different.

What hoboleaks does not do is giving any hint on what the design goal or intentions for those ships was.

When I made my latest change to the post, I figured that with that kind of cap feeding possible - maybe not feasible but I am brainstorming experimental fits which will change over time and most certainly the first time I can undock them; a fleet setup would be possible.

What I didn’t say and trying to avoid is give you information bias is that a fleet fit would not make sense since the cap transfer range is way too close for the action to be of any help.

However imagine you are the only logi pilot with 4-5 buddies you swore to protect and bring back home to your loved ones safe and sound.

Imagine further that for 90% of the sum of all your logi effort was focus-logi on one of your buddies at any given time.
You may even had a similar experience yourself or heard of it.

Two ways to fit those Triglevian logi is to use the cap transfer bonus or use one or two of the other ship bonuses which also stand out, no?

Say you and your buddies had many glorious victories and are on your way back to your loved ones to tell them of those glorious deeds.
3 or 4 of the glorious 5 don’t have any cap booster charges left and the loot was not what you hoped, so you run on little to no cap but you need cap for this last brave staggler whom thought he could.
You all are in good health but that doode is neuting you in a last attempt to flee and fight another day.
In this perfect example of how thing go wrong in EVE, you logi is not in immediate danger and closes in and feeds you that one last drop you need for victory.

In another situation where things are a lot for drone heavy and dire for all of you, you are so glad that you put your 3 medium smartbombs with you to take care of that swarm of ecm drones once and for all.

Different but not less dire situation, you are fighting this one ship that does not want to give up and gives you are really hard time but none of the ships you are flying that glorious day has any utility high slots to fit utility module or salvager (what??).
If only one of you glorious ones had a bonus for that one module that neutralizes all threats than any other and your brave logi pilot comes and saves the day and glory with the 3x medium neuts he said you would need at some point.

Anyhow, just wanted to showcase something different than “we bring unkillable blobb to almost bring glory and shoot one boat” - because we are so gudddh at pppppppppvp that we always self-destruct whenever to need to fly to another system by ourselves without that unkillable blobbh of not guddh pppppppppppvpers.


(Alphaphi) #11

So ive been playing around with some fits for this on sisi, and looking stats through etc.

And it honestly seems like its gonna be a fairly unique and different to fly (zarmazd).

It’s the Logi with one of the (if not the) longest RR range, with no falloff, meaning that it essentially could be used as a backseat logi/kitey logi.
it has utility slots that allows for a bonused smartbomb to fend off drone.
After playing around in PYFA, i can say that it’s the logi that allows for the most tank (63k ehp capless tank on my non-armor optimized char on sisi, still one low left for tank if you dont want the cap mod).

The Remote cap has a underwhelming range though, but it should be more seen as an aid or utlity than a tool for capchaining with this ship.
Possibly for close-orbit tinkering with a vedmak/leshak that has an RR in the utility slot.

The fit i have created to far are cap stable with everything running (@5%), and if you run the mids and repper its stable @50% (has two medium remote cap transfers in the highs).

Sits @ 63k EHP capless (1600mm + energized platings) non-bling tank on a char W/O armor comp. skills.
Can easily use C-type energized specific membranes for additional EHP (they only cost 500k more than the t2 variant, for 4% more resists).
A zarmazd with all tank lows, and c-type specific membranes would sit @ 75k EHP, cap stable @ 30% with all but the remote caps running, receiving no remote cap itself.

it seems a bit oneirosy with more utility.

Fit idea so far:
[Zarmazd, Honk Honk]
LOWS:
1600mm Steel Plates II
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Thermal Membrane II
Capacitor Power Relay II
MEDS:
10MN Afterburner II
Republic Fleet Medium Cap Battery
Republic Fleet Medium Cap Battery
Sensor Booster II
HIGHS
Heavy Mutadaptive Remote Armor Repairer II
Medium Remote Capacitor Transmitter II
Medium Remote Capacitor Transmitter II
Domination Small Proton Smartbomb
RIGS
Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Trimark Armor Pump II

TL;DR
It’s gonna be awesome, and im hyped.


(elitatwo) #12

Okay everyone, I was finally able to log on earlier today and here are the remote repair values in hp per second for each ship, each without links or heat.

The Rovida with a tech 2 mutadaptive remote armor repairer:

  • Optimal range is 75km, no falloff
  • 346.6666hp per second +70hp in case you use fully level 5 trained logi drones

That is close to what an Exequror with 3x Corelum a-type medium remote armor repairers and 5x medium tech 2 logi drones can rep per second

Another comparison, an Oneiros with 4x tech 1 large remote reps repairs 300hp per second.

The Zarmazd:

This one has a tad less optimal range and with only 72km optimal range will almost be difficult to handle (I had to…).
Joking aside, here are the values without the drones, links or heat:

  • 72km optimal range with the tech2 mutadaptive remote armor repairer
  • 426.666hp per second (+107hp with the 75m³ drone bandwidth)

If we look at an Oneiros with 4x large tech 2 remote reps, we get “only” what the Rovida does or 341.33hp per second without drones, links or heat, so that’s 80hp per second more at full spool-up.

If we take the Legion with 6x Centum a-type medium remote reps, links, the implant and heat we get 610hp per second for a maximum of 2-ish minutes before you start offlining modules.

533hp per second without even trying is not really bad at all.

The reason I don’t mention the faction remote rep is that other than the 3km more optimal range and more heat resistance, the almost twice as much powergrid requirement doesn’t warrant gimping my current fits to squeeze than one on. Maybe I find a dual fit that can have it on in the next weeks or so, time will tell.