They should move to sov null then, hisec is clearly not for them.
Why are new players not hanging around? The starting missions make me DRY - they need to make new players MOIST with exciting, sexier missions.
Some of the missions I scratched my head as to why I was being asked to do the mission. Story wise they dont make much sense and what they taught was limited.
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The career tutorials are really bad, most of them don’t make sense and ask you to do things that are not explained at all. they assume you have prior knowledge which being new is simply not the case. Only once I did my 3rd set of career tutorials did it become easy and “obvious” but for the first two times I needed to read guides and find YT tutorials… for the tutorials. Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem doing so ('m a rare breed like that) but I can easily see how that would be a massive turn-off for most people.
I want a ship like an ice cream cone van in space with music
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Or just revamp missions all together with more challenging NPCs that cannot be killed while being AFK and rewards that are ASSETS or LP and NOT inflationatory ISK deposits. Missions in their current state are trash content that undermine the health of the game and encourage toxic gameplay (solo PvEing and hording wealth without contributing to the multiplayer aspect of the game). Eve should not be catering to the isolationist isk hoarders no matter how much $$ they throw at the game.
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Let them hoard, as long as they can still be killed.
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In all honestly I doubt that will be the case for much longer.
High sec needs some serious remastering, by someone with some real vision. Missions, Concord, wars, sites, ganking, mining… all of it. It shouldn’t be safe, but it also shouldn’t be bland and predictable, either.
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Never wanted to play an MMO before Eve. Heard that they were grindy, watered-down experiences in order to keep players from burning through the content, and just thought of them as inferior to well-crafted, single-player games (and it probably didn’t help that I was an introvert, and wasn’t exactly chomping at the bit to play with rando’s). For example, I loved KotOR 1 and 2, but had no desire to play the Old Republic MMO. But, I kept reading gaming articles about Eve’s PvP centric nature, emergent gameplay, massive battles, and brutal difficulty. Eventually, I decided to check it out.
I don’t know what the average new player wants, but I think a major problem is that the game tends to funnel new players into PvE (especially mining and missioning). Then players get bored and leave. Things have gotten better thanks to the agency, but things are still heavily biased towards helping players get into PvE, and not PvP. The thing is, I doubt most players decided to try the game because Eve is renowned for its PvE. Most of them probably decided to play it because they kept hearing about its PvP.
Older players have different priorities and values. Thus, CCP has to balance bug fixes, balance, and new features in order to keep as many of them as happy as possible.
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I think it’s because CCP knows that there are hundreds of corporations willing to teach PvP while PvE is easier to grasp yet the new player needs to learn the basics of the game first and PvE is a good way to learn and having missions is a good way to teach.
As for the basics of PvP… Try to hold a new player’s attention with those, lol. And what kind of activity could CCP introduce for PvP besides the ones we have now?
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i am a new player , i do not want to be dragged in null sec to fight your wars , i do not pay so i can play the game like you want , i play my game , stop harassing me with recruitment mails , i will not buy plex with cash so i can inject my character for capital ship, buy capital ship so you can have your war.
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Well, I don’t think the game needs to teach players how to become experts at PvP. However, (1) it could probably provide better learning opportunities, and (2) should provide them with PvP opportunities that are catered towards them.
Learning Opportunities
TL:DR- I’ve seen videos about game design in which people praise how the game teaches its fundamentals without ever using big ass dialogue boxes, manuals, and stuff like that. CCP should try to to do more of this -i.e. implement game design that teaches players through actually playing the game.
I believe that there are at least 3 distinct ways to learn in Eve (1) Personal Experience (yolo in and learn from your mistakes), (2) Community Knowledge (join a group, and absorb information in an informal setting), and (3) Community Resources (Formal classes, lectures, videos, articles, wiki’s, practicals, etcetera). Different methods have different advantages and disadvantages, and different players will have different preferences for how they want to learn.
Now, the community already has 2 and 3 covered, but isn’t in the best position to help with 1. Yes, they can fleet up with newbros (like in incursions or invasions), but I believe that this is best addressed through a game design perspective. Thus, I don’t think CCP should be in the business of making tutorial videos, but in designing content that will help teach players through experience. For example, there is big difference between the experiences, tactics, and fittings used in PvE and PvP. So, you might think that PvE can’t be used to teach PvP. However, CCP has introduced PvE experiences that are more similar to PvP than others (i.e. anomic missions require careful heat, cap, and rep management in order to succeed, and diamond rat AI is a little less dumb). Thus, I don’t think that it’s impossible to design PvE that can help teach PvP fundamentals. For example, you could design some content that is challenging to newbros (but that does not require expensive fits), and design the rats in a way that require PvP fittings and strats (i.e. rats will try to warp out if they are about to die, thus you need to fit tackle). I could go on, but this is turning into a wall of text.
PvP Opportunities
I’m sure that there are many options, but one thing that I’ve heard and liked is the introduction of a begginer plex (below novice), that only allows T1 frigs (no pirate frigs).
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Recruitment mail is a minor annoyance. Just right-click on it and choose delete.
You’ll continue to get those mail until you find a corporation, preferably one who doesn’t plan on exploiting you. There aren’t many out there but they do exist.
Another option is to create your own corporation. Since you’re Omega you can train 25min and do it. Plenty of one-man corps out there too.
You may still get Recruitment mail even then but they’ll be less frequent.
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Those are enough of a challenge to get a small taste of what PvP is. Do we need more?
CCP could do exactly that with the higher-level missions. I don’t think they need to come up with a new system to train pilots. They only need to upgrade the Missions.
Would be nicer if they hired a couple voice actors for the walls of text pertaining to those missions. A week of narrating mission objectives is all it would take.
I’m not sure were on the same page here. I thought we were talking about newbros, and diamond rats and anomic missions aren’t exactly newbro friendly. Plus, I brought these examples merely to demonstrate that PvE content can be designed in ways that teach PvP fundamentals, and not because I thought they did an exceptional job at it.
Yeah, and we definitely have different values and priorities when it comes to developer resources. I’m not saying that voice acting and mission polish is a bad thing, but it’s certainly not what I would prioritize.
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Maybe they’re not, but don’t you think a newbro needs to be able to complete those missions before fancying himself a PvPer?
Can PvE missions be able to train someone for PvP, isn’t that what you’re talking about?
Yes, and I think that Missions can do that if CCP wants to take the time to revamp them.
They could do better, that’s for sure.
I don’t think CCP needs to do all this though:
I never said it was a priority, I said
Some tutorials that encouraged interaction with REAL human players would be good - A new player could be asked to deliver an item to a REAL player or a real player owned company. Maybe a group of players sign up to be included in tutorials? Brothers of EVE lets call them - real players that can be included in tutorials - it might be as simple as an interaction when delivering a tutorial. Even just a chance for interaction would be good - therefore helping cement relationships and let new players see there is more than solo play.
A bit of role playing from the Bros of Eve could go a long way.
There can still be all the A.I. tutorrials but at least one early on that helps show theses little boxes flying around are real people.
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Thank you for your feedback
I think it worthy of including retention of players as well as attracting new players
Great question. So few answers.
WH space was such a success, how about a new 2021 world for Eve? It could be a battlefield of alien invaders who want to kill all the Eve entities: players, NPCs, trigs, bots and all those crusty vets. I personally avoid faction battles because (right or wrong) I don’t want to screw up my standings or lose precious ships.
Perhaps two or three entities from deep space converge on Eve, trying to wipe out everyone or find allies to help beat their deep space rivals. This could provide roles for new players who would gain experience while fighting or playing along side the crusty vets. In war, the military doesn’t make you pay for the ship you just lost. Returning to Eve proper, newer players would have gained experience without the frustration of being shot by their neighbor because he/she had nothing better to do. Standings are unaffected but maybe you bring back some new technology or something that makes your ship a little better. Maybe the technology isn’t just a better way to blow up a mining barge. Maybe you formed a relationship with an otherworld entity that will trade items of interest. Maybe my alien foxhole buddy will comeback and help me defend my POS against the raving lunatic quantum core suckers.
Factions within the deep space entities might compete for relationships with entities or factions in Eve. Maybe put some ice in the deep space worlds and close down the complaints here. A story can be woven here. Maybe give the roles of the deep space entities to the crusty vet faction. Point is, its a universe where noobs aren’t just for breakfast anymore we/they can travel back and forth like WH space. And in time, the noob retention might be better because the leaning curve is not such a circus.
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That’s one of the core problems with retention. But it’s hard, very hard to address properly. Personally I was educating myself in PvP while venturing the usual highsec paths, and it took me 6 months to the point where I actually got it.
PvP in EvE is all about strategic thinking and applying non-obvious tactics. Knowledge and RL skill is key. A fight is 90% of the time decided before the actual engagement. Just always going yolo, brings you nowhere.
How do you teach that?
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