What makes EVE feel like a joke of a game to you

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Alpha_Slow

You really expect everyone to come on the forums and learn about everything that can kill them before they play?

No, I expect them to use any measure of research or experience to try something and should they fail, attempt to figure out why, be it via reading online resources, learning from what they observe, or asking other players a few questions.

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Auto-da-fe

First the Chess analogy. Chess is a game where two opponents are given completely equal material.

@Auto-da-fe

And, not only that, but chess is game that cannot be played until both players understand the rules!

@Auto-da-fe

If you lose material in Chess, or fall behind, you can rest assured that it was 100% your error(s). Whatever those errors happen to be

You seem to be posting these statements in an effort to dismiss the analogy, but they all apply to Eve just as much as chess.

@Auto-da-fe

Awoxing is now a Bannable offense.

This is genuinely news to me. Do you have a link to a Dev post/article?

@Auto-da-fe

There is NO LIMIT to the amount a solo/single player can lose, but the items of major corps and alliances are being protected from being lost when a Citadel goes pop.

This also also news to me. Source?

@Auto-da-fe

The “Faction standing” system, the “Concord” system, the “Tutorial” and the “Career Agents” all mislead and misinform players. They DO NOT teach players what EVE Online is about or like.

Omission is not the same as misdirection. That said, more effort to inform newbies of the pervasion of PvP in EVE would be a good thing IMO.

@Auto-da-fe

Attempting to take DEFENSIVE actions are heavily punished by EVE Online mechanics (ie … The Warp Core Stabilizer, etc)

Because those modules are significantly more powerful than any offensive module.

@Auto-da-fe

the Auto-Pilot is designed to give gankers time to scan you, determine your worth, and gank you.

Auto-pilot is almost universally despised. I too, dislike it’s prominence in the tutorials and on the UI, suggesting it should be a commonly used feature.

@Auto-da-fe

Other mechanics in the game, which the player is outright LIED to about are there to give gankers time to gank you, like Ships NOT jumping through a gate when they are in range and the jump button has been pressed several times

This is called lag. There is precisely sweet FA CCP or any Dev can do about players with weak connections or for people connecting from half a world away.

@Auto-da-fe

it is pretty much an established fact that calling EVE Online a “PVP” game is, as the title of the thread states, the most laughable thing ever!!!

There are people that think EVE is not a PvP game? What?

[Jonah_Gravenstein]

@Alpha_Slow

Nobody does that to me

I find that extremely hard to believe, unless of course you keep your mouth shut in real life because somebody may decide to shut it for you.

[Alpha_Slow]

The differences in concord reaction times isn’t something that is easily observed unless you are already doing suicide ganking. Without a doubt, it is trash game design for not informing the player considering the potential for devastating losses.

I’ve seen you here clowning yourself before. You sure do try hard.

[Jonah_Gravenstein]

I don’t live on the forums, I work for a living.

Try harder scrub.

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Alpha_Slow

The differences in concord reaction times isn’t something that is easily observed unless you are already doing suicide ganking.

Do you need to know specific details? Surely it’s enough to observe that you CAN die to other players in HiSec. From that, you can deduce that you should fit a buffer tank and not overinvest in any one ship. Getting into details helps you eek out the most profit from your investment, particularly for hauliers, but the basic survival rule is pretty easy to figure out without any in-deptj research.

[Auto-da-fe]

Sorry.
but, your entire response is just patent nonsense. Its Lag. Warp corp stabilizier is 10zillion times more powerful than a warp-scrambler, webifier, and ecm combined! Omission and Misdirection are different! CCP doesn’t approve of AWOXing, golly-geepers, I’ve never heard of that!

the Chess analogy does NOT apply to EVE Online.
In Chess two opponents face off with completely equal material.
In EVE Online, 12 cheap, disposable ships with no value whatsoever will face off with a single multi-billion ISK ship. Where’s the equality? 12 cheap, disposable ships with no value whatsoever will destroy the multi-billion ISk ship in the blink of an eye.

In Chess you cannot begin to play until you know the rules.
In EVE Online, EVE Online misleads and misinforms you constantly.
How’s the analogy apply???

In Chess if you lose material it is due to your errors.
In EVE Online the game is designed to put you at a disadvantage.

Oh yeah. On the “Its Lag” babble. this demonstrates that you are just babbling. The official CCP response, to an issue that numerous players have complained about for years is: “We can’t duplicate this on any of our machines.” So, it doesn’t exist. Even in the absence of evidence of it, which based completely on CCP decisions and performance (I’m looking at you “Bounty System”) is in no way believable, a solution to this problem can easily be implemented. But, they do NOT. because they do not want to.

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Auto-da-fe

the Chess analogy does NOT apply to EVE Online.

In Chess two opponents face off with completely equal material.

So if you mine an asteroid with 500m3 veldspar, you get 500m3 veldspar. If I mine it, do I get 450m3? Oh, we get the same amount? Shocking.

If you sell a billion ISK marauder on the market, do you get -1% tax from CCP? No? I guess we’re the same, then.

We have the same opportunities. No part of the game is locked off from us or just treats us differently.

@Auto-da-fe

In Chess you cannot begin to play until you know the rules.

In EVE Online, EVE Online misleads and misinforms you constantly.

How’s the analogy apply???

The NPE could be better, but misinforms? Where?

[quote=“Auto-da-fe, post:301, topic:54796”]
In Chess if you lose material it is due to your errors.[/quote]
Explain the difference. If I lose a ship in EVE, or if I’m an FC and my fleet whelps, I guarantee you I made a mistake - probably several. Just as in chess, if I lose a piece, it’s because my opponent out-played me.

@Auto-da-fe

In EVE Online the game is designed to put you at a disadvantage.

As someone not wanting to fight? No, the advantage is yours. The enemy can not do you any harm until you make a mistake.

@Auto-da-fe

Oh yeah. On the “Its Lag” babble. this demonstrates that you are just babbling. The official CCP response, to an issue that numerous players have complained about for years is: “We can’t duplicate this on any of our machines.” So, it doesn’t exist.

Did…did you just deny the existence of latency? You genuinely think we all sit on lossless <1ms connections to tranquility?

I’m impressed.

[Auto-da-fe]

I didn’t mention “latency.” I cited the Official CCP response. They cannot duplicate this on any of their machines.
Where in that do you see a “denial of the existence of latency”???

This is, otherwise known as, a Strawman argument. Please, Google Strawman Argument.

And, as for the rest of your “out of context quotations”, I won’t bother responding to them, because, I don’t want to repeat myself.

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Auto-da-fe

I didn’t mention “latency.” I cited the Official CCP response. They cannot duplicate this on any of their machines.

Where in that do you see a “denial of the existence of latency”???

Oh yeah. On the “Its Lag” babble. this demonstrates that you are just babbling. The official CCP response, to an issue that numerous players have complained about for years is: “We can’t duplicate this on any of our machines.” So, it doesn’t exist.

You said it doesn’t exist. No quotation marks, no source. Ergo, it comes from you.

[Auto-da-fe]

ergo, you’ve learned to read things out of context.

I use English. proper english. the English that makes English professors feel shame. I use complete sentences and paragraphs. my paragraphs are well constructed.

please, re-take English 101.

[Hiasa_Kite]

Actually, the confusion arose precisely because you didn’t use proper English. You relied heavily on sarcasm to convey a point with no other markers that it wasn’t the point you were trying to make.

Move the goal posts all you want, but you need to learn how to convey your thoughts properly before criticising others.

[Auto-da-fe]

@Auto-da-fe

Other mechanics in the game, which the player is outright LIED to about are there to give gankers time to gank you, like Ships NOT jumping through a gate when they are in range and the jump button has been pressed several times!

@Hiasa_Kite

This is called lag. There is precisely sweet FA CCP or any Dev can do about players with weak connections or for people connecting from half a world away.

@Auto-da-fe

Oh yeah. On the “Its Lag” babble. this demonstrates that you are just babbling. The official CCP response, to an issue that numerous players have complained about for years is: “We can’t duplicate this on any of our machines.” So, it doesn’t exist. Even in the absence of evidence of it, which based completely on CCP decisions and performance (I’m looking at you “Bounty System”) is in no way believable, a solution to this problem can easily be implemented. But, they do NOT. because they do not want to.

@Hiasa_Kite

Did…did you just deny the existence of latency? You genuinely think we all sit on lossless <1ms connections to tranquility?

@Auto-da-fe

I didn’t mention “latency.” I cited the Official CCP response. They cannot duplicate this on any of their machines.

Where in that do you see a “denial of the existence of latency”???

This is, otherwise known as, a Strawman argument. Please, Google Strawman Argument.

And, as for the rest of your “out of context quotations”, I won’t bother responding to them, because, I don’t want to repeat myself.

Try again.

[Hiasa_Kite]

@Auto-da-fe

Other mechanics in the game, which the player is outright LIED to about are there to give gankers time to gank you, like Ships NOT jumping through a gate when they are in range and the jump button has been pressed several times!

@Hiasa Kite

This is called lag. There is precisely sweet FA CCP or any Dev can do about players with weak connections or for people connecting from half a world away.

@Auto-da-fe

Oh yeah. On the “Its Lag” babble. this demonstrates that you are just babbling. The official CCP response, to an issue that numerous players have complained about for years is: “We can’t duplicate this on any of our machines.” So, it doesn’t exist. Even in the absence of evidence of it, which based completely on CCP decisions and performance (I’m looking at you “Bounty System”) is in no way believable, a solution to this problem can easily be implemented. But, they do NOT. because they do not want to.

@Hiasa Kite

Did…did you just deny the existence of latency? You genuinely think we all sit on lossless <1ms connections to tranquility?

@Auto-da-fe

I didn’t mention “latency.” I cited the Official CCP response. They cannot duplicate this on any of their machines.

Where in that do you see a “denial of the existence of latency”???

This is, otherwise known as, a Strawman argument. Please, Google Strawman Argument.

And, as for the rest of your “out of context quotations”, I won’t bother responding to them, because, I don’t want to repeat myself.

Thank you.

[Remiel_Pollard]

@Auto-da-fe

Warp corp stabilizier is 10zillion times more powerful than a warp-scrambler, webifier, and ecm combined!

And yet, I can still stop a ship that has all it’s lows fit with them.

I’ve read your essays. I no longer have time for your attempts to tell us what EVE is. Us, who have been playing it for a lot longer than you, who have helped more newbs to learn the game than you’ve probably even talked to. You’ve got nothing here, buddy.

The chess analogy wasn’t about the competition, it was about the rules. The rules of the game are rules you cannot break, you have to work within their bounds. The balance difference between chess and EVE don’t make one lick of difference when it comes to adapting to the rules of the game. In fact, they make it even more pertinent.

Bottom line: adapt or die. That’s the same for every game ever.

[Pix_Severus]

Isn’t it about time these troll alts were banned again?

[Ramona_McCandless]

@Auto-da-fe

Where is the ‘tutorial’ or ‘career agent’ that teaches players that “ISK DOUBLING” is a scam???

You are presumably the person for whom “Hot Surface” signs on cookers are supposed to protect.

@Auto-da-fe

I use English. proper english. the English that makes English professors feel shame. I use complete sentences and paragraphs. my paragraphs are well constructed.

Yet that explaining paragraph is full of sentence fragments and misapplied inconsistant capitalisation.

If you fly like you use english, no wonder the game is too hard for you.

[Auto-da-fe]

@Remiel_Pollard

Who’s giving anyone a false sense of security? People who don’t read up on EVE before diving into it, skipping the tutorials, and then dying to a suicide gank in high sec or losing all their stuff to a scam literally have only themselves to blame for not learning the game before getting that really expensive stuff in the first place. The information is there, and not hard to find

@Auto-da-fe

EVE Online completely misleads and misinforms the player. From the moment you encounter “EVE Online” the MARKETING is misleading you and misinforming you. The “Faction Standing” system, the “Concord” system, the “Tutorials” and the “Career Agents” are ALL actively misleading and misinforming the player. NONE of these things teach the player about what EVE Online consists of, Gate-Camping, Suicide-Ganking. Where is the EVE Online ‘tutorial’ or ‘career agent’ that teaches a player how to Gate-Camp??? Where is the Eve Online tutorial or career agent that teaches a player how to Suicide-Gank a mining ship??? Where is the ‘tutorial’ or ‘career agent’ that teaches players that “ISK DOUBLING” is a scam??? OR that the EVE Online interface can be manipulated to SCAM you???

Where is the Marketing Campaign that says: “HEY! DO YOU LIKE GRIEFING AND GANKING HELPLESS VICTIMS?! THEN, BOI, HAVE WE GOT THE GAME FOR YOU!!!”

@Remiel_Pollard

Sorry, but the rook does not move diagonally in a game of chess, and you don’t get to demand it does just because you ran out of bishops.

@Remiel_Pollard

The chess analogy wasn’t about the competition, it was about the rules. The rules of the game are rules you cannot break, you have to work within their bounds.

@Auto-da-fe

In Chess you cannot begin to play until you know the rules.

In EVE Online, EVE Online misleads and misinforms you constantly.

How’s the analogy apply???

@Auto-da-fe

First the Chess analogy. Chess is a game where two opponents are given completely equal material. And, not only that, but chess is game that cannot be played until both players understand the rules! Chess necessitates that understanding before you can play it. If you lose material in Chess, or fall behind, you can rest assured that it was 100% your error(s). Whatever those errors happen to be.

EVE Online completely misleads and misinforms the player.

I did NOT fail to understand what was said, I have repeatedly addressed the difference between Chess and EVE Online as regards RULES. In Chess Both players are informed of the Rules. EVE Online actively, perhaps “AGGRESSIVELY” is the better word, misinforms and misleads players.

[Ramona_McCandless]

Anyone here play soccer? When you were given the big book of rules before you first played, how did it explain the offside rule?

[Remiel_Pollard]

@Auto-da-fe

I did NOT fail to understand what was said, I have repeatedly addressed the difference between Chess and EVE Online as regards RULES. In Chess Both players are informed of the Rules. EVE Online actively, perhaps “AGGRESSIVELY” is the better word, misinforms and misleads players.

Yes, you did. Whether you know the rules in advance is irrelevant to whether or not you can break them.

You’re right about EVE, though, after a fashion. EVE doesn’t ‘aggressively’ do anything, but passively, by proxy of not holding your hand, it throws you in the deep end, and you’re expected to sink or swim.

You call it bad game design, everyone who’s been playing it for more than a few months calls it ‘working as intended’, and I suggest if you struggle with that concept, you try something else. Maybe something easy, made by EA, with tool tips for literally everything. Because this game encourages thinking for yourself, and outside the box. If you’d rather be lead around like cattle, and have your hand held, there are a thousand games out there that do this already. In this game, you learn from experience. You lose something, and as a result, you learn how not to lose it. Then you lose something else, and learn another lesson from it.

You’re right that a lot of EVE’s rules are unwritten, but you’re wrong that it’s a problem. That’s part of what makes it what it is. I always try to help people that are willing to learn those rules. You want to change them. I’m here to tell you that you can’t move a rook diagonally, and you don’t get to change the rules when you run out of bishops. Whether you like the analogy or not, it applies. Let me simplify it though, for the simple minded.

Adapt, or die.