Where does it say that the pilots are still rare. The ships are not rare, ergo the pilots that they are intended for, can’t be rare either. The lore is past tense. The game has moved 15 real years from the lore.
This is irrelevent in the discussion of a feature addition to an extant game - which can safely be described as minor, because there are 4 examples of that feature already. We’ve also established that you do not know how much the feature would cost, therefore the adjective expensive is not something you personally can justify. You just do not know.
Welcome to nullsec, where blood raiders have havens, serpentis have havens, gurista have havens, sansha have havens, and they all spawn the same sequences. Can’t tell me that the ded 5s werent all cut and paste from each other either.
The game is a giant pile of cut and paste. Virtually the entire blood loot table is a cut and paste of sansha. The’ve even had drop tables that had the wrong loot table cut and paste into them, and those kind of mistakes stood for years!
This is exactly such a feature.
You have no idea whether it appeals to other players or not. You just seem remarkably determined to call it a bad idea because it doesn’t appeal to you.
This absolutely does not make you qualified to tell me what is an expensive feature to develop for EVE. This is just a false authority argument you can’t recognize yourself because you are the false authority.
this is perfectly acceptable for this feature. In fact if Mr leveling my Raven can’t figure out how to make this work, its probably hit its target difficulty.
I have undocked an incursus enough times from serpentis prime to run low level missions there to know what is like. in fact I’d personally hope that the system would fill up with griefers, because when I did it, there was one covops (uncloaked) called I see you, some combat probes, but i was never actually personally shot at or probed down.
It doesn’t actually matter, missions are wrecks, things to do, bounties and LP. its also a social game, so I imagine that someone will arise who sells the conversion for them (at various degrees of slave labor awful).
There are people in highsec who will market your LP.
To me it feels like you want the game developers to solve many things that players would solve.
They don’t have to do any of that. All they need do is turn off the tutorial for these characters. Its hard mode.
Done it, made a character called kolada a few months ago. Turn it all off, not needed for hard mode. All irrelevant. Tutorial starts when you undock and another player shoots you, which you should understand, being an experienced player.
its not debate when you put words into my sentences. I haven’t said any of that, so don’t write this stuff.
Out of the general population people compatible with capsule tech are still relatively rare. That’s why absolutely every ship for the various Navies isn’t commanded by a Capsuleer. The ships are no longer rare because the Capsuleer economy as a whole is as large or larger than that of any of the Empires in lore. In short we’re rich so people build things for us.
It’s not, and this feature isn’t minor.
Also not knowing exactly how much a feature is going to cost isn’t the same thing as not having any idea about the cost. You have no idea about the cost, I have a fairly well educated estimate. CCP can certainly get a better estimate but even that would still be an estimate. For IT projects exact numbers are something you get after you’re done.
Those actually aren’t all cut and paste. The general structure is the same but the ships aren’t and the spawns and value between the five major rat types are slightly different.
Also just because you can get away with copying small parts of one feature or piece of content doesn’t mean that works for all features or all content. You’re drawing equivalency here between two things that aren’t at all equivalent.
It’s not, it’s even more niche with even smaller appeal than any feature I can think of that CCP has added in recent memory. Even Factional Warfare has significant impact on the wider game and economy beyond those playing in it. What you’re talking about would specifically have a smaller impact by trying to prevent people from paying to get through it easier.
Not for sure, no, but I’ve at least been able to cite other examples (which you’ve agreed with) and explain my logic here. Generally speaking, with what we know about game players as a whole, this wouldn’t be a hugely popular feature and there’s no particular reason to believe Eve players are going to deviate from this example.
It really kinda does. You’re just lashing out because you apparently really want this and don’t know enough to make any kind of educated estimate on time required yourself.
End of the day though I’m not the one you have to convince, it’s CCP, and so far you’re not presenting a terribly convincing argument here. You can’t even poke holes in my logic or counter the small pieces of evidence I do have, so you’ve resorted to assuming it’s inaccurate or dismissing it out of hand without any actual reason to do so.
the lore stopped -years- before the game we play now. Its all written past tense. I can’t repeat this enough for you. Even the actual text saying capsuleers were rare was written past tense when the game was new. not only that you are simultaneously complaining that these should be rare, and won’t be played much ie they’d still be rare.
You don’t have the remotest idea what it will cost and yes the feature is minor, its extra versions of something that already exists.
The spawns predate the anomolies, they were cut and paste into them from belt rats. You really aren’t making this case at all here.
You are making a massive mountain out of an extremely minor issue, ie that some extra rats are needed in a few constellations. Game is full of hundreds of rat types, and the required types already exist in the database.
Which is my personal preference for the way the feature could work, and not a deal breaker for me. Again you seem to be making a mountain out of my personal preference for how the feature should work.
To be honest, the take up of diablo hardcore was extremely good for an optional feature of more difficulty, and yes I played that mode, and when rift times became the denominator of performance I was only ever interested in hardcore results.
No, I’d like the feature, but as I’ve pointed out, I already know how to simulate the feature for myself. You’ve dedicated an extraordinary amount of time to trying to kill off even any discussion of the idea. and yes, you are literally a false authority on the costs of developing this for EVE, you have no idea what it would cost.
I’d actually just like to discuss the feature with other players that were interested in the idea, instead of having you spam the thread to death with negativity and unsupported rubbish, like the you are a programmer, therefore you know what it costs crap.
thank you for pointing out his modus operandi and why i usually just ignore him.
the idea is great, but it’s not liked by mostlycarebears, because it’s not carebearish. we should make this a thing, it would help the game dramatically.
True noobs starting in LS/NS would get completely wrecked.
They can barely figure out how to warp, let alone understand sector security mechanics.
If you want to roleplay as a pirate faction member, setup a corp with an appropriate name, run their missions, farm their LP, fly their ships, explode all interlopers and by all means go populate NPC NS (which sorely needs it).
Unfortunately since the anoms/sigs in npc pirate space are manned by them, you sort of shoot yourself in the foot interms of PvE content to run.
thank you for declaring everyone a stupid victim from day one and for showing that you do not look at bigger pictures, including the fact that lowsec residents will well be aware of how valuable these new players are.
Life Pro Tip for your consideration: things don’t happen in isolation and the rookie system would be flooded with people wanting to get the noobs to join them. there won’t be hundreds of them sitting there camping the gate viciously waiting for a noob to gank. that’s just carebear think and it’s both nonsensical, and irrational.
Im not saying true new players are stupid, just completely clueless, inexperienced and uninformed.
I did a lot of research on EVE before starting and have decades of experience in gaming and even for me it took time to learn even the basics. Dont underestimate the EVE learning curve.
Nothing prevents a new player from moving to LS or NS whenever they want.
I dont see any reason for LS/NS starting points.
As to corps being newbie friendly and actively recruiting/training them, that is great. By all means.
Though there is something preventing them, which is the idea that they should be doing what’s laid out for them by CCP. As you say, they’re clueless, therefore they won’t go to lows3c immediately and on their ways there will be many people telling them lies about how bad lowsec is.
Discussions about this are actually silly. having the option to start in lowsec, blind, on your own, definitely adds to the game. given it should definitely be an option for those willing to play the game as formerly advertised, and no one can tell me that it’s bound to fail, because over a decade of people had it much worse and still succeeded.
it’s going to take me days to write a proper request about this… hm…
Because of all the things you are completely missing, because you’re not going through it in your head, with a blank state. You’re approaching this logically, but not in mind with actual humans experiencing it.
I don’t have time for this, so i keep it short.
First impressions matter and shape future decisions. People who start, and go through what’s laid out by CCP, will more likely keep doing whatever they found fun, or worthwhile.
On their way into the early game, lots of carebears will tell noobs that lowsec is an instant deathtrap, which is a lie, but the noobs get influenced by this.
It’s a completely different experience, because when you start regularly, you deliberately have to make the decision to go where it’s dangerous and unprotected (which, at any point post joining, is already a thought in their head one way or another), which takes a huge leap for most common folk. That leap, though, doesn’t necessarily mean they’re not fit for it. It simply means that CCP has different plans for what they want most people to do.
That’s a lie when you say that statement is a lie. What you’re doing is promoting a fallacy as factual truth, something that’s constantly done by Kill Mail whores and griefer players looking for easy kills.
It would be a new character (which is not a new player) reliably launched into a system where griefers would be both allowed to grief new characters and likely be there to do it.
The reward is owning a character of a race/bloodline that is not trivial to own. Its also putting forward that the observation that I enjoy this character more than my 90m sp character, because I have to optimize against its unique state - ie EVE is fun to start again, its fun to look forward to 2 skills since yesterday. I work my way through a new hull every month or so as the skills fill out, and that process is more enjoyable than deliberately downshipping the old character. Appreciate the results of tieracide, learned a lot more about pvp with a lot more ship classes, both ones I can fly and ones that can spank the ones I can fly.
If you take a random corvette on a fresh character into low/null its just a corvette scout as far as everyone else is concerned and is cloaked by apathy with respects to bothering to shoot it.
There is lots of ideas that could fill out the game experience - ie I’d like to lock them out from injectors but have them have bosted / reduced SP gain on other criteria, or perhaps even tasks, so that they can’t just permanently escape their heritage.
This is incorrect, there is lore for the discovery of Sleepers, the Sleeper Tech, the Solider tech that went into Dust, as well as various current events that have happened in the cluster.
Go read some of the actual lore and this will become blatantly apparent quite quickly.
No idea where you’re getting this. You’re basically saying I don’t know what I’m talking about but you somehow do, which strikes me as a bit ridiculous.
There are different entire categories for Deadspace vs belt rats and they have different stats.
You’re pretty massively discounting the amount of work and testing that goes into getting stuff like this right. It’s not just a “slap, dash, looks good enough” kind of thing. That sort of thing might be good enough for the MUDs you used to play but it doesn’t fly with MMOs.
Then post a better idea instead of just waving your hands and saying there’s some hypothetically better version of this feature that exists somewhere, maybe.
Yup, but Hardcore in D3 is a lot less punishing than what you’re talking about here and it was still sub-double digits.
I think you’re over-estimating the amount of time I’m spending on this, lol.
I’m also not trying to kill off discussion, I’m poking holes in your idea and then waiting for you to either fix them or counter my point in some intelligent way. Instead here we are arguing over arguments and spinning in circles.
I’m not claiming credentials I don’t have here. I’m simply saying I’ve got a better idea of how much time and effort something like a new starting point for a game takes in terms of coding, design, art, ect and the answer is always “more than you think”. The fact that you’re saying this is some minor amount of copying and pasting shows how little you know about this.
I’m sorry this forum isn’t your happy little sandbox of blue skies? I’m here to see the game get better so I’m going to be critical of whatever gets posted here so the good ideas can hopefully maybe can go on to bigger and better things and the bad ideas can either get better or die.
I like this idea. However, is it necessary that new players start off automatically in a Pirate faction, or spawn in low sec or Null sec?
What I had imagined once was that a Pirate tutorial could be added to the other four newbie tutorials, so that newbies understood that Piracy was a viable career option they could choose from. This pirate tutorial may or may not be available in the station, or available as an agent in an anomaly. You wouldn’t join the NPC Pirate faction by doing missions for them, but you would be gaining Loyalty points for that faction. Currently, it’s pretty tough to get your Pirate factions high enough to the point where you can do pirate missions.
Once a new player has decided to choose ‘Piracy’ as part of their PVP career options, there might be a recruitment centre to sign up as a new (pirate) pilot. You might have to fly into Nullsec to actually join the NPC Pirate coalition, as well as do their missions. I think that this should be the same mechanism as signing up for the NPC Militia, except now you are part of the local Pirate faction, instead of the militia.
Some people complain about how pirates can join the Militia, too. Does it make sense that a Blood Raider I can also join the Amarr Militia for example?
I think, CCP keeps the lore up-to-date: last Gallente - Caldary conflict was the reason to start faction pvp in low-sec… and described in “Empyrean Age” book. And the history continues. Coronation of amarr empress was the last lore update, I think.
What about “born as a pirate”… It should be interesting only with a lot of additional preferences for new players. That means it can impact all game mechanic that demands huge changes. Much more than deleted captain’s home.
However, there is a workaround: to allow players join other NPC corps. Not only “your school” or “your default corp” but every NPC corp in game. Including the pirate corp.
Unfortunately, the person who joined sansha or drones, have to become NPC.
Or, OR you can do it the regular way of spending a few hours getting a second racial frigate skill up and plop yourself down into null. Honestly guys, if you can achieve the same effect already in-game there’s absolutely no reason to add pirate bloodlines and rework their ships to allow day 1 pilots out in null.
