The real trick to getting newbies involved and active is by making them understand that doing something that might end up in them exploding isn’t an issue, exploding is not a problem if you do it right. That removes a lot of angst and reservations in that you’re freeing them of their own fears in that regard.
Part of that is helping them find a PVE play style that they enjoy and can do that makes them enough so it doesn’t feel it as a massive setback, part of that is teaching them that “I’m probably going to explode if I do it wrong” means they should fly cheaply and not put all their eggs in one basket, part of that is by showing them they can affect how much risk they run and that they aren’t just necessarily “weak targets and there was nothing they could do”, part of that is just conditioning them into not giving a crap about it by taking them by the hand doing something that might just go wrong and then laugh it off when it does, it’s a form of conditioning.
It’s like little kids when they fall. If you act all shocked and almost panic then they will probably start crying, over time those kids turn into scaredy drama queens. If instead you just go “oops, you ok?” then they’ll go “I’m good” and just keep going.
Yes, a lot of it is how people react or how people have reacted around them to their “failures”.
And then the real kicker is when they get the taste of their first kill, OMG the carebear turned bloodlust monster phase is a real thing. lol Wait was that a dopamine kick to the brain that I saw?
This opening post is just one of the prime example of how eve has gone into the wrong direction, to some degree driven by ccp but also to a large degree things inside the community have gone into the wrong direction thx to ccp driving away all the OG players and replacing them with crabs.
For any old player the amount of ISK that a new player can make nowadays within short periods of time is completly baffling. While the original players had to spend days or even weeks to even be able to afford and insure there first t1 cruiser nowadays ISK is pretty much thrown at new players in comparison.
And before anything reads something into it that I am not saying: This is not a bad thing. Faster progression to better toys is a good thing.
However something else has changed. Newbies for many years now have been pushed into minmaxing to crazy degrees by people in rookie channels and all kinds of information sources. They pretty much get raised into a mind set that the only right way to play the game is by grinding like crazy to get into expensive stuff like faction ships to get at least close to minmaxed income levels asap.
There is completly no regard from those “teachers” that those players neither have the skills nor the knowledge of game mechanics properly use those toys. This can very fast lead to the false impression that being able to do certain content ist very expensive and that failiures will be very expensive.
Ppl to go for minmaxed incomes rather than making smart investments into ships that are easy to replace but still very effective. Not quite as effective, but good enough to build up a decent enough wallet to slowly progress to more expensive ships later on. I have spend more than enough time in rookie channels myself, when I was still playing the game and I always found this to be really frustrating, because this is the kind of stuff that leads exactly to those rage posts of new players losing expensive ships they had no business to fly yet as with their skill and knowledge level there is almost no benefit of taking the expensive minmaxed version compared to sticking with the cheap efficient variant.
It´s a plague which has spread already over many many years and I wish ccp would just kick those minmaxers out of rookie help, as their distorted perspective on things is everything other than helpful for new players.
TLDR:
New players should not chase minmaxed numbers, but rather make smart choices and invest into ships they can lose without going bankrupt while still being efficient enough to make money.
And older players need to stop pushing the minmaxing mindset on brand new players and should rather encourage them to make smart and healthy choices that will not bankrupt them or even cripple their progression as soon as they make a mistake.
Yeah I agree with what you say, though I think its a greater degree a hallmark of society these days to want the “instagram perfect” lives that others portray without understanding the whole story, particularly the nonglamorous sides of someones life. I think this is very homologous to our societal standards of today. To speak of how wealthy or fast you can procure wealth or the optimal systems for it that dont show the dark side to many of these procurements. If you are to be jealous of someone be jealous of their “total situation” not just the glamorous or touted side of it. Once we often learn of someones whole situation we often dont become jealous of them anymore or want to emulate them.
I think the only way isnt to kick them out but to reeducate people yet we know that the minmaxers or vocal minority is just that so that they often will feel good about themselves and their pathways and playstyles and are more trying to reinforce it in others as a way of making them feel that they are important and special and superior.
The reality is that they will always be vocal and catchy and “shiny” to young eyes and newbies, both in real life and in game, but eventually the sobering realities will hit and people will realize the truth. Some will be too heavily invested and go the way of the minmaxers for the last vestige’s of what they can get and others will quit and still more will learn and grow. That learning and growing portion will always be smaller than the first and middle groups imo.
I say teach here and there and do as much as you can but I dont think its CCPs job to counter that aspect of the game. I think the groups and organizations that do cater to newbros and offer good information are a good start. But in the end its a human problem, not a gaming issue.
No, that is not an EVE or CCP fault. This is global phenomena. I am running an old RPG multiplayer server and theplayers are the same, entitled, apparently “not having fun”, constantly complaining and crying about loot tables, difficulty and well anything and minmaxing anything that can be from a character itself to dungeon crawling efficiency.
I don’t know what caused this, but nobody plays online multiplayer games for fun anymore it seems…
I can tell you exactly what happened. Gen Z and Gen Alpha happened. They want instant gratification and everything for zero effort. The current generation of gamers have the attention span of a toddler on crack.
The thing is, the game I am hosting is old. All the players are old playing it from nostalgia. I don’t think there is any young player at least on my server, it is not “interesting” for them because it is old, retro graphic, and too low player count.
So these are old players, players who used to play it “right” at some point, but turned to crybabies. I think that the newer games, and the mechanics and design of them spoiled most of even us old gamers.
What do you want reward for? What did you do that was so great?
I have a credit card. You don’t have one of those? Go to your bank they’ll give you one.
Do they? I didn’t notice.
Two of the same amount written differently.
You must be a genius.
That sentence makes no sense.
How old are you? I’m guessing 5yo
Little risk little reward. The game company isn’t your momma.
I guess by “regular player” you mean Alpha.
You want good loot but you don’t want to pay the devs… that means you’re a mooch, a parasite. You deserve nothing!
A credit card doesn’t get spent, it’s the money in your account that gets spent.
Come back when you’re 15yo, kid.
New players like you will never understand the economy of Eve and how it works. If you are able to Plex your account on the first day Eve is done in 4 days about the lack of income in RL.
Yes. The game is designed to keep people swiping a Visa card. Its pay to win and only for multiboxers to do well. Eve is still a good game but its barely worth playing unless you swipe swipe swipe. Ive played for 15 years and I surround myself with highly successful players. Im pretty sure I know… 1 other person besides myself who does not swipe the visa to keep playing. The game is fundamentally wrecked by CCPs poor decisions. Its a shame tbh… self-inflicted issues. One step forward, two steps back. They do 90% of a project well and then wreck it somehow with major faults.
If they need to swipe their moms credit card in order to achieve things in a free to play game, they seem to be rather stupid players. And your own bitterness don’t sound like youre being a smart dude either.
EVE can be lots of fun without ever paying a penny besides the standard 1-account-sub, which is a pretty fair deal given the amount of entertainment you can get from it.
The “current generation” of gamers is still mostly the same people as they were 10-15 years ago. There aren’t 5-year waves of turnover in gamers, most of them will game all their life.
And complaining about “that damn new generation, no patience no respect for the right way to do things” is as old as Methusaleh.
You guys are simply seeing the inevitable result of an interconnected social media world, where everybody can instantly see someone else who has all the toys doing all the big things and telling you how “you can have it all too, if you just watch my channel every day!”.
“The grass is greener” and “keeping up with the Jones’s” isn’t new. Heck there’s even a commercial playing fairly often (at least on my Youtube algorithm) talking about how you can always see someone else who has more, and another someone else who has more than that.
“Until you realize there’s more to life than ‘more’” or something like that.
And the game devs themselves go to all the “how to make your gaming audience game harder and pay more” conferences, so they’re all using the same motivational and FOMO tricks to make their players play more often and pay more often.
Yes, the OP has a point - EVE is being increasingly shaped in ways that sucker some players who are just “trying to keep up” into paying more money. Well, they’re a business, that’s what they do.
Players need to find their own way to realize “there’s more to life than ‘more’”, otherwise they just end up heading to a forum or Facebook or Twitch to blow off steam when they get frustrated by a setback. Which is pretty much all the OP is doing here.
It’s natural, it doesn’t indicate a specific target group that’s your pet peeve has suddenly become incapable of dealing with reality.
Damn, that’s over 5000 years ago and he lived to be 969yr after the great flood.
But to your comment, they’re only saying those kinds of things to show off, to say they’re the best blah-blah…
The difference is the proliferation of smart phones and tablets. Older folks knew of a time before them where insta gratification and ongoing dopamine hits weren’t the norm so much, same with buying stuff and having it delivered in a very short time frame where no sort of patience is required any more. Their childhood was different and thus they matured different.
Younger people grow up in this insta-everything society, they don’t know anything else and that will profoundly affect them.
