Reminiscent of Dust, a fools errand to pull customers from other markets while they alienated their core base with WiS.
I was more thinking how to get people interested in the first place.
The first hurdle is a somewhat exaggerated reputation for being total total ****** and *** ***** and the occasional silly joke.
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This game is for self starters who know how to make their own plan.
Itâs a PvP game, who cares?
Me neither but ESO is no better really. Lots of voice, kinda cool, but theres gold guy and the cat dude and the other cat dude and the gold chick with the horse afaik lol.
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For the most part, I agree - newer players need a little more in the way of âwhat to do next?â than EVE currently has.
I disagree with the notion that an immersive mission arc is the way to do that. Although it could be worked with to provide some benefit, PVE content is not the way to go in a sandbox.
CCP should be developing what I call âactivity funnelsâ that, in effect, put players with similar interests into a local situation where the goal is readily apparent and the most effective thing for them to do is to group up and/or hang around the edges of the action and participate.
This gets players used to seeing other players in action, used to forming fleets, gives them an opportunity to meet other people with similar interests/goals. It also allows people to interact in a more free and open manner than âlook at list of 10,000 corps, pick corp, apply to corp, wait for corp to respond, submit to corpâs verification process, spend 2 weeks finding out corp is useless, repeat until quitâ.
It also gives the potential for PvP/conflict as other groups show up to do the same thing or to hunt the action spot.
For instance, if you look at Resource Wars, that could have been an activity funnel. Visible beacon, can find in Agency, people interested would head that way. Then what if there was a limitation that said âOnly fleets of 2-3 pilots can jump through this gateâ. What if multiple fleets could jump through? What if the Resource War on the other side rewarded each fleet according to how much it accomplished before the timer ran out? What if the Resource War rewards werenât so laughably bad that no one ever wanted them?
That is an âactivity funnelâ. Visible things, that groups people together voluntarily and easily, gives a clear goal and a reasonable reward, and opens the door to any number of play styles.
A series of funnels would lead to more interaction, faster game play, more conflict, and better social grouping.
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Well said
I agree.
I started over six years ago in the Trossere starter system. At that time there were numerous conversations in local a lot of the time. There were recruiters, hucksters, the occasional bad guy shooting newbs (bannable offense there, but it happened), and people organizing ad hoc âexpeditionsâ, oh, and there was the scotch drinkers group, which met every Saturaday night (for months) to debate single malt versus blended.
The game was so confusing to me, I went to the trouble of going to another starter system, Conoban, and repeating the tutorials. I dropped by Amarr on my way there, and found a group of beer drinkers discussing their favorite beverages in local. Aha! I thought to myself, Amarrâs where the beer drinkers hang out.
After finishing the tutorials in Conoban I went back to Trossere and started the SOE arc, to the raucus chatter of Trossere local. Pilots of all stripes were organizing fleetsâŚletâs try flying to lowsec, I went into a wh and got blown up, noâŚletâs go to null this time, etc. It was entirely player organized and chatty and active. Theyâd discuss fits, the roam they went on yesterday, where player pirates were active, who you could trust, who you couldnât. And scotch, on Saturday nights.
Everyone flew cheap ships, and there was guy in Trossere at one point who gave out isk. Heâd log in every day and give out 20 million, 25 million or 30 million isk to the first few comers. There would be âsmallâ debates where new players would ask the other older ânew playersâ if he was legit (which he was.) This went on for months. He said he was a station trader, iirc, and just liked helping out newbies. He asked nothing in return, he was just a generous player. But, boy howdy, when he was on things got lively, conversation would sky rocket.
Over time, new wanna be FCs would organize other newbies and groups would set out to conquer âtheir fear of the gameâ, i.e. whatâs out there and can I trust the guys Iâm flying with, and so it would go.
A seemingly endless cycle of activity newb style. On these roams people would discuss the game, their personal interests (what drew them to try EVE) and how to find a good corp, and whatever the current shocking gossip was going on regarding EVE celebrities.
Everyone knew of Chribba, the Mittani, Cannibal Kane, Tora Bushido. They were famous, and we talked about them and their exploits.
And slowly over time all this conversation died. It just died. People no longer talk in the starter systems. @Mike_Azariah nowadays has a great deal of difficulty giving free ships away, at times, cause no one will respond in local.
This silence is, imo, the barrier to new player retention. If social ties are what keep players in game, then this initial isolation is the problem.
I have maintained a base in Trossere my entire EVE carreer. I have run a new player mentoring corp.
Itâs not the game that is the problem.
It is our collective silence in the starter systems.
Only vets can change that.
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Elite Dangerous kinda does that to a degree, though they only added Local and Fleets recently to let people actually âPwPâ as they call it. Heretics.
EVEs rep for being newbie-unfriendly and being âexcel in spaceâ are not completely untrue though. The learning curve is steep, and the intro throws you out at a very early point, where it still hurts to look at all those menus and no idea what to do.
You might be able to fly now, and do simple missioning, but even the tutorial is kinda clunky and full of walls of text nobody who tries out a new game has time for.
I think the number of people who try out the game is great ⌠10.000/week, not sure even WOW can beat that number, and thereâs no alternative to EVE either, itâs the only space sandbox MMO. But only 200 of those people staying is a bit sad. People will never find out what theyâre missing out on.
Do you think that theres a sensible question to be asked as to whether;
The world is open but the ways to interact seem obscured?
Or
Its not open enough?
Or
Too open?
I think itâs the first.
When I started playing in 2006, the game was feature-rich, but not THAT overwhelmingly rich just yet. You could do those standard things you can still do now, and at some point, after my friends had quit, I went to rat in Providence. That was enough for me, and I honestly donât remember if there even was a tutorial back then - if it was, it must have sucked, because itâs completely gone from memory.
Iâve yet to get into scanning stuff down and wormholes and all that jazz (and probably wonât, Iâm happy with where I am and what Iâm doing). I log in, do this or that, then log off again⌠a filthy casual peasant with just 1 account, and Iâm even paying for it with real money, because I donât make enough ISK to buy PLEX.
As a new player, if you ask in Rookie what to do, you get 20 different answers from 20 different players, and while thatâs awesome because EVE obviously has a lot of content, itâs also kind of bad, because too many choices make people unhappy - and thereâs no guiding hand there, Aura really doesnât cut it 
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Resource Wars. I remember wwb. Thats Ă hell of Ă selling point
My starting experience was similar. I canât really put a date on it but Iâd guess that sort of action/chat in starter systems began to fade around 2014-ish.
This is not uncommon in games over time. Earlier in the life of a game, there is a lot of activity/bustle in starter areas. 8-10 years in, 90% of the population has moved to the âend-gameâ areas and only the occasional alt or new player is in the starter regions, and he sees maybe 2-5 other people in his area with him. Not exactly chat-filling numbers.
This is again what an âactivity funnelâ is designed for. You canât put 7,000 systems across space, stick 50% of the population in 15-20 different systems (where they are scamming, missioning, trading, or farming), scatter the other 50% across hi, low, WH and null space; and assume that somehow, lively player interaction will occur.
People will head for the places where they can get something interesting done. In a PvP, dog-eat-dog, âdark-and-edgyâ game setting⌠that often means:
- Safe space
- Space with minimal other player interference (empty systems, out-of-the-way systems, etc)
- Space where you are mostly surrounded by your own cronies (null space)
- Space you can get into, accomplish something, and get out with your rewards fairly quickly
The base design of EVE does not actually encourage âgetting together and hanging outâ. If you want people to create activity in specific areas (in order to hit critical mass for convos, debates, fleeting up, whatever) then you have to create an âattractorâ that brings them together. And make it something that does not simultaneously defeat the purpose (such as scammers/spammers in trade hubs pretty much filling local chat).
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I think the problem is that new players arenât able to figure things out for themselves. They are thrown into a world where everyone is better (at least from a skill point stance). They arenât given an opportunity to grow and develop on their own.
A guy may join today that would be the best FC in the game. But in two months that it takes to train skills to be competitive in a frigate or destroyer, He is told to be tackle and he gets locked in as that or quits because he never got to do what he would be best at.
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Npc corps are â â â â for noobs anyway.
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And your thrown in a npc corp.
Yeah thatâs what I think the main problem is. EVE has a steep learning curve and a lot to do.
Maybe making newbies go down one path, and really narrowing down the whole experience to a step-by-step approach to that specific activity would be helpful.
Cutting the noise must be terrible for new people. So much to do, but how to do it, what ship to get, how to fit for it, whatâs the chain of skills to be learned to make it happen, and so on. Itâs easier to drift from this activity to the next, then dropping out.
Unless youâre lucky enough to be picked up and used as a tackler in the first place, can always develop yourself to become the next legendary FC. Itâs actually way better than worst case (quit), because the player in question is still playing, and as long as thatâs the case, thereâs still hope.
I also think that alts take alot away from this gameâŚ
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People wouldnât need alts if they were not so anti-social.
Npc corps for noobs, and not for alts