Why newbies don't stay

Communications Center General Discussion
121

While I was still active I was training a lot of noobs… in my last adventure I was hired buy a trader to help him build up a new corp just for fun… a corp full with round about 10 new players and me wiping the floor with a bunch of experienced pilots, while flying t1 frigs. They came after us in faction cruisers and stuff like that…

Sure we also got decced by Pirat, but that hardly bothered us. We just did not mess around in trade hubs for the time being and went on with our business.

The problem with wardecs always has been shitty leadership and people running corps who had no business in running corps and those rightfully have been wiped out.

122

They were lucky To have you assit them

123

Interesting thought. Corp leadership 101

124

Just to be clear, I was not not using any shiny toys either. I did put myself in their shoes and was just flying t1 frigs alongside with them. Mainly because I wanted to show them that it´s not a matter of SP or the toys you bring but rather a matter of teamwork. And I wanted to let them feel like they actually had an equal share in the fights and were not just some cannon fodder that just happened to be there.

Things like the wardec immunity however is not going to help ppl to get better at the game. Protecting them only means that there is less struggle for them. Less struggle means there is less of a requirement to improve yourself. So they are sitting in their protected bubble until suddenly something bad happens when they fly expensive stuff which is going to piss them off even more.

If you get the chance to learn right from the start while losses are still cheap and don´t grow up with the illusion of safety, you become a better player even before you fly anything of value and you are prepared to get into trouble, or learned how to avoid it.

125

Forgot to mention skill system which is awfull - who wants today to wait X years or pay X amount of money for skills ?

3 Likes
126

The skill system is totally fine. Bigger and more expansive toys are just death traps without the knowledge how to properly fit and fly them. Over and over again it has been proven that ppl rushing into big ships (with or without injectors) lack the game knowledge to make use of those ships and just get slaughtered and end up losing tons of ISK.

2 Likes
127

That’s not what I posted.

I’ve learnt plenty from my own mistakes; some of them, that weren’t obvious, were pointed out to me, so that I could learn from them.

128

WAAA I WANT IT NOW

2 Likes
129

^^^^^^
■■■■■■■ amen.

Lack of direction. Confusion. Low income. Low power.

New players don’t know what to do or what they are capable of because the average corp today is not the average corp of the last decade. We’ve removed/nerfed a lot of the ‘survival of the fittest’ gameplay and what’s left is a lot of one man corps, boring and weak farming corps that ruin the npe. Very few corps are good at retaining players and they are hard diamonds to find amongst all the rough.

1 Like
130

Why new players dont stay?
For many its à love and hate relasionship.
And if You dont get à chance To love thé game. Odds are you wont come back

1 Like
131

This game is well past its prime, and the struggle CCP is facing trying to identify a modern market for EVE is testimony to the antiquity. EVE isn’t a game you play to have genuine “fun” let’s completely come to terms with that realization. Because “fun” in eve typically equates to real loss. Whether it’s a blingy ship being dunked by trigs, 8 hours worth of structure bashing, or mindlessly drilling away at space rocks only to have your hauler tornado’d along some trade pipe. You’re going to lose vast amounts of time, and vast amounts of wealth very quickly in this game.

No, this most definitely isn’t a game that is allowed to classify itself as “fun”, but it is most certainly allowed to classify itself as a “niche”. Here in lies the issue. Niches don’t sell games anymore, Niches aren’t marketable. Niches exist to fill cracks and holes within the gaming paradigm, but there’s nothing for CCP to fill anymore.

Back when EVE was relevant you only had a handful of choices when it came to MMORPGs. Now there’s F2P games that came out just last year with more gloss, polish, game value and interest than CCP has attempted to do with nearly 2 decades worth of time.

2 Likes
132

Skills system was flush down the toilet with SP trading. You have to be dedicated player to fly supers, now you just buy SP for supers. CCP just monetize whole thing. This whole “but players need tools to catch up” is pure nonsense. System was exploited, economy in ruin, change irreversible because it’s making them money, in the same time destroying cluster internally.

2 Likes
133

Care Bear Code Word for “WoW Clone”.

2 Likes
134

I always had genuine fun. This is because I never just chased rewards or ISK/h, but only did the things I actually enjoyed doing.

I never felt like I lost time when I lost a ship. As I had fun in the process of earning the ISK for the ships and nobody could have taken that away from me. And the point of games is to have fun after all, so as long as I had fun all along the way I did not lose any time.

In the 12 years I played the game pretty much every day this happened to me exactly 0 times.

EvE is or at least used to be fun for the people who enjoyed their player freedom. From my experience only boring people who only care about ISK or rewards in general and don´t give a rats ass about the journey or their personal stories are the ones not having fun.

Almost every F2P game I have ever played is boring, mindless and offers 0 challenge at all. And all those games are tailord towards sucking money out of people. They are not about good gameplay, they are all about microtransactions and making you pay for convenience or proper p2w features. But of course that works, because the majority of people playing games these days are not really gamers, they are just consumers looking for some kind of entertainment, but they don´t actually care about a good gameplay.

The only exception I can name from experience is Parth of Exile. Which I also only enjoy when playing hardcore leagues, as softcore is not a challenge either.

However there still is a market for games for true gamers, apperantly CCP managed to chase those away with their butchering of the game.

8 Likes
135

Many play just for the prizes, the activity means nothing. The number of prizes earned is how they measure their self worth. They are not really playing any game for fun, they are playing for personal ego.

This is why they can’t PvP, the ego hit when defeated is too much for them.

4 Likes
136

Lol, standard response from PVP nulsec players.

Some many call none dedicated PVP players as carebears, but this is based on zkill reports and we all know that only shows what information it gains from api pulls of those that sign in.

Most carebears aren’t soft and easy to kill, but one thing many forget is the carebears are the ones the mine the resources and make the item the PVP player needs to do PVP operations.
No carebears, no ammo, no replacement ship, not fuel for structures, no modules, and no targets.

Most Intelligent PVP corps understand the importance of Indi players and corps, and form alliances or trade agreements to keep their PVP running at full strength

Main issue with new players, especially the younger ones is lack of patience, everything has to be instant gratification for them. Older players it’s getting ganked while they try to get started by CODE and similar Highsec noobe gankers.

Yes as other stated above once they finish the starter mission many don’t know what to do, and in some case they join massive corps thinking they’ll be able to do things they like with other, but just become another teeth in the gears of these corps, told they have to train this to use what the corp wants them to fly.

Some get lucky and join corps that are a bit more free to choice what you want to do, and help them with guidance and resources to do so.

But not everything in EVE is PVP, just look at nulsec atm, PVE Drifter fleets are taking on PVP stations, to me it appears **BP ** and CCP are proving a point about that PVP and large corps aren’t the most important things in EVE.

Maybe it’s time the large PVP corps look at the noobe player pool as a resource, and help them stay in game, so later on the PVP corps gain new members or more PVP targets, or more sources of resources.

Something to think about.

1 Like
137

So true, seen many noobe players go PVP and fail big time. Most of the younger ones don’t want to listen to advise from older players.

I know of one that SIJ’d into a Redeemer, and was so gun hue that he was the king of PVP, he even joins one of the better PVP corps.
Funny thing is on undocking in Amarr he got podded by a t1 frigate, 5minutes later same fit, got podded again, this happen a couple more times.
This noobe was told to fix his fit, didn’t listen to corp members, end story he left game less than a month later.

I can’t bitch about the ganker, as the noobe made out he was skilled and he was in a T2 BS. So good on the ganker.

If it was a noobe in T1 frigate or Destroyer different story. These guy need a chance to see what EVE offers, gameplay wise and community wise.

1 Like
138

There’s so many contributing factors to why player retention for this company is becoming a perilous task. I won’t pretend to be a game designer and I could sympathize with the efforts of managing so many moving parts within a gaming department (as i’m sure we all can… as that’s how the majority of businesses in the universe operate :office:). However there still seems to be this stinging sensation of neglect or maybe it’s just complacency on their end, but it’s definitely noticeable.

CCP is by no means the size of Blizzard or EA, but they’re much larger and much more well funded than other smaller studios out at the moment that have demonstrated much more competence, and a much more intimate connection to their communities issues.

I digress…, and ontopic to the recent “oof” :face_vomiting: :money_mouth_face::moneybag:

Micro-transactions do more good for a game than bad and a lot of people fail to realize that. Of course it has to be done correctly, and for the right reasons… this recent skill point pack isn’t one of those reasons. They’re manifesting content seemingly out of thin air, content that is directly in competition with their player market. All EVE is, at it’s most fundamental core is a market simulator with player-run checks and balances.

Ship goes boom -> Need New Ship -> Build Ship - > Sell Ship - > Buy Ship -> Ship goes boom, etc

Directly competing with that very delicate system does terrible things, and terrible things rather quickly. You may see this as a means to “help” new players, but then completely forget about skill extractors that the majority of the people are going to use on this bundle.

If your actual intent was to “help new players” than you’d make sure that these specific SP couldn’t be extracted :thinking:. You know what you’re doing, and like a disappointed parent it’s becoming increasingly embarrassing to see this once renowned team of devs make childish decisions hand over fist. :baby::baby_bottle:

3 Likes
139

Just and idea off the top of my head
CCP should hire GM’s to run starting Corps of the new players. One for each of the four empires, tie it to FW. Increase taxes at trade hubs to pay for ship replacements. The training and guidance system can be the schooling to keep new players interested in staying in the game. “maybe hire from the veteran player pool, with a yearly performance bonuses.”

3 Likes
140

Shoehorning them this way or that cant be solution in a sandbox,
NPE doesn’t provide path to PVP and PVE they connect with is a 2003 era disaster.
That in mind Parts of high sec need to be more secure than it is and part of it needs to be less secure.
Info about risk and general info should be all around them instead of that moron in hangar billboards with clear vision some actual info should be displayed.

“Niarja high sec system raided by suicide terrorist pods lost 27, ship lost 35 in last ___ hours”
“Triglavians raiding this and that here and there material cost to date 13 trillion and one isk”
“Dont fly what you cant afford to lose”
“Ready to undock?”
“This week Pods lost in High sec____”
“This week Ship lost in High sec____”
…on it goes.

2 Likes