Hilmar does your kid play with mutaplazmids or hypercores?
1 Like
Expect the in game Billboards to be filled with HyperNet ads.
The graphics on that screen show heâs actually playing Star Trek Online.
1 Like
And here we see a core of the issue. The actual core of it.
It isnât about facts, of any sort. itâs about Merinâs gut feeling that obviously CCP will do something different to what is being advertised.
By the way - with framework provided the only way for it to even hope to approach proper casino CCP would have to start seeing HyperNet with their own offers at consistent, unlimited pace, and considering that their whole direct income from the feature is at the point of SETTING UP the raffle, this wouldnât be exactly feasible option for them.
An please just donât try to throw plex sales at me in there - considering how easy and quick isk is to get nowadays, this would still take ALOT of raffles to even get to the point where anyone seriously considers using plex at those raffles.
EDIT:
Which is kind of funny in this context considering that STO actually spams you in loot with lootboxes which require keys bought directly at premium shop to open, with said boxes containing anything between trash to extremely powerfull ships, with powerfull traits, and basically alot of potential gamebreakers (to the point where someone equipped with ships and traits exclusively from those lootboxes can win any PvP fight he wishes just by sheer amount of âwhen you die, you donâtâ traits from those boxes)
No, itâs 100% about what CCP is advertising. Itâs just that, unlike you, I am capable of interpreting and extrapolating from what we have been explicitly told and considering the consequences. For example:
CCP article âweâre boosting damage of all T1 frigates by 500%â.
Me: âwow, thatâs a huge buff, T1 frigates are going to see more useâ.
You: âITS JUST YOUR GUT FEELING CCP ONLY SAID 500% DAMAGE THEY DIDNâT SAY ANYONE WOULD USE THEMâ.
CCP can call it a âmarketâ all they want but what they are presenting is a thinly veiled gambling system.
By the way - with framework provided the only way for it to even hope to approach proper casino CCP would have to start seeing HyperNet with their own offers at consistent, unlimited pace, and considering that their whole direct income from the feature is at the point of SETTING UP the raffle, this wouldnât be exactly feasible option for them.
Lolwut? You do understand that this kind of lottery is guaranteed profit for the person running it, right? CCP doesnât need to seed anything when the players are perfectly capable of recognizing easy profit and making as many lotteries as the market will permit. The only way we donât see massive use of this new feature for gambling is if the players collectively say â**** this F2P cash shop garbageâ and refuse to buy tickets.
Personally as someone who is under the age of actual real life gambling, Iâm perfectly fine with it, nothing comes wrong from a bit of fun and luck.
Talk to somebody with addiction issuesâŠ
Great, underage gambling has been a thing around here for years, not going to go into detail into my personal life, but can easily tell you, Iâve seen more people gamble in reality underage then the amount of skill levels in EVE Online.
Personal antidotes aside, addictions are real and devastating. Sure lots of people can enjoy (insert vice here) safely and without negative repercussions. The bell curve applies here to and it like always there those poor bastards on either side that get caught in whatever mess they happen to be into.
I think people here are just say that when there are kids or young people involved, it shouldnât be a free-for-allâŠ
And if You were capable of reasonable thought you are preaching yourself You would have known the difference between your example here, and actuall scenario occuring, and realise how hard You missed the point.
Iâll make it easier for You and adapt your oxemple to better fit your behaviour:
CCP: "we are boosting frigate output by 500%
Merin: âOH NOES THEY WILL MAKE DESTROYERS COMPLETELY OP NEXT!!11oneoneexclamationmarkâ
Yeah because players have available at hand unlimited supply of items worth to raffle away⊠oh wait, they donât.
and because math were already done and overhead in cost to set up the raffle is high enough for only a handfull of items to be actually worth it, and those handfull of items are in extremely short supply.
Yes, but only if it uses those things to extort other players
Another simple question:
You are approached by a frenzied Vault scientist, who yells, âIâm going to put my quantum harmonizer in your photonic resonation chamber!â Whatâs your response?
I think the appropriate response to that would be a question:
âIs it shielded?â
People keep saying thereâs worse things in eveâŠlike what?
âtoxic social interactionsâ? What does that mean specifically?
Ganking? Pvp? Smacktalk?
Anything that isnât already a bannable offense?
So youâre saying gaming should be for ages 18+ across multiple countries?
There is no real drugs, alcohol, extortion or violence in eve.
And when there is, you get banned.
Like everyone was saying, if all the gambling in eve was all isk with no connection between real life money and isk then fewer people would have a problem with it.
Or if eve changes the age rating then fewer people would have a problem with it.
For me itâs because it is specifically designed to enable gambling in a game for minors. And i do consider it gambling.
The connection to real life money and chance based gameplay is enough to cause issue with me (I was also unimpressed with the introduction of abyss mods btw.).
Comparisons to other gameplay like theft and getting killed are very poor ones. Any chance based elements of combat and theft are minor and certainly not the definitive mechanic to success or failure. The gambling that is being pushed here is in every sense of the term a game of chance (read gambling)
Raffle/lottery/casino whatever. Iâd like the content to match the age rating or the age rating to match the content.
I donât believe that thereâs even a remotely significant amount of minors playing EVE.
Its not about minors.
Its about greedy companies exploiting their customers by facilitating addiction to increase profits.
Thereâs no real gambling either. You donât pay real money to gamble in EVE. You pay to create the raffle. Those who participate in the raffle, which is admittedly a gamble though a rather low-key type, are using ISK. ISK isnât real money.
Pretend-gambling is no more real than pretend-violence, where you use weapons to destroy someone elseâs efforts in order to take an RNG gamble on a decent drop.
Pretend-extortion where you threaten violence and destruction on another personâs holdings unless they pay you apparently isnât ârealâ either, so how can paying ISK to get something be real gambling?
Learning to cheat and scam and rip off someone else (or having the same things done to you) apparently isnât ârealâ because hey, itâs only ISK, right? Nothing real is lost.
Therefore I really donât see how you guys can keep saying the gambling is real. Anyone buying nodes is only spending ISK. ISK isnât real.
If the ISK somehow became ârealâ enough to turn pretend-gambling into ârealâ gambling, then it seems to me itâs real enough for pretend-violence, pretend-exortion and pretend-fraud to be just as much of a gateway for those activities as pretend-gambling is.
Gaming addiction is real, it is a known problem, it has quite significant numbers. Minors, or any age, having a gambling problem through EVEs Hypernet Relay system is complete supposition on the part of some players, without a shred of fact to back it up.
Again, people are simply focusing on a trigger issue because theyâve got an easy bandwagon to jump on, without regard to actual facts and while ignoring other, more pertinent issues. Heck, stress and anger are âmore realâ issues than this raffle-gambling stuff, and half of you guys crave creating that.
Note: I think the Hypernet system is foolish, prone to causing market distortions, wonât bring in anywhere near enough income to justify the player reactions, and the development time would have been better spent on something more applicable to the game and the player base as a whole.
That makes it a bad game design issue (CCPâs fortĂ©), rather than a âoh noes gambling addictions!â issue.
I agree 100%, in fact lately almost everything CCP has implemented has been the complete opposite of that.
Yeah, Iâd be fine with attacking the crap out of yet another dumb idea from CCP because itâs bad game design.
Iâd think it would be more effective to actually analyze the potential market distortions - what items in short-ish supply will be bought out from the market and re-raffled to cost 10x their normal amount, etc.
But attacking it based on âthink of the children, gambling is bad mkayâ is silly.
For instance, in Star Trek Online, the drop rates from the various types of gamble-boxes have been analyzed thoroughly, are fairly accurately established, and as soon as a new item comes out in âlootbox Xâ people do the math and say âThis item is going to sell for around 750-800k. This other item is going to be a 1.2billion itemâ etc.
Thatâs a game that minors actually do play, that isnât touted as a cold, harsh âadultâ environment, where gambling is an everyday thing⊠and has zero stories of gambling addicts throwing their income away, of children maxing out mommys credit card, of markets going mad because gambling was introduced.
The actual proportion of players isnât what worries me. What matters is thatâs the age group they are declaring the game is suitable for. What matters is if any play. CCP are marketing this to make sure every one in the game knows about this. Including the minors. And like someone said, they will be spammed in market local by players selling their items.
Combine that with alphas. The design is to get as many people playing the game as possible, even people unlikely to commit. Now they are trying to get as many people into the game as possible and going âhey look! Why donât you gamble to get good gear?â whether the alpha commits or not doesnât matter. Just get them in the game and get them gambling at least once, but more is better. And they sure as hell intend to design it in such a way to maximise endorphins during play whilst CCP stand to make real life money off every gambler, 12/13 year olds and all.
Thatâs predatory to me. And an especially bad move with all the controversy surrounding the subject of children gambling in games right now and the real life consequences it has had and the real life money lost to it.
And i also worry where this is going. Speaking of predatory behaviour above, what if ccp provide hypernode giveaways during events. âfree sampleâ gambling. âgive them a taste to get them hookedâ
If ccp changed it and said this is now an adult game with adult content and we try to only let adults play, thatâd go a long way to alleviate my fears. I wouldnât be thrilled, but like a lot of you, at least it wouldnât look like they were peddling it to minors and iâd become âuse it or donât use itâ neutral.