You can´t pull IMPLANTS if you have a COMBAT TIMER or lost your SHIP -> Example: TUSKERS

[Kane_Carnifex]

**TL;DR If you have a COMBAT TIMER you CANT pull IMPLANTS. **
In SPECIAL IF there is a EVENT running which lets implant drop.

So our famous, beloved Tuskers which are in the spotlight as an AT CHAMPION <3 have shown something super wierd which shouldn´t be possible.

1. Crimson Harvest Events lets Implants drop.
2. We killed a very nice Orthrus from TUSKERS
   → GF they killed a lot of uss and definitley had their fun time. (so had we)

BUT something looks super FISHY on this KILLMAIL and you tell me what it is:

Capsule | Konnen Jung | Killmail

Usally i would say you pull off the High-grade Snake Omega as it should be the most expensive.
But here we missing Slot 1-4

I can´t say if it got pulled or not.
BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT

IT shouldn´t be possible to PULL Implants if you have a combat timer or just lost your SHIP.
Give it a Warning which your Fluid is reclaibrating and pulling Implants isn´t possible until you have
DOCKED UP in a Station.

Is there a VALID Reason to pull off Implants if you have a COMBAT TIMER?
No… beside denying Loot (event) and reduce te ISK Value of the Killmail.

Funny which we are in 2025 and people talking about Balances, Cheaper Dread prices and there we have people swimming in money and decide to abuse it.

You come with a 5-8B PVP Setup, you are Champion of the AT, you known for having blinging stuff.
You enjoi the PVP but when you start loosing it you go crazy caveman and pull implants.

Can we simply block this by adding a rule which if you have a RED TIMER you can´t pull Implants.
Abyssal People aren´t affacted sine they swap around withthe drugs before they enter.

Why is this not fixed yet?

[Lesican]

@Kane_Carnifex

Why is this not fixed yet?

why should it be fixed, despite your over emotinal rant you never gave a reason why it needs “fixing”?

[Gerard_Amatin]

@Kane_Carnifex

Is there a VALID Reason to pull off Implants if you have a COMBAT TIMER?

If you wanted to spend a lot of money you could pull implants in combat to plug new ones and swap strategies on the fly.

Other links pilot died? Luckily you had spares offline and can take over their more important links and plug in a new mindlink.

Cannot catch up to someone? Take out the existing set and plug in snakes!

Yes, it’s ridiculous and I’m not saying people do this often or do it at all, but it is possible!

Luckily the ‘pulling implants’ trick to deny a killmail or - during a rare event - loot is most of the time not relevant. Pods usually don’t drop implants as loot.

I wouldn’t be opposed to making it impossible to pull implants during a combat timer but also don’t think it’s needed.

[Kane_Carnifex]

Snip. Removed call out and off topic remarks. ~Buldath Snip

why should it be fixed, despite your over emotinal rant you never gave a reason why it needs “fixing”?

Could you read my post again and than show me on this Venture where i have offended you?
But let me make it clear the Orhrus (~5b Abysall) had probably full set of Highgrade Snakes and he pulled them off to deny the loot.

Could you change your perspective into following:
You caught a super Pilot, you killed his ship and be able to pod him to find just an empty pod?
Aren´t you also wanting his “fancy” Implants. Super is Endgame Ship which deservers high quality implants.

Lets have a look under the Pareto principle and some common sense and what not.

Other links pilot died? Luckily you had spares offline and can take over their more important links and plug in a new mindlink.

Mindlinks come in a faction version which already cover two spectrums.
Which funny is aligned with the Bonus you get on most of the Command Ships.
I would drop this argument into the lower bracket as it is super niche.

Cannot catch up to someone? Take out the existing set and plug in snakes!

High-grade Snake is ~2,8B or so having this in the Cargo for your ship to have the OPTION to be faster… If your setup is kite you have it plugged in already. So yeah if it is as above niche argument and also much likely super low.

Yes, it’s ridiculous and I’m not saying people do this often or do it at all, but it is possible!

Pareto principle, you go the otherway for the small amount.
So 80% of the eve playerbase (like more) won´t do this.
The rest are nerds <3 which playing their own game inside the game.

Luckily the ‘pulling implants’ trick to deny a killmail or - during a rare event - loot is most of the time not relevant. Pods usually don’t drop implants as loot.

But during an event i would consider it as an exploit.
You can´t pull off modules from your active ship, why shouldn´t it be the same with implants in your head. 1 Month of 12 Month this is relevant because its ADVERTISE by the EVENT.
→ You don´t want that, strip the EVENT no more Implant drops. Solved.
So you could say we disallow it for just the 1 Month during the EVENT.
The other 11 Month it only helps to mask your killmail which is just an ego problem of the pilot.

I wouldn’t be opposed to making it impossible to pull implants during a combat timer but also don’t think it’s needed.

From that what I see you on the side of the small amount of people which may have a benefit from it. But luckly we focused on the major player base and they don´t have any of these advantages.
I would consider them but i still missing the major Dealbreaker, the Showstopper.
A so called “Totschlagargument” = killer argument.. the translation is ■■■■.

[Buggs_LeRoach]

@Kane_Carnifex

But during an event i would consider it as an exploit.

you could petition it and find out; it’s up to CCP to make that decision.

but i think you’re overlooking a very basic tenet of eve online: tear production

which this thread has in abundance and is the strongest argument for NOT changing this mechanic.

[Gerard_Amatin]

Tears, and laughs too.

It’s not uncommon to see a killmail shared where the pod was halfway pulling their implants, giving a good laugh to the players who see it.

For a mechanic that usually has no impact on the economy of kills but often creates emotions like tears and laughs, I think the game benefits of it the way it is.

[Kane_Carnifex]

Are we in the same Forum?
Let me copy paste something for you, this may helps.

@ISD_Buldath

The platform for players to bring topics to the attention of the CSM.

In this forum, any EVE player can raise an issue for debate.

The best and most supported of these issue threads are picked up by the CSM for debate. The issues that pass debate are bought to CCP, and if CCP consents, the issues get implemented into the game.

[Kane_Carnifex]

@Gerard_Amatin

t’s not uncommon to see a killmail shared where the pod was halfway pulling their implants, giving a good laugh to the players who see it.

Yes or raise questions for new pilots!
The worst part is which it was announcet in the Crimson Harvest EVENT has an PVP feature.
Also i don´t laugh about it, i love more they way how long it took to make it possible to kill.
**

Than i take my hat and honor which somebody fly THIS into our space todo PVP for PVP.

Not RAIDING ESS.. just for KILLMAILS.. so now it gets very strange.
Making Killmails is fine… my own killmails must be “masked” or deny loot.
We can do Psychoanalysis and get to the ground of the problem.
But alone which this is polarising as hell gives me a deeeeeeeep.
**

@Gerard_Amatin

For a mechanic that usually has no impact on the economy of kills but often creates emotions like tears and laughs, I think the game benefits of it the way it is.

I don´t see a diffrence between half snake pod and full snake pod.
They both do the same to me.

I am looking for strong arguments but still i just get teasered by the usal PVP bla bla.

[Buggs_LeRoach]

while i may not agree with your opinion, i support your right as a player to voice it.
some mechanics in eve bring strong emotions, but it’s important to keep it in perspective and remember it’s only a game.

fwiw i was against stopping self-destruct while tackled, denying your killmail to opponents. you’re teary over a possible 2b drop, think of the poor sods losing km on multi-billion titan kills.

[Kane_Carnifex]

@Buggs_LeRoach

but it’s important to keep it in perspective and remember it’s only a game.

This!
If you feel like i have strong emotions… you miss understood my love to discuss things on a very high level. Unfortunately most people feel offended if they really get attacked in this way.
And the cruelity of the Internet let the only see attacks on a personal level.
Also why is the gramma check here not working?! This not my mother tounge and i not gonna do double spell check here.

@Buggs_LeRoach

fwiw i was against stopping self-destruct while tackled, denying your killmail to opponents

But if i selfdestruct and tackled you still will be on the Killmail
I am not 100% sure but we had a selfdestructing rolling carrier tackled and after selfdestruct we were on the killmail with no damage at all. So this should be fine but is it with PODS diffrent?
IF so need to be changed if i had contact in anykind with a selfdestructing POD i should be on the killmail as see above with the Carrier.

Why it shouldn´t stop the seldestruct timer.

You would be able to hold person infinite on grid, which is for example against the CloneBay Function from a Super which is a Endgame Feature to rejoin in a new ship.
Also it´s a 2 Minute timer which is already quite long.

Do we not gate our Supers for PVE?

[Buggs_LeRoach]

no m8 it’s been changed. self-destruct produced NO km and NO drop. i thought it was very eve-like in the way of giving a middle finger as your last act before death. similar to pulling implants

[Syzygium]

my 2 cents:

I like clear design principles in a game.
A) Players should take responsibility for their decisions.

• if you fly around with a high-value implantset to gain an advantage over your opponents, you should not have an option to remove that from the killmail (or loot pool) on demand.

B) Somewhat believable or “realistic” gameplay options, within the arbitrary boundaries of a future-tech sci-fi setting of course.

• Insertion and removal of Implants into a brain are basically neurosurgical processes, they should require either being docked at a station or at least being out-of-combat.

tldr: I am all for that being ‘fixed’. Reasons given above: I don’t like the current design and in my book EVE would become a better game by making successful PvP kills more rewarding.

[Kane_Carnifex]

Thats how you construct Arguments you have Statement and a solid facts.
If you are against it copy this schemata and we can have a constructive discussion.

Thank you very much to take your time and structure your throughts.

Thats the way if you for it or if you against it.

<3 Fly safe and dangeroursly.

[ISD_Buldath]

I have removed 6 posts for off topic remarks and edited one post to keep it On Topic.

[Kane_Carnifex]

Arguments to keep the feature as it is right now:

If money doesn´t count you could swap mid combat to diffrent set.
(–)
→ Very unlikly, there no evidance which this is actually ever done.
→ Swapping from Midgrades Crystals to Highgrade Snakes (having them in Cargo all the time)
(Main Playerbase)
->I don´t see this as a valid point for min. 80% of the playerbase.
->Nobody will throw 3B into the SINK to have minimal advantage.
->I would abysall my stuff or buy something fancy to min/max.

Other links pilot died? Luckily you had spares offline and can take over their more important links and plug in a new mindlink.
(–)
→ We have Faction Mindlinks which cover the same Bonus es the Command Ships have.
→ Let my PYFA that for you on a Stork:

STORK Shield Links without minlink have 15,9% at 95,4s | Mindlink +19,9% at 119s
STORK Armor Links without minlink have 15% at 90s | Mindlink 18,8% 112s

Compared to Sleipnir

Sleip Shield Links without minlink have 18&% at 108s | Mindlink +22,5% at 135s
Sleip Armor Links without minlink have 15% at 90s | Mindlink 18,8% 112s

(Main Playerbase)

Honestly the main playerbase only care about max DPS for PVE…
We talking about 1,1% on a Dessi and 3,7% on a Command Ship if you mindlink unbounsed links.
This so niche, that only very small amount of player would actually benefit from it.

Without the Crimson Event, it´s only about masking/deny the Killmail.
(–)

IF killmails are that major important we still have a lack of Logi on Killmails.
Beside that you can´t unplug modules from your ship to hide them from the Killmail.
I unable to find an argument for “Masking&denying” killmails, this just old fashion bad game desgin which is my main point for change so you can´t bring this argument.

(Main Playerbase)
They don´t mask killmails… only the “elite” is doing this which aren´t the major playerbase.
Thats why we call them elite… not everbody can be elite. This not how elite works.

but i think you’re overlooking a very basic tenet of eve online: tear production
(–)
Which works better if you have full POD killmails with all implants.
(Main Playerbase)
The Main playerbase is not doing it.. they even shuttle their Highgrade Snakes into smartbomb Proteus.

It’s not uncommon to see a killmail shared where the pod was halfway pulling their implants, giving a good laugh to the players who see it.
(–)
Yes, and i need to explain 20x Times to the new players what happend here until they understand, scratch their head and head one.
(Main Playerbase)
New player learn nothing from it beside wierd charater issues.
A beginner can´t pyfa back an Highgrade Snake pod to an fully abysall Orthrus.
They even don´t have the money to buy Snakes.. or use them for PVP.

Conclusion

These are all agruments from very small amount of elite players and aren´t repesenting the playerbase at all. Even if i want to do it for miners… they wouldn´t not unplug an expensive implant to just have an advantage for anóther rock to mine.

Arguments to change the feature:

You can´t unfit modules from your active ship with a combat timer.
You can´t do any fitting if you have an agression timer.
→ We already have a blocker for “to Fast” and “if you have session timer”
You can´t shoot your OWN POD to deny the killmail or drops for implants.
Killmails are major part of EVE and therefore you shouldn´t be able to manipluted your POD, since you already unable to do this for your Ship.

Only because the DEV didn´t thing about it in the past doesn´t mean its valid feature in the future.
In special if its against the nature of the overall gamemechanis (Fitting agression timer)
You can still safe stuff before combat or distract long enough to run out of timer.

Last thoughts:

I found this still super easy to argument for it but aginst it is near impossible since all the example are super niche and reflecting somekind of the Elite PVP Pilots which already playing there own game inside the game.

Also i struggle to understand why this is so big issue if the arguments are so low level.
I will discuss this fruther with Players and will give update if i find new arguments against or for it.
Stay tuned.

[MB_ThePhotographer]

Many modern warships and military aircraft these days are modular or separate models. And even though this game is set in the far future where you only have to rub 3 round rocks together that were just lying on ground to archive warp drive… The ship or pilot undocks with a certain configuration while it protects or is protected for its mission. If an unprotected miner gets popped, that was the choice for their configuration. What’s next? I can morph my mining ship into a cruiser as long as I have the same mass?

[Kane_Carnifex]

Why is this so important?

IT has HIS OWN Patchnote!

Patch Notes - Version 23.01 | EVE Online

Events/Crimson Harvest:

Chrimson Harvest has now ended.

• 90% loot drop has been disabled and returned to normal values.
  *** 50% implant drop has been disabled.**

[Gerard_Amatin]

Quite the opposite, that patch note shows this behavior no longer has any economic impact!

[Geo_Eclipse_Oksaras]

And this is from the parchnotes when the event started

Increased Loot Drops

For the duration of the event, capsuleers who are podded have a chance of dropping any implants they have installed. The implant drop rate is 50%

The Blood Raiders have bribed the Loot Fairy and, starting October 10, player ships outside of highsec will drop 90% of their loot for the duration of the event