This is the thing that bothers me about conversations on the forum. People are so close minded that they don’t take the time to examine the potential impact their suggested change would have on the rest of the game.
You’re going to impact a lot of people with your suggested change. There’s no way to simply target “only” AFK players. This is a bad change because you’re causing a LOT of extra work for real players. Do you really want to force everyone to spend 20 minutes at their keyboard hitting the F key over and over again? That’s not fun or engaging gameplay.
There’s a reason why the other weapon systems are NOT used for ratting. They’re suboptimal, require reloads, or require active commands input. In addition, you have problems with Rat Ewar, for example, Sansha rats (in the Paragon Soul and Esoteria regions) where they will Tracking Disrupt your ship, making your turrets ineffective or Guristas rats (in Venal, Tenal, Pure Blind, and Tribute) where they will ECM and jam your ship.
No other weapon system, save for potentially Fighters used by Carriers, are as ubiquitous for ratting as Drones because they are the most effective and easy to use weapons platform.
People don’t use Turret based platforms for ratting due to the many issues it has. There is no reason why Drones “must” become the same as turret based weapons. If you think this one area of the game, with VNI ratting, is sufficient to change the way an entire weapon system works, you’re being extremely close minded.
How do you know this? What proof do you have that your change with only target AFK players?
They already are. But again, it seems like you’re missing a fundamental element with how VNI ratting actually works. The drones that the VNI uses aren’t targetted by the ewar from rats, it’s only the ship itself. The drones are, for the most part, unaffected. There is a reason why the VNI is such a commonplace ship. I’m a little surprised because it seems like you’re coming to this realization only now. Have you done some research on what it’s like to run combat anomalies in nullsec?
I don’t see your point here.
Nowhere in EVE does it say that all weapons need to be equivalent to one another and there are many tradeoffs between weapon systems, and even within weapon systems, there are strategic choices you must make.
Without getting derailed, Drones are used because they are the most effective weapon system to use when ratting. Selectable damage types, unaffected by most of the ewar, and very easy to use with low skill requirements. It would be wrong to argue that all other weapon systems be buffed to be as good as Drones in PvE, because that would have ripple effects into PvP.
I was talking from perspective of my proposed change to remove aggressive drone AI. If drone boat has to actively target and send drones - then damps and ECM will become more effective against it with the little difference that drones will continue to chew last target, unless sent elsewhere again or recalled.
There was a guy who did level 4 missions for a week.
He ‘clocked in’ each day when he started and ‘clocked out’ when he finished.
Then he measured his starting isk vs ending isk and divided it by hours doing missions.
He got about 60mil/hour in what i think was a blinged out pirate ship.
People like yourself like to get fuzzy with the numbers and types of missions you run. For example, Anderson_Geten assumed that every mission was a scarlet mission when calculating their isk/hour. Other people don’t take into account travel time. Others don’t take into account tax when selling items or ‘guestimate’ prices for items.
Unless you can prove to me you can consistently make a level of isk/hour over a long period of time then frankly you may as well be claiming to make 20bil per hour and no one gives a ■■■■.
~50mil/hour is a reasonable average for level4’s in hi-sec.
Getting back to my point though, even with your made up numbers, you can make more isk/hour by cutting the grass of your neighbours and converting the pay into plex and then isk.
Technically it is possible for every mission to be Scarlet, or any other mission that can be blitzed. Agent that is offering mission takes higher standing between personal/corp/faction and declining several missions in a row until you get one you want does not incur faction standing loss. Then its just a matter of blitzing and cashing out LP.
I don’t agree with Daichi often, but have to here. I mean, I’ve seen people claim 100M ISK/hr blitzing level 3s, so high claims are nothing new.
The most reliable people I know, who do as Daichi mentioned and time/cost calculate their entire session and all income/expenses, estimate around 40-60M ISK per hour, over the span of days/weeks. Not just their best run ever.
So I agree… if you want people to believe better, show your data.
You people can’t think outside the box do you? I’m not gona share my findings so some dumb krabs can earn easy isk. But I gota tell you that 40-60 mil per hour you need to multiply it 5 times
Where exactly ? I actually exactly did as you said (clocking in and out) and the values I said were from real hours of work. Without taking random loot into account. I even gave real wallet screenshots at the beginning and the end of a session.
The 100M isk/h were ONLY from the wallet. The 100k LP/h were translated into 200M/h to DIRECT orders, assuming a 3% tax and additional 2% tax from courrier. And again, without the random loot. And this is not the best offers.
My example of scarlet was an EXAMPLE that you can get much more doing missions than what it looks, if you have correct fit. I also gave an example where I had several of them in the same hours, does not mean that I have only this mission.
50M/h in L4 is ■■■■ in HS. You make more in L3s as an alpha I think (with 1B3 worth barghest+1B alpha only implants), but I still did not take a look into a serious study. I gave the fit & implants to a friend, I’m waiting for him to get used to it and asked him to make study later on. I think it’s interesting to know how much an alpha can make in HS with real data (and though the friend in question is only playing for fun, not optimization)
I don’t give real number, but yeah they are off by several times. And I’m not particularly good.
You joined Horde and are now stabbing them in the back with this salty thread, I’m quite sure Null won’t be happy about you drawing unwanted attention from the Dev’s on this matter!
The only time ive seen you talking about isk/hour on level 4’s was a few weeks (maybe months) ago in a thread. You assessed your income based on spending 20mins or so running a scarlet mission and then multiplied up to get ‘per hour’.
I haven’t seen one where your have screen shots and are clocking in clocking out.
Deliberately didn’t link you to make a big deal out it. This thread isn’t about isk/hour but seems like we can’t get away from it.
This is not an average fit.
Going back to my claim, I’m talking reasonable average. Not maxing out. Not even upper isk making. Or blitzing SOE. The reasonable average for level4’s as achieved by reasonably average players.
And even then it doesn’t change how hours worked in real jobs provide better isk/hour than ratting in game.
No, I did not.
I gave scarlet as an example of how missions can be much more profitable than what people think, if done correctly.
Also taking 20 min for scarlet is waaay too much. Instead, I said this was the time required (rounded up) to make the 3 scarlets that I got in an hour. This was because I said you can make several and I just had had a session of less than an hour, in which I did 3 scarlets and 2 zazmatazz. I remember because that was the moment I was timing the zazz mission (I have another fit that is much faster now)
This is a very low fit. The barghest is very expensive, and after the hull the most expensive part the rigs. I think removing the hull and rigs it’s down to 200M worth in modules(including afewcheapfactions). Using more blinged modules it’s easy to reach +1B5 in price, but as I said it’s just to test if given enough money an alpha can enjoy the game, and make money, in L3s. Time will tell.
At first I gave him an almost T2 fit, and realized he struggled a bit in a “blockade” L3 ; since he has internet issues I gave him the cheap faction modules + implants to increase his tank (passive EHP/s) by 40% IIRC, and DPS by 9%.
I am average. I’ve known good people, who make 1B/h in HS. They are good and know the game much better than I do. This is not them only “bragging”, this is also them proving me they know how, by telling me how to do it - and it worked.
Indeed. But it changes that you are propagating lies about what I said.
50M/h is the worst | get when I don’t even try… for reference around two team burners is what it takes to get about 40M.
Truth is that most people avoid doing anti-empire missions - and those are the ones with crazy value in tags. There is also silence the informant l4. And few other good missions… there is quite a bit of choice for decent missions IF you don’t mind tanking some standings. Pot and Kettle 5/5 as well as Intercept the Suppliers are 2 missions for which I can state clearly - 200M/h (pot & kettle 1, 2 and 3 are quicker than burners, 4 is decent but not best)
50M is really underestimating how much you can make…
