Abyss site and Exploitation


I was previously involved in an argument with one of my corp mate regarding where to run abyssal sites and if that will be considered as illegal. I was referred by GM Baldur to come here on the forum to ask dev team for explicit definitions and rulings. Sorry if I’m in the wrong thread as there are just a lot of threads xd, please direct me to the right place.

I will copy and paste the question I asked as it’s too long for me to type again xd.

“Could you specify if the following locations are considered exploitation to run abyssal filaments:

  1. Bookmarks saved from previous Sansha Incursions activation gates. They are out of dscan range from any existing warping locations, but they can be probed out and warp to using combat probe. The only issue is people would not usually use combat probe to prob for the very outer side of the map.
  2. Bookmarks saved immediately after getting kicked out of abyssal space after daily downtime. These sites have high chances of in deep space locations showing the same features as the Sansha bookmarks.
  3. Bookmarks saved at the very edge of ESS grid effect. These sites need routine updates following ess grid change. These sites can be dscaned easily, but cannot be probed out by combat prob, thus resulting in a 100% safe location.

Please specify whether if these three types of locations are legal by EULA. And please make it standard so I won’t be in trouble for telling people which is legal and which is not. In the future I would use this if I get banned or get other people banned.”

And “ One extra thing need clarification is how long can people stay in abyssal space. If players click jump at the second gate of the abyssal space in the last x seconds (changed since its public here), the player can have infinite amount of time in the last abyssal space room without a timer. Will this be considered an exploitation?”

Thanks for reading those long paragraphs xd. Initially, GM Rex and GM Infinity gave two opposite answers to me and my corp mate. Then this trash talking corp mate of mine just being really toxic. To a degree that I feel I need to change corp to avoid this kind of uncivilized monkey. So I apologize to my fellow abyss community in advance if asking these questions may result in unfavorable results for all of us. However, I do need a clear answer from the dev teams to know specifically these situations are considered exploitative and illegal.

Dev team please consider these questions ASAP. I would assume most abyss runners use these as a safe way to run abyss, and I need a clarification to know what to tell newbies and avoid trash talkers just telling me I don’t understand English lmao.

ps: decided to change corp xd too toxic

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EVE Online has an official exploit table:

If something isn’t listed there, you can pretty much expect that it isn’t “illegal” per se.

And for your question: Most HighTier Abyssalrunner use “Deepsaves”, why should it be an exploit? Other players still can find it and warp to it. They are found and ganked every so often. It’s not like they are hiding in some spot nobody can find them and/or warp to them.

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Yeah, it’s not on that table currently and the three GMs having different subjective opinions on this case. GM Rex told me specifically that the bookmarks outside dscan range can be exploitative. So I want to ask the dev team to specify that, and if dev team decided that is legal, please put that in the legal table.

And for the question you asked. Yes other players can still find it and warp to it, but no one is gonna probe the edge of the map for every system they go. Using my personal scenario, I’m in null sec and I can find a corner or quiet space to do abyss using deep saves. No one can know that I am doing abyss. No roaming fleets are gonna warp to me. Because they can’t dscan me out at any warpable location, they would just assume that the space is empty and move on. Unless someone looked at zkb, find my kill mail and decided to camp me wherever I go with the help of locating agent. Other than these professional abyss gankers, it is a pretty much guaranteed safe location.

That is just my opinion, I do abyss from time to time, so if that is legal I have nothing to complain about. But GMs gave two opposite opinions and one neutral opinion suggesting that could be subjective based on the GMs since it is not explicitly stated out by CCP. If I keep using these techniques, I am unsure if this will involve in a ban or other forms of punishments. And if I am instructing newbies these techniques, I don’t want to cause troubles for their accounts because of my suggestion.

Especially that the last stated exploitation regarding LP points is caused by someone in my alliance for angel titan blueprints. Although ccp did not permanently banned him, but he did suffer forms of punishments. I want to avoid that.

PS I dont want to rain on your parade because it seems like you are asking a genuine question for clarity but afaik GM correspondence on the forums or anywhere is prohibited. Might want to check those posts.

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Ohhh, alright, was thinking that might be an issue, let me delete those then, thx!

The answer is quite simple: if there is a chance that it could be an exploit, don’t do it, or don’t complain afterwards if you are penalized.

In this case, there is no specific mention of your case in the official rules on https://support.eveonline.com/hc/en-us/articles/204873262-Known-Declared-Exploits.


Yeah, not really gonna complain about it. The first reply mentioned this site as well, but the question is could dev team determine if this is exploitative before they decide to punish. For the same reference I used with that reply above, CCP added the last public exploit after that person in my alliance put all materials in for angel titan production. If he asked ccp ahead of time and determined that he should/should not do that, then he wouldn’t lose those mats as punishment. CCP just added that to the list after he was published.

However if the dev teams are at their full capacity already, then I guess there are no choices but to risk getting that first warning when they finally have the capacity to look at this issue and decide it’s illegal.

Since this is kind of a grey area based on the rules and GMs, I guess the best option is then to inform the newbies to use these methods at their own risk then.

But I still want to ask the dev to look at it though, just to avoid unnecessary risk.

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So , do nothing due to fear of getting banned instead of seeking clarification?


If even GM’s among themselves cannot give a clear answer to the question: yes

GM said they are not the one in CCP to give defined rulings and these are situational exploitative, so… xd. And if needed, come to forum and ask dev teams for the standard and rulings.


1&2 not exploits. Guys with bookmarks outside dscan range die anyway

Stormbringer | Jas Hekk | Killmail | zKillboard (last one lol) Also abyssal bookmarking process is partially used in “abyssal tunneling” exploit yet if you read its description the base mechanic isnt prohibited just “the whole” interaction.

Afaik 3rd one is currently in grey zone, someone mentioned that devs are already have their look on it. I think there is good chance it will be fixed in upcoming nullsec expansion.

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Tbh, I still have zero idea of how they did abyssal tunneling xd. I only got kicked out of abyss in the same system.

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Damn, lmao, there are even tutorials. I guess elite wh groups and at ship smugglers will hate this guy forever now : )

CCP needs to start retro-banning more players.

Or maybe fix relevant issues, shouldn’t be that hard to let everyone who is inside a filament when DT hits either drop out at the Star’s grid of his origin system, or even better, restart inside the abyssal filament as if he had just entered it and needing to fight his way out the normal way.

They can do both.

And can I ask who the toxic guy was

We need to work on your detective skills police girl