If the only reason somebody is playing a game for is vanity projects that are useless in the game, then there is something seriously wrong with that person’s rational for playing a game. Not saying it’s right or wrong, but the REST of the community for that game should need to bend to useless endeavors of the vain.
That’s your beef with MR if true…not mine…
I’ve changed my mind.
I now think it should be as OP wants.
I strongly advocate ccp issues every member of sabus’ corp an outfitted cap or supercap of their choice and automagically gives them all the skills to fly it at V as well. Only stipulation is that they all must immediately launch a crusade against nullsec.
Does forum crusade count?
I understand CCP’s move with handing that revenue off to players, but if CCP didn’t foresee the majority of it going to nullsec blocs then they were kidding themselves. I agree with you here that this was a bad move.
Allowing Titans and Supers into hisec would only compound that failure though. Such a move would allow nullsec blocs to directly defend the hisec trade hubs they already have and squash anyone else’s that exists or gets anchored. Instead of getting only most of that revenue, they’d almost be assured to have all of it. It would be just another nullsec buff.
I see lots of folks in this thread worried about capital ships farming ISK in hisec, and quite frankly I’m not that worried about it. What I’m more worried about is the fact that structures owned by anyone not allied with a major nullsec bloc (or paying one of them for protection) will likely get wiped out turning the “Blue Donut” into a “Blue CIrcle”. That level of competition stifling is bad for the game.
There absolutely needs to be space where the supercapital umbrella cannot reach.
That’s not a vanity project. That’s PvP…
I’m not arguing the validity of play-styles as people should do what they want to do…but demanding the WHOLE GAME accommodate ones feeling of entitlement to build what they want should be argued against if all it is for is a vanity project. There is a huge difference there.
My main is collecting skins…Does not effect anyone negatively (game play wise) and within the current rules structure. That is a vanity project.
When have I suggested anyone should bend over to anything?
People arguing for titian and supers in HS are…not sure if you did specifically…but I actually didn’t say you either so…
So… if they are not for PvP… and not for PvE either… maybe the new highsec capitals should just lose the ability to undock?
I didn’t. Stop making straw man arguments.
I’ve answered this exact question easily 10 times. It gives players in hgihsec a high end shiny trophy to aspire towards which drives activity.
But why would they aspire towards a ship that is literally useless except for showing off how much ISK they can afford to throw away? Capitals are something to aspire towards because they are the most powerful ships in the game, take that away and there’s nothing left to care about.
If someone wants to build a giant shiny trophy and enjoys the long process of doing that, then let them.
It’s not that simple. Adding features takes developer time and there is a long list of things that would be a better use of that investment than giving a tiny handful of people the ability to build a useless trophy ship.
All I’ve seen is people saying “I like titans and supers but I play in highsec, it would be nice if I could also play with titans and supers without having to join a null blob”.
But you don’t offer them what they want. You offer to let someone ship spin a capital in highsec but not play with it in any meaningful way.
And I’m not sure how many times folks have to mention this, but somehow “excluding” a certain class of ship from participating in PvP based on region is a downright laughable notion. To “exclude” a ship from PvP, that means that it must be able to neither aggress another player nor be aggressed by another player. This would give a player in space absolute immunity from other players which is a state of affairs that is so utterly broken that I can’t even believe that I’m having to bring it up.
This goes against everything that EvE stands for inasmuch as with any other ship, in any other region, once you undock you become both target and aggressor.
But what content in high can’t you do?
Can’t fit miner II on an Avatar for fun. Can’t use any other capital as well.
And this is the key, it does not matter if the uses are limited for the ship, the amount of people who will want to have one, and will be willing to buy skins for it, would make player retention in the game higher, and make CCP more money.
When a few hundred of them are burning down the Trade Hubs in Perimeter ask that question again.
Umm, harden up salt foambreaker, you telling me nullsec can’t deploy a super/titan fleet in highsec to go defend them?
I’ve changed my mind.
I now think it should be as OP wants.
I strongly advocate ccp issues every member of sabus’ corp an outfitted cap or supercap of their choice and automagically gives them all the skills to fly it at V as well. Only stipulation is that they all must immediately launch a crusade against nullsec.
You have yourself a deal
Yup, not only does the player remain in the game and as an omega because he now has a big goal to aspire towards (Faction titan is the ultimate trophy for bragging rights and it’ll take awhile to get there) the change also gives increased revenue for CCP, all the skins on the NES store will now actually have customers, as people make their trophy shinier or with a color that they like.
And most importantly, it’s omega only, highsec is limited to faction battleships as toys, you can fly those as an alpha and you get them relatively quickly, after that nothing else to aspire to. But getting that Molok or Kommodo will take awhile to earn ingame, or a decent chunk of plex to be bought, and enjoying it will always require your account to be omega. More player retention, more plex/omega purchased, a better game for all players, and more money for the developers.
I understand CCP’s move with handing that revenue off to players, but if CCP didn’t foresee the majority of it going to nullsec blocs then they were kidding themselves. I agree with you here that this was a bad move.
Allowing Titans and Supers into hisec would only compound that failure though. Such a move would allow nullsec blocs to directly defend the hisec trade hubs they already have and squash anyone else’s that exists or gets anchored. Instead of getting only most of that revenue, they’d almost be assured to have all of it. It would be just another nullsec buff.
I see lots of folks in this thread worried about capital ships farming ISK in hisec, and quite frankly I’m not that worried about it. What I’m more worried about is the fact that structures owned by anyone not allied with a major nullsec bloc (or paying one of them for protection) will likely get wiped out turning the “Blue Donut” into a “Blue CIrcle”. That level of competition stifling is bad for the game.
There absolutely needs to be space where the supercapital umbrella cannot reach.
Remember that you still have NPC areas to store and buy stuff in, slight increase is tax is worth the 100% safety. And who says highsec can’t slowly accumulate their own capital umbrella? I’m sure CCP can release features to help prevent this structure purge as you describe it, perhaps a very powerful triglavian laser, that spools up dps with no cap, and is effective only against capitals? (a nice idea proposed by a fellow highsec resident) Or the other extreme that Lucas proposes, no or severely limited offensive capability for capitals, either through a broad capital nerf ingame, or limitations on superweapons with the retainment of guns and fighters, as I proposed in the original post.
Capitals should not be an end goal in this game, if it is players will leave with how easy this could be achieved if they are allowed in high sec thus making them quit after building them and getting bored flying them around.
Capitals should not be an end goal in this game, if it is players will leave with how easy this could be achieved if they are allowed in high sec thus making them quit after building them and getting bored flying them around.
Then you want to remove capitals from the game, have the largest ships be battleships and freighters/orca, and encourage massive wars and rewards for winning them, similar to the early days of EVE.
Failing that, you need capitals across the game, so everyone can aspire to get one, and be able to obtain one.
Everyone can aspire to one, and everyone can obtain one. You just have to leave hisec.
Some players probably aspire to own their own little piece of sovereign space. Does that mean that we should allow players to claim sovereignty in hisec too?
Some players probably aspire to experience epic fleet battles under the system-wide effects of C6 wormholes which change all of the typical rules of warfare. Should we place system-wide wormhole effects in hisec too?
Some players probably aspire to tracking down an NPC officer spawn and claiming its loot for themselves instead of having to pay radically high prices on the market. Should we move officer spawns to hisec too?
Using “aspiration” as a motivation to allow something in hisec is patently ludicrous. Give me a game mechanics reason, give me a lore-based reason, give me anything other than players whining about being denied “end game content” because they aren’t wiling to do what it takes to achieve it.
Hisec players are only denied access to capital ships because of their own choices, not game mechanics.
EDIT: Also…what about all of the players that did aspire to fly capital ships and put in the work, and took the extra risk, to fly them outside of hisec? By using “aspiration” as a motivation to allow capitals into hisec, you’re basically crapping all over their aspirations, not to mention all of their hard work.
…
You seem to be very confused here. The nullsec alliances are the ones who will be burning down the trade hubs with supercapital blobs, why would they be defending the things they are attacking?
Posterity 
Outed for not knowing what a sandbox is.
Stop lying. Nowhere have I ever said that I reject all changes.
If someone enjoys the idea of building a massive trophy, how does it impact you?
Because it requires spending finite development resources to make major changes to how the game works in order to support this. It’s not as simple as spending a few minutes to add a capital hull with no module slots or drones to the game as a “trophy ship” for people to waste money on, you’re talking about a significant effort for something that very few people are ever going to use.
OK, then they can divert their attention to something else in highsec. Maybe they can make PvE more readily farmable.
Yes, because that is definitely the dilemma CCP is faced with here…
/sarcasm, because otherwise you won’t get it
It’s convenient that you use the excuse “but muh developer time” for anything you don’t like, but if CCP were to put effort into developing something you do like it’d be totally fine.
Yes, it is absolutely shocking that I am fine with CCP spending finite development resources on changes that I think are good, but not ok with CCP spending it on changes I don’t want. Did you also know that water is wet?
But by that logic EVE stops being a sandbox, because it becomes standard linear progression. You move through the game and end up in a nullsec alliance for end game. I’m pretty sure new players wouldn’t stick around long if they knew the end game required you to be enslaved to one of the major nullsec powers in the game.
Your whole argument here is nonsense. You complain that EVE stops being a sandbox because it has a linear progression, but then you also complain about new players not being able to reach the capital endgame without being “enslaved” to one of the major nullsec powers. If capitals are such an important endgame thing then EVE already has a linear progression, regardless of whether or not they are in highsec.
It’s also a nonsense argument because even under your proposal you still have to leave highsec to actually use the ship you aspire to own. So how exactly is your version of EVE any more of a sandbox than what we have now?
Highsec players by definition play in highsec
And this is the problem: “highsec player” is a self-imposed limit. They have access to capital ships, they have just made the choice to play the game in a way that does not involve using capital ships. At any point they can make a different choice and go use capital ships like every other player who wishes to do so. Complaining about this makes about as much sense as complaining that “frigate players” can’t use battleships, so therefore we need to make a frigate battleship for them to fly.
PS: “highsec players” are also denied the ability to claim sovereignty over systems. Do we now need to add that feature to highsec as well?
PPS: “highsec players” are also denied the ability to shoot anyone they want at any time without CONCORD intervention. Do we need to remove CONCORD from highsec?