Came back from break -4 Billion ISK

I dont understand, first you said in other thread that someone scammed you, impersonating other player, then you write you scammed someone else, and gm removed ISK from you. Do you scam yourself with your own alts, impersonating yourself? WHAT IS GOING ON?

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What other thread?

It’s not a scam, it is using an Exploit as far as I understood from the reddit post.

The “Scammer” uses an Exploit to change the ISK-amount without the victim having to re-confirm accept. Actually it’s the perfect ground for being perma-banned.

OP might have opened pandoras box. Because he couldn’t accept that someone challenged his Exploit, he had to ramble about it and might possibly lose all his assets now. Lol.

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That existed since beta and CCP has been aware of it for literally 15 years and didn’t change anything. It’s not an exploit proven by their own inaction to patch it.

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Busted…

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Classic case of interpreting a statement for one’s own gain. The bolded part does not give a pardon to any kind of scams. It means only scams, which do not violate game mechanics, are allowed.

So when players scam using the trade window, which is a mechanic designed to make trading safe, and then is abuse for scams, will this definitely not be OK with CCP.

You mean OP wanted to recover ISK by scamming GM? I have to put on my tinfoil hat for this.

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OP simply needs to HTFU and accept the consequences of scamming…

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I don’t gain anything by that. I haven’t scammed anyone ingame in a long time, and I have never been into it very much. I am just too kind. :slight_smile:

I didn’t mean you specifically. I only saw the quoted part and knew that’s going to get misinterpreted badly.

From what I read on reddit, this wasn’t a regular trade window scam, it was using an Exploit.

And now he is trying to escape the consequences it seems.

Yeah but we have 2 stories here. OP says it was a regular scam, reddit says he was using an Exploit in the Trade Window.

That’s why I actually think this whole thing is fishy. OP either using an Exploit or being involved in some RMT-scheme seems more likely than him being a victim of overzealous GM.

Fair enough, but didn’t they state somewhere that using any part of the program against its intended purpose can be considered an exploit? They should probably do something with it, because right now the only viable way to avoid being the victim of that ?exploit? is to not use the trade window at all.

It might have been like this: OP tries to scam the guy with this Azbel. Victim calls GM because the trade window didn’t ask for confirmation after OP changed the ISK amount. GM realizes something is fishy, but doesn’t realize OP was using a (possible) exploit. GM transfers money to Victim. OP opens another ticket, stating that Victim try to impersonate a friend of OP and that’s why OP send the money (which really the GM send). OP is unsuccessful with his ticket, either because GM team realizes it is the same case or because OP didn’t deliver enough reason for them to believe the impersonation story.

Then OP simultaneously opens two threads here, trying to sell us this one case as two different stories. Same on Reddit.

That’s why discussing GM is not allowed on this forum.
People are very likely to “forget” they were abusing system to throw discredit on CCP.

Right, but isn’t that ultimately a bit stupid of them? Scams are a part of EVE and should be protected. Using Exploits is not. If OP indeed used an Exploit and was lucky enough to not get caught, he should have been smart enough to keep his mouth shut about it.

There are scams based on human nature (i.e. exploiting gullible players) and there are scams based on mechanics (exploits of mechanics). The later is obviously bad, because it goes against CCP and not simply another player.

Messing with players is fine, messing with the game and CCP is not, and this has to be understood as the first rule by anyone who tries to scam in EVE.

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We can but we shouldn’t. This is not a genuine case of whistleblowing but if people want to gossip without having the full facts to hand who can stop them. vOv

We should not have seen the GMs response, but we have. So there’s no reason to ignore it now. Nowhere in his response did the GM claim that he ruled this way because it was an exploit.

I’m not saying that OP wasn’t using an exploit, but had this decision been made because of an exploit, would the response not explain that?

Yeah, that’s the even weirder part. I could imagine CCP being aware that the trade window lag thing was declared an exploit back in 2009, but they didn’t properly fix it, so for now they don’t punish people using it, they just fulfill the trade if they get a ticket.

Because, if the GM had ruled or even seen this as using an Exploit, OP would potentially be already banned.

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All that needed to be posted here was to request the ticket be escalated or looked into by another Senior GM. The validity of scamming was never in question simply whether or not this scam was within the rules

Agreed. Unless there really was some unpublished change to how CCP deals with scams. Were there any recent court rulings or new laws put into effect that might tighten CCPs possibilities to ensure a scam-friendly in-game environment?

P.S. I think scams are an important part of the game, but I’ve always thought CCP must be riding the razors edge, legally speaking.