My purpose is to communicate effectively with any culture, prejudicing this function seems counterproductive.
Cause and effect becomes simultaneously muddled when dealing with quantum effects my scientist sistren inform me. Yet you are quite right to question my command of the subject.
How would you categorise the Intaki on that scale?
Probably as property you can auction-off âŚlike slaves
Thatâs similar to what I thought before coming to the Empire. A few close encounters with Blood Raiders and other Sani Sabik later I kind of think the Amarr have the right idea: when in doubt, burn them.
(If youâre going to be empathetic even towards the Caldari you should try a little harder to see where theyâre coming from and why. Itâs not especially tricky, relatively speaking; empathy hard-mode is the Triglavians.)
(Nightmare is the Drifters.)
The Intaki as a culture have repeatedly had at least elements who sided with the Caldari here and there. They might not be quite as close as the Achura (whom the Caldari recognize as kin, which is nice of them considering they found us in our iron age and could have crushed us as a matter of course), but theyâre definitely sympathetic in a way most Federal cultures ⌠arenât.
Looking into the history of Morduâs Legion might give you some idea.
The Heth regime was famously high-handed, and not just in that. Also Caldari society is almost entirely organized around the megacorporations, so who else did you expect to step in to administrate conquered territory? Treating them as prizes to be auctioned was the high-handed bit; having the megas see to it was just ⌠well, probably necessary.
Are we really going to keep doing the âYour Imperialism is worse than our Imperialismâ game?
Itâs been barely a decade since it was illegal for ethnic Caldari to own mining rights or enterprises on Caldari Prime - which by the way is one of very few harvestable resources Caldari Prime has. This was a practice that had been in place since the Federation drove our ancestors from Home over two hundred years ago. Do I even need to mention how ethnic Caldari on Caldari Prime were also living in districts that were akin to ghettos?
Donât take this as support for the auctioning off of Intaki by the State - take it as rebuttal for the hypocrisy here attempting to demonize the State for standard operating practice across the cluster. Personally, I hope to see the Intaki free to self-determine whether that be with the State, Federation or Independent.
Thatâs something I really donât think the Gallente understand. The megacorps ARE our government, the CEP is simply the agreed upon oversight where we all hash out our concerns and that control parts of the State that we all agree no one mega should have complete ownership of. Thereâs a reason that the Navy, for all itâs skill and ability, is still considered a bit inferior to individual megacorporate security forces. The best of the best are taken by the Mega, the worst of the best go to the Navy.
It should be noted that this auction covered the systemsâ development rights, not the literal ownership of them and all the people in them. This is an extremely far cry from literal chattel slavery - if youâre confused, ask the Amarr to show you the difference some time.
For an outsider itâs a bit of a tricky concept after all. The Gallente hear âcorporationâ and think of their own private business interests (bonus points for assumed disinterest in matters political that do not directly touch said business and a lack of concern for the common good).
The reality that itâs maybe closer to an Amarrian-style feudal domain, only less inherently-militarized and with way more social mobility due to the meritocracy at all levels but the very, very top, might hide a little behind the terminology. As does the point that in the end the corporations exist to serve the Caldari, not the other way around.
(Come to think of it even the megas have forgotten that sometimes.)
I feel like maybe Mr. en Divalone has lived all his life so far from anybody who actually practiced slavery that itâs become a rhetorical device instead of something easily imagined as somebodyâs concrete, lived reality.
Your comment reads like it was a wordly way of living among society practicing slavery properly and any disgust towards it or scorn should be regarded as backwardness. You seem to put it all upside down when looking from my perspective.
There is no real difference between corporate subjection (in The Caldari State) or feudal subjection (in The Amarr Empire). The difference lays in wording solely. The practical outcome for the subjects is the same. They all require some form of permission from above their heads to do anything unless they own enough shares or nobility. The rest are human resources or serfs. Or worse: non-entities or slaves.
And we can discuss it (well actually we are still arguing about it despite all the effort to not to, how sad) as long as you want.
It must be very difficult to go through life with words defined so loosely as to be very nearly devoid of definite meaning.
Dude, you literally argued that mineral rights are tantamount to slavery. Just stop. Youâre making âI donât like slaveryâ look bad.
But Federal society doesnât? Baseliner citizens can just go mining for resources wherever they like? Massive public events can just go on anywhere, anytime? Nothing ever requires things like permits and licenses? Howâs that not needing âpermission from above their headsâ? The Black Eagles arenât famous for their repressive cruelty inside the Federation?
Is it time to start saying Federal Citizens are a bunch of slaves because if you donât pay your taxes, The Man comes and hauls you off to jail, just like a feudal serf who doesnât pay his rents?
Yes - there is. Caldari citizens arent drugged out of their mind with Vitoc and forced into hard manual labor under pain of physical absue or death. Every Caldari citizen recieve education and even financial aid from State and assess their strength and weakness for career placements. Even then nothing prevents an employee from terminating their contract and working for another Corporation or even leaving the State all together.
This is a failed comprarison in every way possible - move on.
Good - now explain to me how keeping ethnic Caldari in ghetos, stealing their property and preventing even their decendents from owning such property for two hundred years is somehow âOKâ in your worldview.
Are you tying to convince me that green apple and ripe apple are two different fruits? Like two distinct words always mean two distinct things?
Please point me to any part of my arguments that indicate I care not of meaning? The only thing that comes to my mind is my stubborn insistence on slavery practice by The State and your reluctance to see the stark similarities with that of The Empire? I see the difference between the two. Just like see the difference between the green and ripe apples.
I really pitty for your lack of seeing the general picture here and instead going in lengths and dissecting everything into tiny details naming them distinctively and loosing touch with said general meaning.
Iâm just going to let this sentence fragment stand as its own rebuttal.
And this, taken out of context Is the example of how sincere your arguments are?
How about all of the posts where you insist common capitalist practices that the laissez-faire Federation tends to engage in even more than the zaibatsu State does (where capitalist economics are yoked to serving the needs of society, rather than being for the unfettered accumulation of individual wealth) are somehow the equivalent of enslavement in the State, but not in the Federation, where a founding member system was just subject to unilateral military occupation without their foreknowledge or consent, had their security status changedâagain, without consultation with the systemâs local elected governmentâand is still seeing even more military build-up despite centuries-old agreements between the Federal member-states that grant that particular founding member system even more autonomy than normal.
Thank you, I appreciate that.
Despicable
I mean, strictly speaking, a green apple and a ripe apple are two distinct things, even if theyâre the same species of fruit. Itâd be kind of ridiculous to claim that the two arenât distinct, when youâre actively drawing a distinction between them.
Rather, you wanted an example where, letâs say, you argue that a âballâ and a âsphereâ are two distinct words, but can definitely refer to exactly the same thing: a distinction without effective difference. But instead, you decided to get into an argument about semantics with someone who is a) better than you about it, b) not taking you seriously at all because you frankly donât deserve it, and c) quite possibly waiting to see how long heâd have to do it before a post like this one happened.
EDIT: Also, since Iâm being pedantic, you meant âtwo distinct termsâ, since, you know, âgreen appleâ and âripe appleâ are, well, either three or four words, depending on whether you count apple twice as a single word in your accounting. The distinct words would be âgreenâ and âripeâ, and I think even youâd have to agree, those âtwo distinct wordsâ do, even in context, mean two distinct and not at all congruent or equivalent things.
So ⌠let me sketch a personal reality for you, Mr. en Divalone.
I am, personally, literally a servant. Iâm an oath-bound retainer; I live my life in sworn service to a certain respected Amarrian commoner. Itâs not something society dictates, not a commonplace structure in either her society or mine, though itâs an arrangement with traditional roots in both our societies.
So, yes, I do require permission to do a wide variety of things. But I would not compare my position to that of an actual slave. Not ever.
A key reason: I chose my mistress. I bound my will to anotherâs, but I did so freely. More than that, our oath has a mutual element: I serve, but my service is to be taken seriously. I am not property to be bought and sold, or a toy to be used and abused for anyoneâs amusement. (And yes, I also mean like that.)
I live a life on bended knee, but Iâm the one who chose to bend it, and I am nobodyâs property and nobodyâs toy. This is the way of things for many who serve others.
The same canât be said for a slave, however, in Imperial space or anywhere else.