Dev blog: Moon mining revamped - There’s Ore in Them Thar Moons


(Nevyn Auscent) #522

Except it was nearly all the Bounty isk faucet before carrier ratting. Which was still a massive amount. Smaller per pilot but volume makes up for a lot of that. That said, CCP have made a number of changes that have made it harder yes, and the move here towards more active income is good also.

(Sgt Ocker) #523

Nevyn Auscent
Except it was nearly all the Bounty isk faucet before carrier ratting. Which was still a massive amount. Smaller per pilot but volume makes up for a lot of that. That said, CCP have made a number of changes that have made it harder yes, and the move here towards more active income is good also.

Hmmm, “before carrier ratting”.
Prior to the carrier/fighter changes that made it impossible to passively rat with them, AFK carrier ratting was the easiest way to make isk that didn’t involve owning pos’s.

Who is it you expect to see benefit from the new activity intense moon mining? Small groups, large groups, individuals, PVP’rs?
Who will be the losers in the changes? Like most things Eve, you have those who do well from certain changes and even more who don’t.
Where exactly do you see the income from moons ending up - Personal, Corp or Alliance wallets?

(Nevyn Auscent) #524

‘AFK Ratting’ is what I was referring to, not specifically to VNI’s. I’m well aware of what was used.

Who I expect to see benefit from the new moon mining depends on the area of space. Individuals I don’t expect to change much, in terms of ‘solo’ players in NPC corps. Not on this iteration, if it moved into high sec in some form I could see that changing based on what settings etc corps were allowed for who can access the ore field without penalty.
Really I expect it to be mainly still to the benefit of large groups with PVP’ers getting a small side benefit. However it being to the benefit of a large group isn’t something I have an issue with, the problem was with the passive nature and how it didn’t encourage the group to work together on it, not with who it benefited.

Who will lose, anyone ‘hostile’ to a nearby super power who can simply N+1 any kind of defence escalation that they attempt to do. Since rather than an annoying POS bash for a lower value moon you can now turn up and pew some ships. That is more a symptom of the super capital superiority certain groups have, and the plain fact that no-one is going to challenge that from an external point at this stage in the game, (CCP’s demographics on age of average pilots in those alliances, and how many years they have had to build their stockpiles make that abundantly clear). So it doesn’t really matter what the mechanic is, those same people lost anyway, because they couldn’t hold any ‘good’ moons before anyway.

So yeah, overall I don’t see a huge change. I see a bit more of the income landing in personal wallets in Null, Low especially more will land in personal wallets, but yeah, it won’t be an earth shattering world ending revamp, it’s just a much better mechanic than the old moon mining.

(Marox Calendale) #525

Will we get a special Eve Trailer for Moon Mining close to its release? The mechanic itself provides enough information for a short Movie also. :wink:

(Bjorn Tyrson) #526

your right, it will depend a lot on the area of space. However I actually see this being better for smaller organizations that border super powers. particularly in NPC null.
For example, in the pocket I live in, there are several small corps. and there are also a good number of moons, however most (if not all, its been a while since I checked) of those moons are “owned” by a nearby group.

Even if all of us banded together, we can’t possibly take them on, couldn’t even take out a tower without being dropped on. and there isn’t even much we can do to disrupt their cash flow, since all they need to do is slip a blockade runner through once a week or so. and they can do that any time they want when its quiet.

but with the new changes, taking out a citadel wouldn’t actually be required. not only would they need to organize mining fleets to travel outside their home area. but we would also have a window for when those mining fleets would be coming through.

and its a lot easier to drop some bombs on a mining op, particularly one you know is coming than it is to try and intercept a lone blockade runner that could come through whenever.

What that means is it will be much more inconvenient for the large group to actually sit on those moons. it gives more opportunities for us to be a thorn in their side and disrupt their moon activity. which in turn means a greater chance of taking those moons for ourselves simply by making them more bother than they are worth.

now that is only one example, from just one tiny pocket of space, but I have a hard time believing that a situation like this is completely unique. no it will not allow smaller entities to stand toe to toe with the big boys. but it will give more opportunities for them to be a thorn in their side, which is often all it takes to carve out a space for yourself.

(Nana Skalski) #527

your left :guardparrot:

(Bjorn Tyrson) #528

YOUR PANTS!!! runs away crying

(Zetakya) #529

No. What it will mean is that it’ll be much more inconvenient for them to actually mine the moon. It’ll be tremendously easy to just put up a drill and leave it idle to prevent you from profiting from it. Doesn’t even cost fuel.

(Corraidhin Farsaidh) #530

Actually that could be a problem if abused, Just spam a bunch of refineriesonto neighbouring moons to deny access and drive up prices. I’d imagine it would be difficult for smaller entities to dislodge them.

(Bjorn Tyrson) #531

and how is that any different from now, where they just put up a pos to mine the moon, and not only do they deny access, but they profit from it as well.

it also opens up more possibilities for that corp to rent out the moons.
as things currently stand, we have a whole bunch of PoS’s in our pocket that only our large neighbor can profit from.

With the changes, we will actually have a viable means of counter-play to disrupt their profits. and I know that some of the industrial corps would GLADLY pay for mining rights to those moons. currently there is no reason or incentive for them to agree to giving up some moons, since the work required to maintain them is so minimal.

and with the refineries tracking who mines from the belt and how much it would be easy to arrange billing… its almost like that style of play was an intentional design choice.

(Zetakya) #532

Or we could put a drill on the moon and just leave it there, while scarcity drives the prices up and there’s nothing you can do about it because we don’t even have to fuel it anymore and we’ll squash your Alliance flat if you try and destroy it.


(Frostys Virpio) #533

Welcome to EVE online, where there is strength in numbers. Sorry for the small entity but while your way of playing the game are 100% valid, that does not mean they are optimal.

(Hallvardr) #539

Hey CCP…

While I do not foresee myself participating in moon mining, (who can say) I did want to comment on a bit of detail that you’ve mentioned for the UI design.

“If you missed the moon” then no results will display.
“If the moon does not contain any minable materials.” then no results will display.

Here you have two possible outcomes with the same report, “no results will display.”! In this case, no news it not good (or helpful) news.

Might I suggest that for the condition “If you missed the moon”, you give a "no detected targets"
And for the condition “moon does not contain any minable materials.” you give a “nothing of value detected” or some such display vs a blank stare.

When you have two fail conditions that both equal “no info displayed” as the results, the user would be left with “WTF, what went wrong?” condition.

(Thonys Visser) #540

Well as a single miner in HS… can you do moon mining there in HS as a single player …??

i rest my case…

its all for the big corporations in 0.0 and low

don t let them fool you.

(Frostys Virpio) #541

You can’t do it before the change either. What’s the problem?

(Osa Engawa) #542

I’ve never ganked a miner but every post I read like this one brings me that much closer.

(Iowa Banshee) #543

Combining personal and alliance income would be wrong if an alliance without people could have an income - it does not.

When you control a corporation that has income earned through an alliance it is personal income.

(Scipio Artelius) #544

Passive income sources will just change as a result of this.

Renting remains and as good passive income, Alliances will look to increase their renting space where they can.

Citadels, especially highsec markets, can be extremely profitable in the right locations. So large null Alliances will likely begin influencing alternative trade hub systems even more.

(Thonys Visser) #545

.as a single player i can not moon mine because the moons are all occupied by clans
.beeing in a npc clan (because of the restrictions by hs war decks ,as a miner)you can not participate in moon mining in HS
.moon mining is HS the setup is just to expensive , if you look at the income gathered in HS (refund over time is shit)
and many more reasons…
and it is not only moon mining

in general mining is a decease for the developers from the ccp corporation they can not implement it without grief towards miners

just to give you a small example a miner is HS can make about 25 mil an hour in HS
in the other regions they can do up to over 200 mil a hour and that is called completely fair …?

the rorqual can mine in 0.0 and < 0.5 (a dedicated ship for that region ) (well great for you)
where is a mining vessel comparrible for HS ? it is not there (dedicated for HS ) it sucks for many)

so yep, here you can see the fundamental problem with eve for HS >>>> the total neglection of the csm and the developers team, it is all for the big boys… and the Owh… so… wunderfull …people of eve (like ccp calls them)

Also something that players seems to forget(not ccp) is " ALL the miners "in HS are plex payers ,what a contrast is nt it…
and that is something you dont see back in the game…

owh… before i forget o7

(Thonys Visser) #546

o.0 well welcome to the dark force…(i quess)
The force is great…
and i never ganked a miner …only gankers