Dev blog: New Alpha Training Option

Because ISK doesn’t pay CCP’s bills. CCP wants most of these to be bought with Alphas directly buying PLEX from CCP with real world money.

Your suggestion is basically “why don’t they just give this away for free, instead of trying to make money so they can run their business?”

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Alphas stays Alphas cause they do not use RL money to play that game. What on earth makes you think, that they will buy PLEX for real money to get extra SP? They will grind ISK, what ever ISK they need, to buy 20 PLEXes… If Alpha is willing to pay RL money, he will buy Omega time.

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False, Alphas are Alphas because they don’t pay an ongoing monthly subscription. Just because someone doesn’t pay $15/month, doesn’t mean they will never pay a one-time fee of say $5.

Also false. Alpha or Omega status do not provide any indication of who has or has not paid RL money to CCP, as an Alpha could have bought PLEX to sell for ISK or to buy things from the NES and an Omega could have in-game PLEXed by grinding ISK to buy the 500 PLEX.

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It’s not like they already have a plan to earn money from customers that is called “subscription”. But CCP has no idea how to convince fresh players who do not already want to pay them to pay subscription. Instead of working on really making fresh players want to subscribe (via good gameplay, good pastime content, fewer gameplay ruining bugs, fixing balance issues, and so on and so forth), they do everything to milk those who don’t via other ways. And milk already paying subscribers double by hiding ever increasing amounts of content behind the paywall. That’s a great plan to ensure they “can run their business”. Top job. :+1:

Exactly what part of Eve game play do existing subscribers have to pay extra for?

Yes, and now they have a new plan which is not a subscription. Is it a problem that there are now two ways to pay for the game? A subscription is generally a bad financial model, it only does well in situations where the seller doesn’t expect the buyer to actually use it (win for the seller), or in the rare cases where the buyer actually uses it more than expected (win for the buyer).

Imagine a gym that sells membership subscriptions, most members don’t really use the subscription, but they have to buy the whole month because it isn’t sold with daily access. Well, the Eve online “gym” has just said, instead of buying a membership, you can just pay for a single day of training.

All those presumption of yours (" doesn’t mean", “could have bought” etc) collide with the simple fact: since Alpha clones were introduced into the game, amount of PLEXes on the market remains around 1 300 000 pieces. If Alphas would ever buy “$5” packages in any sugnificant numbers, it would be reflected in PLEX’s market history. And there is no single reason to think, that new item will force them to start spending RL money instead of ISK on it. As I say - amount of PLEX sold and bought satys, amount of players lowers, price is rising. Alphas use ISK to buy PLEX and drive PLEX prices up. They will be even more doing so, if they will see 20 PLEX achievable target instead of 500 hardly achievable target.
Now back to topic: what is the problem with making new injectors available for ISK, and not a PLEX? Why we need two game currencies for simple in game items? Why PLEX can not stay as means of getting Omega time only? Cause “CCP gets money from PLEX, not from ISK” mantra clearely defeated by PLEX trade amount history.

5% due to the fact that they did not develop.

And your sources show which of this PLEX was bought from CCP with real world money by Omega accounts vs what was bought buy Alpha accounts?

I didn’t know I was making any presumptions, okay, here is a “fact” for you:

Last January with one of my Alpha accounts I bought Aur from CCP with real world money to buy skins from the NES, I also bought some PLEX to sell for ISK. Although I do not personally in-game PLEX my Omega accounts, I pay subscriptions, it is well known that many Omega accounts are PLEXed by in-game grinding.

Since you have been making general statements about Alpahs and Omegas, and therefore about ALL Alphas and ALL Omegas, logically it only takes one example to disprove your point. So I have not made any “presumptions” I have merely sated the fact, that your sweeping generalization doesn’t apply to “Alphas”, but applies to “some Alphas”, maybe even “most Alphas”.

I used to play another MMO that had three payment/play options: you could play for free and try to grind to unlock more content, you could subscribe to become “V.I.P.” and unlock all the content as long as your were subscribed, or you could pay real world money to prenatally unlock pieces of game content. I, and many other players chose the 3rd option, not because we were “too cheap to pay a subscription” but just because we don’t like subscriptions or liked paying little bits when ever we wanted to. Your narrow-minded view that everyone who is willing to pay for something wants to pay a subscription, and everyone who doesn’t want to pay a subscription is a cheap free-loader, is just wrong.

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Your bio says so. :wink:

Clothing, skins are all hidden behind the paywall. All things that should be included in the subscription. It is irrelevant that they are “just” apparel.

Oh, yeah, I am. :wink:

I disagree about the “irrelevance”, I don’t consider optional window dressing as “content”. For example I wouldn’t say PoE hides anything behind a paywall, but that they offer a free game and they make money on people wanting to buy window dressing. But I don’t know that we have to agree on this.

As for those things “should be included in the subscription”, I don’t think that’s true at all, CCP never had to introduce these items, the game would be very playable without them. Your argument is that since they made them they should be included in the sub, mine is they didn’t have to make them, so I don’t care if they charge extra for them.

As for them being “hidden behind a paywall”, I would have to disagree since they are all in-game tradeable and can be bought in Jita without any real world paying. It’s just another way a player can accessorize their account or trade RL money for ISK.

I hate to break it to you but CCP still releases free vanity content for the subscription. They introduced several character portrait backgrounds for free. So, there is no reason why that shouldn’t be the case for clothing. But let us leave it at that we agree to disagree. I will not concede any millimeter from my point in this regard and neither will you, and I am not in the mood for circle jerking today.

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Nice idea except that this Alpha Micro-Injector should emit 0 SP for alpha characters that have more then 20kk SP (counting BOTH allocated and not).

Okay - I’m going to try to tackle this a different way - deleted my other reply

Business is business no matter if it is retail or software development or cleaning butts. Someone is trying to provide a service and make money doing it. And what can’t be done today will probably happen tomorrow, which is more true for software development than probably any other business.

@persphanie_mae - CCP developers have used the ‘legacy’ code excuses/reason for years. It effects everything they try to do to make EVE better. I don’t know how often you stroll through the forums - but pretty much every request in the Player Features & Ideas - EVE Online Forums would probably hit some sort of hiccup due to the age of the code or take crap loads of time to do.

From the Dev Post, “We also faced a lot of messy tech and usability issues when trying to figure out how to offer smaller portions of training time (the entire skill and training system needs a refactor which we are currently investigating).”

My call for a rewrite isn’t that different from people asking to be able to log out to the character selection screen, or that the launcher doesn’t forget our account names when we launch the launcher or any other number of player request in which CCP says it would take a lot of time to do as the current code base (a lot of which is old) is spaghetti. I’ve learned to be patient with my desire for a rewrite -

I’m just expressing my opinion that the the ‘legacy code’ or “We also faced a lot of messy tech and usability issues when trying to figure out how to offer smaller portions of training time (the entire skill and training system needs a refactor which we are currently investigating).” is becoming exhausting as an issue/excuse as it seems to be the only one left to CCP.

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I’m not so sure this is true anymore. AFAIK once CCP rip out POS code the only old un-refactored code is the corporate management stuff (we have had UI tweaks to it thats all).

I think the skill training stuff was done several years ago.

That’s just reality for those of us who write software. All code bases turn to spaghetti… and the only way you ever get to try to fix that is if you get permission to write a replacement. Nobody wants to give you months or years to fix the inner workings of an existing system and have it end up looking and working the same… just having a cleaner code base that is easier to support.

Users have to see a “new application” that looks shiny and new to think it might be worthwhile. Or they have to see a real benefit in the application they use. Nobody wants to pay for programmers to clean up code.

And yeah… I do this for a living if you can’t gather that from my general tone on the subject. Hell, I just rolled out some code that is going to further screw up the code of my company’s primary application… because I was given 2 hours to “get a fix out to the field”… and I’ll never be given the time it would take to turn that “temporary fix” into an easy to support permanent solution. Every developer that comes after me who touches that code will curse my name. But after nearly 20 years in the field… I realize that’s just how it works. You are given a result to achieve and told how long you have to achieve that result. Nobody outside of the programmers cares how it looks under the covers… then they blame you later for the crappy code when it makes it impossible to do other things that they want to do. “Why’d you code it that way?” “Because you gave me 2 hours and never let me go back to clean it up!”

Sigh… rant over.

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looks like eve is becoming a p2w game

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Well it was a pay to play game until a year ago.

People keep saying this, but no one has provided one thing that you must buy with real world money that you can’t reasonable get with in-game grinding without paying any real world money. Everything in Eve, including the subscription, can be “paid” with ISK, which can be earned with just time and grinding. No real world money required.

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I like the attribute system as is… planning ahead. The calculation of best attributes for your skill plan is an interesting exercise.

…but if you really want to rework them may I suggest flat across the board 20 points for each attribute and then introduce an injector that will increase a chosen attribute by +1 up to a max of 30 points per skill.

Obviously you would need to discourage the older, richer players maybe with an aggregate system so that level 21 you would need 1 injector, 22 you require 1+1, 23, 3 injectors etc etc. To reach level 30 you would only need a little over 50 injectors.

As attributes enable you to reach the lofty heights of capital spaceship command maybe the loss of such a could result in the loss of 1 or 2 attribute points in a manner similar to the strategic cruiser penalty. (Oh noes … Ive been blown up in my Nyx and now only have Charisma of 5, I hope no-one notices)

I would think CCP could easily price an injector at 1 months omega per level
Or… to keep in with the game meta maybe a suitably priced attribute “extractor” could be introduced to allow the sale of attributes on the market thus giving a salve to the players who worry the game is becoming “pay to win”

xox

Very well said. Eve is reminds me an old era wooden vessel which CCP keeps floating in modern age with massive patch after patch maintenance team working on ad hoc requests.

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