Often in a gate camp, there’s 1 or 2 tacklers, and a dozen or more DPS ships. Which means no, your proposal wouldn’t help with that at all. As soon as the hauler is actually tackled, he’s toast. He can’t break the tackle. The ECM burst, as we both agree, is a long shot at best. Right now, he can jam 1, maybe 2 tacklers and try to run.
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Remote sensor boosters on a target make it harder to jam
As a ECM pilot, watching your ship die when failing to jam without anything you can do about it feels bad…
ECM users have no counter to this - So - Can we make them have no effect against incoming ECM ?
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Can’t believe these ECM changes, not even Guristas like them, this is nuts.
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Sensor boosters with ECCM scripts on a target make it harder to jam
As a ECM pilot, watching your ship die when failing to jam without anything you can do about it feels bad…
ECM users have no counter to this - So - Can we make them have no effect against incoming ECM ?
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There are two versions of EVE:
- The one where CCP advertises an interactive universe that players can participate in (high-sec, low-sec and wormhole space). This is where the majority of players co-exist, eak out a living and generally pay for their subscription while being abused to no end by wardecs, ganking and obscene responses to any engagement.
- The one where CCP continually caters to the GSM-dominated CSM and null-sec. Where the majority of players rat (and bot) care-free, make ISK hand over fist and haven’t spend a dime on EVE in years.
It’s easy to see where the problem lies.
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I have to agree with Sapporo that ECM right now is one of the better balanced systems in the game. The complaints about ECM are in general never about it’s mechanical balance, but about the fact it isn’t fun/engaging gameplay and potentially leaves both parties sitting unable to do anything for 20 seconds at a time. You have acknowledged this isn’t something that can be fixed with a balance patch and requires a complete redesign, yet still want to push through a bandaid patch that doesn’t fix the problem and breaks several ECM ships entirely? That seems like a poor plan to me.
On the subject of completely redesigning ECM I’ll throw out my own hairbrained idea, feel free to hate it if you like.
ECM would be changed from an all or nothing, “Can you lock? Y/N”, to a module that hinders the target’s ability to effectively engage enemies. My suggestion would be that each successful jam breaks one randomly selected current lock. The strength of ECM modules would be significantly increased, and their cycle times significantly reduced. Now the victim is busy spending mental cycles/effort/clicks to re-aquire targets, without being completely shut down. Ships with higher sensor strength will still be harder to disrupt, but having more targets locked also diminishes the effects. Additionally you always get to fire off that first volley each time you initially lock a target if you preactivate your guns as ECM doesn’t prevent target locks, only breaks existing ones.
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As a ECM pilot, watching your ship die because the enemy drones have an auto attack feature and can kill you without anything you can do about it feels bad…
ECM users have no counter to this - So - Can we make drone attack if you tell them to
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Please stop spamming and contribute to the conversation
That’s a basic design issue. ECM is only a crutch to poor design. We need to be pressuring CCP to draw inspiration from the ww2 engineering ranks and that sort of thing. Even if unbonused.
Its not spam, these are valid points using the same argument style used to reason the changes
Ah yes, I am trying to picture half the Senate representing from a single State? Can I Call of Vote Non-Confidence.
It is an amusing irony that the creation of the CSM stemmed from CCP providing support to a singular group at the expense of all others. The circle is complete.
I would have thought that there would an actual business rule to prevent a repeat of the entire T20 fiasco. Or was QA made redundant with the Community Team?
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Let’s wait for the movie to come out before saying CCP should draw inspiration from Wonder Woman II. 
But really, ECM needs fixing, but it needs fixing in careful, clever, and inventive ways.
Instead of ‘you can’t lock’, what about reducing the maximum number of locked targets? How much could depend on skills, scripts, etc.
Base ECM is multispectrum, relatively weak, and reduces maxed targets by… 3.
Script Type 1 increases jam strength vs X sensor type, 0s it out against the other types.
Script Type 2 increases jam strength across the board, reduces max target penalty to -1.
Script Type 3 leaves jam strength alone vs X sensor type, 0s it out against other types, increases penalty to -5.
I’m not saying this is a particularly clever or inventive idea, mind you, I’m just saying it’s an idea, and right now we’re at ‘throw it at the wall and see what sticks’.
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@CSM @ CCP and other people about the balance changes - I really feel you all need to sit down and put a lot of man hours into SISI on voice comms.
Most of the chatter I read just looks like hot air as people bitch back and forth. CCP you have a history of asking for feedback and than not looking at it all and not doing it right the first time in the eyes players (not the sheeple players) This tends to lead to ■■■■■■■ up some meaningful play styles.
So stop being lazy and get on comms with the people who have knowledge in other areas, get your friends online and do things. The mass test don’t do enough to really test game changes.
The people are only this vocal because they love the universe that they play in. And it isn’t right for people to go around ■■■■■■■ it up when they don’t fully understand. If you don’t get it, then find someone who does and learn.
CCP has metrics we never see as player, and the lack of insight for the players probably also leads to mass misunderstanding.
So for ■■■■ sacks people GROW THE DUCK UP. We aren’t in kindergarten anymore.
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How about we just make them use cap charges and rate the jam strength with the size of the charge
So does this mean that ECM pilots really can’t engage with on a 1 vs. 1 scenario? At least not with ECM because it’s useless? Not sure how to use a falcon or rook if they barely have any tank as it is. Sounds like a nerf for those who can’t get around ECM. If this is so, then ECM ships are only to be used in fleets?
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It doesn’t bother you at all that in the dev blog CCP gives multiple statements they want to rebalance things, then states that instead of balance they are gutting established mechanics, with a hinted promise of revisiting in the future…?
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Max lock targets would end up either not saving the ships you are talking about being too weak. Or utterly op when on bonuses ships.
These ideas have been thrown at the wall dozens of times in previous threads and always hit the same issue of if 1 target is left it barely affects anything while 0 left is perfect and no longer even a chance to fail.
This ccp idea for ecm is actually one I haven’t seen before and does do interesting things. even if it does significantly change ecm use and tactics. But isnt immediately critically flawed as a principle.
I think it’s time we go above the heads of the peons at CCP and ask the bosses at Pearl Abyss to demolish the heavily manipulated CSM program.
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Yes
As a solo rook pilot I will say this will stop me flying it
…and as I live in a wormhole I’ll throw away the keys to the Onyx whilst I’m at it.
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This is what CCP always does. Which is why I am asking them to stop doing it and do more research.
You dig around enough in my forum history you will see me repeat myself many times on changes.
CCP needs to stop with the: micro changes and do more large bundles.
Set core rules/values for each race: weapon types, damage types, counters etc. things players can see and feel.
And then I would suggest picking one side of the sub-capital spectrum (frigate/destroyers or battleships) and making a pass on them to make sure you have what core rules/values for each race. Run these test on sisi. Once they have those ships where they want them, then ether work up or down depending on if they started with small ships or large. This way they can make a meaningful pass on all sub capitals at once while getting feed back from players would love to help them make the game better for the long hual vs the current row-boat in a hurricane change system we have now.
But then again I have been told I don’t know ■■■■ about programming and how hard it is. Just wish someone would man up and be an adult to get things done right.
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